I also think that the probe shot method is the simplest and the most flexible.
Sure, it takes time for the AI to calculate, but so does thinking about a shot in real life. I wouldn't be worried if it took say 5 seconds for the AI to think.
I once made an AI for a scorched earth clone. It took some 20000 probe shots in the worst case (with no early exit). Probe shooting included actual simulation of the bullet, checking with collision with the ground, and a lot of additional checks to rank each shot. collision detection was pretty much pixel color checks all along the trajectory (it was a DOS game). Getting the pixel color was dead slow on DOS and 640x480 resolution (because there has to be memory paging, since 640x480 cannot fit in the 16 bit VRAM address space).
Even with this dead slow method, it took at most 6 seconds for the AI to think.
Probe shooting even solves the complex shoot problem, in my game, AI could take pretty badass shots on bouncing border games with multiple bounces and nukes or lasers.
If you optimize the collision and simulation a bit, and use a bigger virtual delta time for the physics, or even a bit simplified physics (this also adds some error), probe shooting is feasible.
So again, for a turn based game, where the AI doesn't have to be anything real-time, I wouldn't be concerned if it took seconds for the AI to make a decision.
EDIT: maybe I'm wrong and you are using complex physics. Even so, I'd do some measurements. Probably calculating the positions after shots with the same starting conditions (same positions of balls, same angles etc), but with radically different delta times, and see how delta time affects the resulting positions of the balls.
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#3szecs
Posted 06 June 2012 - 02:46 AM
I also think that the probe shot method is the simplest and the most flexible.
Sure, it takes time for the AI to calculate, but so does thinking about a shot in real life. I wouldn't be worried if it took say 5 seconds for the AI to think.
I once made an AI for a scorched earth clone. It took some 20000 probe shots in the worst case (with no early exit). Probe shooting included actual simulation of the bullet, checking with collision with the ground, and a lot of additional checks to rank each shot. collision detection was pretty much pixel color checks all along the trajectory (it was a DOS game). Getting the pixel color was dead slow on DOS and 640x480 resolution (because there has to be memory paging, since 640x480 cannot fit in the 16 bit VRAM address space).
Even with this dead slow method, it took at most 6 seconds for the AI to think.
Probe shooting even solves the complex shoot problem, in my game, AI could take pretty badass shots on bouncing border games with multiple bounces and nukes or lasers.
If you optimize the collision and simulation a bit, and use a bigger virtual delta time for the physics, or even a bit simplified physics (this also adds some error), probe shooting is feasible.
So again, for a turn based game, where the AI doesn't have to be anything real-time, I wouldn't be concerned if it took seconds for the AI to make a decision.
Sure, it takes time for the AI to calculate, but so does thinking about a shot in real life. I wouldn't be worried if it took say 5 seconds for the AI to think.
I once made an AI for a scorched earth clone. It took some 20000 probe shots in the worst case (with no early exit). Probe shooting included actual simulation of the bullet, checking with collision with the ground, and a lot of additional checks to rank each shot. collision detection was pretty much pixel color checks all along the trajectory (it was a DOS game). Getting the pixel color was dead slow on DOS and 640x480 resolution (because there has to be memory paging, since 640x480 cannot fit in the 16 bit VRAM address space).
Even with this dead slow method, it took at most 6 seconds for the AI to think.
Probe shooting even solves the complex shoot problem, in my game, AI could take pretty badass shots on bouncing border games with multiple bounces and nukes or lasers.
If you optimize the collision and simulation a bit, and use a bigger virtual delta time for the physics, or even a bit simplified physics (this also adds some error), probe shooting is feasible.
So again, for a turn based game, where the AI doesn't have to be anything real-time, I wouldn't be concerned if it took seconds for the AI to make a decision.
#2szecs
Posted 06 June 2012 - 02:44 AM
I also think that the probe shot method is the simplest and the most flexible.
Sure, it takes time for the AI to calculate, but so does thinking about a shot in real life. I wouldn't be worried if it took say 5 seconds for the AI to think.
