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Add Forum to Favorites | Send Topic To a Friend | View Forum FAQ | Track this topic Page: «« 1 2 3 4 »» |
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| Sarkozy speaks out against burka |
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slayemin Member since: 2/23/2001 From: Seattle, WA, United States |
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 Posted - 6/23/2009 6:02:43 PM |
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Women in Islam Women in Catholicism What's the difference?Hmm, So when is Sarkozy going to speak out against Nuns? Because, if the west is going to talk about religious oppression of women, we should look to our own backyards. Or, am I just misinterpreting this surface message as a "valiant attempt to liberate women from oppression" when the true undercurrent is a xenophobic reaction to changing demographics and national identity? |
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owl Member since: 5/2/2001 From: Buenos Aires, Argentina |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 6:04:58 PM |
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| But nuns don't look like ninjas. And one still can tell that nun in the picture is a hottie. |
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Sirisian Member since: 10/5/2005 From: kalamazoo, MI, United States |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 6:25:06 PM |
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What's so bad about nuns? They choose that normally and dress like that. Also it's a religious dress. I doubt they wear it all the time. (Or maybe they do. I've never met a real nun.)Quote:heh. I probably shouldn't laugh. |
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ChaosEngine Member since: 6/9/2000 From: Christchurch, New Zealand |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 6:25:25 PM |
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Quote: Nuns != women in Catholicism. Catholic women are generally free to wear whatever they like. There's plenty wrong with Catholicism, but that isn't relative to this discussion. |
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LessBread Moderator Member since: 12/19/2001 From: Fresno, CA, United States |
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 Posted - 6/23/2009 6:25:33 PM |
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Quote: The difference is that the women in burkas aren't members of a religious order but ordinary women. The difference is that ordinary Catholic women, even the most devout, don't wear the habits of nuns. Only nuns wear habits - and not all nuns wear habits. |
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ViLiO GDNet+ Member since: 10/17/2003 From: Manchester |
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 Posted - 6/23/2009 6:31:02 PM |
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Quote:Sometimes (if you are lucky) ordinary women wear the slutty variety  |
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oliii GDNet+ Member since: 3/21/2003 From: Ill be back before breakfast |
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 Posted - 6/23/2009 7:25:14 PM |
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| What's next... Circumcision? I personally don't agree with that little twerp. What the government should guarantee is for women to have the right NOT to wear them and protect that right. I think he got himself into a heap of trouble, but that's probably what he was looking for in the first place. |
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Hodgman Member since: 2/14/2007 From: Melbourne, Australia |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 7:32:49 PM |
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| Wait, if I live in a household where it is believed that women can't go outside without wearing a burqa... and then the burqa is made illegal... doesn't that just mean that women aren't allowed to go outside anymore? Fail! [EDIT]Dammit, that's what I get for skipping page 2. In other words: address the root causes of oppression, not the symptoms. |
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ChaosEngine Member since: 6/9/2000 From: Christchurch, New Zealand |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 7:37:55 PM |
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Quote: Mith beat you to it, but yeah, that's another good reason against an all out ban. |
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LessBread Moderator Member since: 12/19/2001 From: Fresno, CA, United States |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 7:41:00 PM |
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Quote: I don't find anything sexy about the clothes worn by nuns. |
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owl Member since: 5/2/2001 From: Buenos Aires, Argentina |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 7:43:48 PM |
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Quote: Of course they are not. The sexy part is knowing that a woman dressing like that shouldn't be giving you a bj. capicce? :) |
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ChaosEngine Member since: 6/9/2000 From: Christchurch, New Zealand |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 7:47:08 PM |
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Quote: Me either, but apparently lots of people do. A simple google image search for "nuns" (mildy NSFW) throws up some interesting images. |
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LessBread Moderator Member since: 12/19/2001 From: Fresno, CA, United States |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 10:10:11 PM |
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Quote: Like your grandmother? You see, all the nuns I've ever met were old, like grandmothers, nothing sexy about that. The thought is actually quite a turn off. |
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trzy Member since: 12/28/2000 |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 10:15:54 PM |
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Quote: owl's affinity for nuns is clearly the result of psychological scarring from the Catholic sex abuse scandal. |
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LessBread Moderator Member since: 12/19/2001 From: Fresno, CA, United States |
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Posted - 6/23/2009 10:57:08 PM |
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| Ouch! |
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owl Member since: 5/2/2001 From: Buenos Aires, Argentina |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 7:26:44 AM |
