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#ActualSinisterPride

Posted 28 January 2013 - 02:18 PM

This is my third post/share on Project: Alter Ego. Thank you all for the feedback so far. You've given me plenty to think about and have forced me to recognize parts which seem clear to me but lack in their explaination to others.
 
§• ɸ§
 
In this post I will speak of my thoughts on Class/Skill development which I call "The Discipline System". I will reiterate some of my design ideas/goals, explain in more detail how the class/skill system works as well as give some hints on how skill development and progress work (this will be mostly be explained in my next post "The Mastery System").
 
§• ɸ§
 
I want to lift the barrier most games place when it comes to their classes/skills.
 
Most of the time your character type/role is assigned at the beginning of a game and confined to that path for the remainder of the game. My solution to this is an open skill gaining method/system which I've named the Discipline system.
 
Every disciple is capable of utilizing all the disciplines (Melee, Subtlety and Weaving) by default. This means you can wield a melee weapon, use thrown weapons and build up energy in a "chi-like" fashion from the beginning. Initially each discipline isn't very effective and offer nothing more than the ability to use each one. Essentially you gain exp from utilizing a given discipline. After delving in a specific discipline enough skills will become discoverable/available.
 
For example, after using a melee weapon long enough you'd be able to and eventually will discover a motion which would allow you to double hit or cross slash. This motion will be considered a skill and will grant bonus damage as well as lower the delay between attacks causing them to be delivered fluidly/quickly.
 
A skill can vary from weapon to weapon in its execution. I originally planned to make weapon specific skills when the "universal skill" concept came to mind. Basically a skills mechanic will be transferable to other weapons by adapting its execution. For instance, a double hit with a sword may manifest in the form of a x-shaped cross slash. However, a club or a staffs' anatomy either won't allow or would cause this motion to be ineffective if not obsolete. Due to this I thought of ways to translate central skills instead of creating, naming and/or labeling each one for each weapon type. An example of a translation such as this would be double hit showing as a cross slash with a sword yet playing out as two hits with opposite ends of a staff.
 
The method for gaining skills will transfer over to all disciplines. How a skill is performed and what qualifies as a skill varies between each discipline.
 
Within subtlety a skill such as "quick draw" would involve readying a thrown weapon or bow and arrow, not aiming, then firing at a target directly in your line of sight. If the shot is landed it is considered a successful skill use.
 
As a weaver the process is a little harder to port over. There are two steps in any successful weave, gathering and unleashing. Each type of gather and unleash is considered a skill. A third step is possible but isn't the usual which is explained else where. (refer to the FFC system for an explanation)
 
While we're on the topic of weaving and spells/skills I'd like to address a few questions proposed by Sir WavyVirus:
 

Where/when can the player cast? Does the player need to be in combat in order to cast and gain experience?

 
Anywhere. No, not entirely the case. I'll explain when I answer your next few questions.
 

If so, are there a limited number of enemies around? Would it still be possible for a player to find a safe area and repeatedly weave a spell to gain experience? Are you ok with this? (I suppose it may be more realistic - mages probably spend long, lonely hours practicing - but is it behavior you want to encourage?). You may have covered this, but is there some scarce mana-like resource which would force the player to choose carefully which spells they cast and when?

 
Skills and spells can be executed for training purposes in all disciplines.
 
Training targets can be used but ultimately you don't have to land any of them to gain "Training Exp". Training exp will max out at 10% of the required exp to level a given skill/spell.
 
Exp while in combat will be split into two categories: Passive combat and Active combat. Passive combat is applied when your target is a living target (moving/trying to run away) but does not pose any threat/won't attack you. During passive combat you can gain exp up to 23% (13% more from the point which training exp concludes) of total required to level without having to land a spell or skill. Landing a spell/skill during passive will allow you to reach up to 50% (27% from the 23% allowed during missing) exp towards your amount required to level said skill/spell. The next 50% must be used in active combat. 25% (from the 50% reaching 75%) is awarded for missed spells and the last 25% (to cap at 100% and level up a spell/skill) must all be successfully/effectively landed during active combat.
 

I contend that spells would need to take a very long time to cast / offer very little EXP reward before players would be completely discouraged from grinding them, and instead use them where appropriate.

 

I disagree, I think you were closer/on to my proposed way of dealing with this when you said:
 

You may have covered this, but is there some scarce mana-like resource which would force the player to choose carefully which spells they cast and when?