I once made an AI for a scorched earth clone. It took some 20000 probe shots in the worst case (with no early exit). Probe shooting included actual simulation of the bullet, checking with collision with the ground, and a lot of additional checks to rank each shot. collision detection was pretty much pixel color checks all along the trajectory (it was a DOS game). Getting the pixel color was dead slow on DOS and 640x480 resolution (because there has to be memory paging, since 640x480 cannot fit in the 16 bit VRAM address space).
Even with this dead slow method, it took at most 6 seconds for the AI to think.
Probe shooting even solves the complex shoot problem, in my game, AI could take pretty badass shots with bouncing shots and nukes or lasers.
If you optimize the collision and simulation a bit, and use a bigger virtual delta time for the physics, or even a bit simplified physics (this also adds some error), probe shooting is feasible.
So again, for a turn based game, where the AI doesn't have to be anything real-time, I wouldn't be concerned if it took seconds for the AI to make a decision.
Sure, it takes time for the AI to calculate, but so does thinking about a shot in real life. I wouldn't be worried if it took say 5 seconds for the AI to think.
I once made an AI for a scorched earth clone. It took some 20000 probe shots in the worst case (with no early exit). Probe shooting included actual simulation of the bullet, checking with collision with the ground, and a lot of additional checks to rank each shot. collision detection was pretty much pixel color checks all along the trajectory (it was a DOS game). Getting the pixel color was dead slow on DOS and 640x480 resolution (because there has to be memory paging, since 640x480 cannot fit in the 16 bit VRAM address space).
Even with this dead slow method, it took at most 6 seconds for the AI to think.
Probe shooting even solves the complex shoot problem, in my game, AI could take pretty badass shots with bouncing shots and nukes or lasers.
If you optimize the collision and simulation a bit, and use a bigger virtual delta time for the physics, or even a bit simplified physics (this also adds some error), probe shooting is feasible.
So again, for a turn based game, where the AI doesn't have to be anything real-time, I wouldn't be concerned if it took seconds for the AI to make a decision.
#1szecs
Posted 06 June 2012 - 02:41 AM
I also think that the probe shot method is the simplest and the most flexible.
Sure, it takes time for the AI to calculate, but so does thinking about a shot in real life. I wouldn't be worried if it took say 5 seconds for the AI to think.
I once made an AI for a scorched earth clone. It took some 20000 probe shots in the worst case (with no early exit). Probe shooting included actual simulation of the bullet, checking with collision with the ground, and a lot of additional checks to rank each shot. collision detection was pretty much pixel color checks all along the trajectory (it was a DOS game). Getting the pixel color was dead slow on DOS and 640x480 resolution (because there has to be memory paging, since 640x480 cannot fit in the 16 bit VRAM address space).
Even with this dead slow method, it took at most 6 seconds for the AI to think.
Probe shooting even solves the complex shoot problem, in my game, AI could take pretty badass shots with bouncing shots and nukes or lasers.
If you optimize the collision and simulation a bit, and use a bigger virtual delta time for the physics, or even a bit simplified physics, probe
So again, for a turn based game, where the AI doesn't have to be anything real-time, I wouldn't be concerned if it took seconds for the AI to make a decision.
Sure, it takes time for the AI to calculate, but so does thinking about a shot in real life. I wouldn't be worried if it took say 5 seconds for the AI to think.
I once made an AI for a scorched earth clone. It took some 20000 probe shots in the worst case (with no early exit). Probe shooting included actual simulation of the bullet, checking with collision with the ground, and a lot of additional checks to rank each shot. collision detection was pretty much pixel color checks all along the trajectory (it was a DOS game). Getting the pixel color was dead slow on DOS and 640x480 resolution (because there has to be memory paging, since 640x480 cannot fit in the 16 bit VRAM address space).
Even with this dead slow method, it took at most 6 seconds for the AI to think.
Probe shooting even solves the complex shoot problem, in my game, AI could take pretty badass shots with bouncing shots and nukes or lasers.
If you optimize the collision and simulation a bit, and use a bigger virtual delta time for the physics, or even a bit simplified physics, probe
So again, for a turn based game, where the AI doesn't have to be anything real-time, I wouldn't be concerned if it took seconds for the AI to make a decision.