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Quote: Your imagination needs debugging... de-granning. Oh wait, I get it. :) |
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davepermen GDNet+ Member since: 3/31/2000 From: Augst, Switzerland |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 8:28:45 AM |
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Quote: and now those women forced to wear a burka get forced to stay at home alldaylong as they are not allowed to go out => it may backfire to those women. the problem then is hidden from the public but worse for the women. i don't think a country should ever be allowed to force any clothing ban. but they should force freedom of choise, and make everyone forcing others stuff onto it (like a burka) to pay for that. make it illegal to force religious discrimination onto people if they don't agree with it. now we in switzerland talk about the same. i see all the rightwing rasists supporting it, not thinking about if it helps at all, or is fair. If that's not the help you're after then you're going to have to explain the problem better than what you have. - joanusdmentia davepermen.net |
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owl Member since: 5/2/2001 From: Buenos Aires, Argentina |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 8:51:30 AM |
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Quote: The burka is a clear expression of anti-freedom. It implies there exists a man that's so insecure about his virility that he needs to cloister his wife (who is considered that man's personal belonging/item) away from any other man. I respect barbaric medieval culture customs as long as they are performed in their respective barbaric medieval places. Forcing a woman to wear a burka in Paris, is completely out of place. You don't like occident customs? Don't go there. |
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phresnel Member since: 10/22/2008 From: Nettetal, Germany |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 9:15:04 AM |
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Quote: But what if my belief (or my own will) would dictate me to wear giant multi phallic symbols, or armory of the old roman legion, including a sharp-edged gladius (or some razor sharpened japanese tsurugi), or some animated 90's pokemon epileptic t-shirt, or some shirt that says "Hail the Pogrom"? Sorry for pushing to another extreme, but one shall never say never. |
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davepermen GDNet+ Member since: 3/31/2000 From: Augst, Switzerland |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 10:31:39 AM |
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| you should be allowed to do that and be ready for the social consequences that the society may not like it. forbidding it by law is the wrong thing. that's censorship, ban. and so no better than what the men do by forcing their women into the burka. so the country now forces them to not wear the burka. still a force, still a farce. we have to force the free-choice right. fight the problems, the roots, not the appearance. bugfixing. If that's not the help you're after then you're going to have to explain the problem better than what you have. - joanusdmentia davepermen.net |
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davepermen GDNet+ Member since: 3/31/2000 From: Augst, Switzerland |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 10:36:00 AM |
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Quote: for me, till short ago, it was more a thing of the desert. men where all in burka-style clothing most of the time, down there, too. but yes, any form of forcing something is bad. Quote: so it's bad to have the woman forced to things she doesn't like in public, but it's okay to do so at home?.... Quote: forcing here to not wear a burka if she likes is completely out of place as well. its still forcing. we had such a discussion about jews wearing their heat-style things in switzerland, and forcing them to not do it. same for turbans. and the real reason people want those rules are NOT to help those that wear it. it's their rasistic fear against other cultures. for the most part. i'm ALL for helping womens (and men, and children) that life in unfear treatments. a lot of women of today with burkas do, so i'm all for helping them. but such rules won't help any of those. If that's not the help you're after then you're going to have to explain the problem better than what you have. - joanusdmentia davepermen.net |
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Krokhin Member since: 7/16/2006 From: Moscow, Russian Federation |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 10:38:13 AM |
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Thinking about a difference,I'm always recalling this old movie ( here from ~ 6:05) |
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phresnel Member since: 10/22/2008 From: Nettetal, Germany |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 11:44:19 AM |
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Quote: Hhm, sorry to revive my example. So it's okay to wear a shirt that triggers epileptic attacks at people? I think what you basically want is anarchy, because that is what you get when you don't commit any force on people. |
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oliii GDNet+ Member since: 3/21/2003 From: Ill be back before breakfast |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 12:48:40 PM |
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| I don't find religious symbols that offensive, unless shoved to my face. And I don't see how burkas would trigger epileptic attacks... Maybe incoherent xenophobic ramblings, then hopefully leading to a fatal heart failure. "freedom-haters go home!", "Our way or the highway!", "Integrate or bugger of!". That's the message of the Front National, just echoed by that pint-sized Napoleon... So much for liberty, equality and fraternity. |
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LessBread Moderator Member since: 12/19/2001 From: Fresno, CA, United States |
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Posted - 6/24/2009 12:56:55 PM |
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Quote: They also imply that they believe that men can't be trusted to behave themselves around women. Also, in many of the societies where burkas are the norm, it's seen as a crime for young women to walk about unescorted by a male relative. |
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