 
Thank you for reading this post. Any feedback/input/opinions will be appreciated
 
Sin §• ɸ§

#1SinisterPride

Posted 28 January 2013 - 02:17 PM

This is my third post/share on Project: Alter Ego. Thank you all for the feedback so far. You've given me plenty to think about and have forced me to recognize parts which seem clear to me but lack in their explaination to others.
 
§• ɸ§
 
In this post I will speak of my thoughts on Class/Skill development which I call "The Discipline System". I will reiterate some of my design ideas/goals, explain in more detail how the class/skill system works as well as give some hints on how skill development and progress work (this will be mostly be explained in my next post "The Mastery System").
 
§• ɸ§
 
I want to lift the barrier most games place when it comes to their classes/skills.
 
Most of the time your character type/role is assigned at the beginning of a game and confined to that path for the remainder of the game. My solution to this is an open skill gaining method/system which I've named the Discipline system.
 
Every disciple is capable of utilizing all the disciplines (Melee, Subtlety and Weaving) by default. This means you can wield a melee weapon, use thrown weapons and build up energy in a "chi-like" fashion from the beginning. Initially each discipline isn't very effective and offer nothing more than the ability to use each one. Essentially you gain exp from utilizing a given discipline. After delving in a specific discipline enough skills will become discoverable/available.
 
For example, after using a melee weapon long enough you'd be able to and eventually will discover a motion which would allow you to double hit or cross slash. This motion will be considered a skill and will grant bonus damage as well as lower the delay between attacks causing them to be delivered fluidly/quickly.
 
A skill can vary from weapon to weapon in its execution. I originally planned to make weapon specific skills when the "universal skill" concept came to mind. Basically a skills mechanic will be transferable to other weapons by adapting its execution. For instance, a double hit with a sword may manifest in the form of a x-shaped cross slash. However, a club or a staffs' anatomy either won't allow or would cause this motion to be ineffective if not obsolete. Due to this I thought of ways to translate central skills instead of creating, naming and/or labeling each one for each weapon type. An example of a translation such as this would be double hit showing as a cross slash with a sword yet playing out as two hits with opposite ends of a staff.
 
The method for gaining skills will transfer over to all disciplines. How a skill is performed and what qualifies as a skill varies between each discipline.
 
Within subtlety a skill such as "quick draw" would involve readying a thrown weapon or bow and arrow, not aiming, then firing at a target directly in your line of sight. If the shot is landed it is considered a successful skill use.
 
As a weaver the process is a little harder to port over. There are two steps in any successful weave, gathering and unleashing. Each type of gather and unleash is considered a skill. A third step is possible but isn't the usual which is explained else where. (refer to the FFC system for an explanation)
 
While we're on the topic of weaving and spells/skills I'd like to address a few questions proposed by Sir WavyVirus:
 

Where/when can the player cast? Does the player need to be in combat in order to cast and gain experience?

 
Anywhere. No, not entirely the case. I'll explain when I answer your next few questions.
 

If so, are there a limited number of enemies around? Would it still be possible for a player to find a safe area and repeatedly weave a spell to gain experience? Are you ok with this? (I suppose it may be more realistic - mages probably spend long, lonely hours practicing - but is it behavior you want to encourage?). You may have covered this, but is there some scarce mana-like resource which would force the player to choose carefully which spells they cast and when?

 
Skills and spells can be executed for training purposes in all disciplines.
 
Training targets can be used but ultimately you don't have to land any of them to gain "Training Exp". Training exp will max out at 10% of the required exp to level a given skill/spell.
 
Exp while in combat will be split into two categories: Passive combat and Active combat. Passive combat is applied when your target is a living target (moving/trying to run away) but does not pose any threat/won't attack you. During passive combat you can gain exp up to 23% (13% more from the point which training exp concludes) of total required to level without having to land a spell or skill. Landing a spell/skill during passive will allow you to reach up to 50% (27% from the 23% allowed during missing) exp towards your amount required to level said skill/spell. The next 50% must be used in active combat. 25% (from the 50% reaching 75%) is awarded for missed spells and the last 25% (to cap at 100% and level up a spell/skill) must all be successfully/effectively landed during active combat.
 


I contend that spells would need to take a very long time to cast / offer very little EXP reward before players would be completely discouraged from grinding them, and instead use them where appropriate.

 

 
 
I disagree, I think you were closer/on to my proposed way of dealing with this when you said:
 

You may have covered this, but is there some scarce mana-like resource which would force the player to choose carefully which spells they cast and when?

 
Thank you for reading this post. Any feedback/input/opinions will be appreciated
 
Sin §• ɸ§

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