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pointful death


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#41 ahw   Members   -  Reputation: 263

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 04:12 AM

OK, first off Dwarsoft, I think you mistake Braveheart with Dragonheart in my previous post. But anyway.
I posted about this movie in another thread here, but since it fits equally well in this thread : what about Bad Lieutnant, by Abel Ferrara. From the beginning the protagonist knows that his head is wanted, and he knows death is certain. So he seeks redemption, in a desperate, dramatic way, but redemption nonetheless. And none of this lame hollywood shit (I refer to Star Wars here...)
You'd also like Trainspotting. Very interesting movie. With all the emotions of life in it. No death though, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.

The thing with purposeful death is that it also echoes as purposeful life. That the great thing in Abel Ferrara movie (Bad Lieutnant). The guy has a pointless, desperately useless life. But it's only because he is going to die in a few hours that he realises it, and decide to change that. This pressure is quite absent from games. How could you induce it. That's why I said earlier that the player should be aware that death is unavoidable. The whole point would be to do your best before you die.

any thoughts ?

ps : is it jsut me, or are you guys a bit wussies ??? I mean, what the hell is the problem with nudity in a movie. I know this is a culture thing, but even so, do you get uneasy when you look at the Venus de Milo or any other naked painting ? I jsut cant grasp how eviscerating people with a chainsaw is forbidden under 16, but seeing genitals is automatically X rated ... pfff.

HAve you ever seen Betty Blue ? I just remembered that one has a very interesting ending (I cant really tell you, it spoils all the fun). But let's say that it's really a good love story, with an attitude. And a very purposeful death at the end.

Edited by - ahw on November 17, 2000 11:16:55 AM

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#42 Anonymous Poster_Anonymous Poster_*   Guests   -  Reputation:

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 04:40 AM

In "Planescape: Torment" you are a guy that has some kind of amnesia, and every time you die you wake up again some time later (not a very long time). And the game is basically about how to break the loop and finally really die.

In "Icewind Dale" there was an NPC suicide (for the greater good). Can''t remember his name though... that priest guy at the end...






#43 Anonymous Poster_Anonymous Poster_*   Guests   -  Reputation:

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 04:56 AM

quote:

ps : is it jsut me, or are you guys a bit wussies ??? I mean, what the hell is the problem with nudity in a movie. I know this is a culture thing, but even so, do you get uneasy when you look at the Venus de Milo or any other naked painting ? I jsut cant grasp how eviscerating people with a chainsaw is forbidden under 16, but seeing genitals is automatically X rated ... pfff.
[/qoute]

I totally agree. It''s just so typically american (sorry ). In sweden there is a quite new film called "Tillsammans" (means "Together", not sure if it will be released internationally) made by Lukas Moodysson (the guy who made "Fucking Åmål", known internationally as "Show Me Love" or something like that). In that film they show genitals (both male and female) and it''s allowed for ages 11 and up.

Similarly with the danish move "Idioterne" (known as "The Idiots" in the USA) by Lars von Trier. In that you had actual sex scenes (kinda like in a porno, you know, you get to see the whole "penetration". Took me quite by surprise ). And that one wasn''t X-rated (but it probably would be in USA, or they would censor those parts)

You americans are too sensitive about stuff like that. A little sex in the movies never hurt anyone.

// Jesse (from Sweden)


#44 Anonymous Poster_Anonymous Poster_*   Guests   -  Reputation:

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 05:00 AM

From www.imdb.com about "Idioterne" ("The Idiots"):

"Certification: Argentina:18 / Chile:18 / Finland:K-16 / France:-12 / Hong Kong:III / IrelandBanned) / Italy:T / New Zealand:R18 / Norway:18 / Portugal:M/16 / Spain:18 / Sweden:15 / Switzerland:18 (canton of Geneva) / Switzerland:18 (canton of Vaud) / UK:18 / USA:R "

#45 Nazrix   Members   -  Reputation: 307

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 05:11 AM

quote:

You americans are too sensitive about stuff like that. A little sex in the movies never hurt anyone.



yeah, it really is true. It has to do w/ all the purist and christian beliefs that are so prominent. I really do think that violence could have more of an adverse affect than seeing nudity. I can see parents keeping children away from seeing actual graphic sexual acts, but nudity is far less harmful than violence especially if the nudity is only part of the story and not the main focus of the movie.




"All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be --Pink Floyd
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
Need help? Well, go FAQ yourself.

Click here to see my current project.


#46 sunandshadow   Moderators   -  Reputation: 4729

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 07:53 AM

quote:
Original post by ahw

ps : is it just me, or are you guys a bit wussies ??? I mean, what the hell is the problem with nudity in a movie. I know this is a culture thing, but even so, do you get uneasy when you look at the Venus de Milo or any other naked painting ? I jsut cant grasp how eviscerating people with a chainsaw is forbidden under 16, but seeing genitals is automatically X rated ... pfff.

Edited by - ahw on November 17, 2000 11:16:55 AM


ahw: Funny story about the hentai game I''m working on (tentative title: Date with Destiny (This is funny because in the game destiny''s a space station, not a person) ).
So I walk into the local comic swap looking for a good book on how to draw anime. I notice that there''s a section of the store where they have hentai stuff - and there''s a big sign on the wall that says you have to be 21 to go in that section. So I (being 20) can draw the stuff, publish it, but not buy a copy of my own work! Aren''t tangly legal systems funny?

#47 dwarfsoft   Moderators   -  Reputation: 1214

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 01:28 PM

You''re right ahw... But Braveheart and Dragon Heart are good movies...

Anyway... Sex in film is ok, but violence isn''t yet it is rated in reverse? Hmmm... I think maybe the christian fundamentalists have a few wires crossed

-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers'' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL
The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche

          


#48 dwarfsoft   Moderators   -  Reputation: 1214

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Posted 17 November 2000 - 01:28 PM

PS... I don''t have anything against Christians... I am one apparently

-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers'' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL
The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche

          


#49 Nazrix   Members   -  Reputation: 307

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Posted 18 November 2000 - 02:26 AM

dwarf: *LoL* There''s the strength of Christianity. People belong to it by default.


"All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be --Pink Floyd
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
Need help? Well, go FAQ yourself.

Click here to see my current project.


#50 dwarfsoft   Moderators   -  Reputation: 1214

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Posted 20 November 2000 - 12:13 AM

Not meaning to bring this off topic, but I have to say that I am ''partly christian'' by choice. Worse, I am ''partly catholic'' also by choice. The reason why I am catholic? I have already been confirmed into the catholic church. The reason why partly? I renounce any tie to the catholic church. The only reason that I am still ''partly'' is for my mothers sake. I despise the christian church for certain acts that it has carried out over the ages, particularly the catholic church.

But let me not get out of context and onto a flame battle, I think it is kind of hypocritical that christianity forced these views upon us. Especially when there are all of those reported cases of priests, um, misusing their position with ''choir boys'' (phew! I am glad I never joined the choir ). Also, I think that they don''t hate violence quite as much for the simple reason that they cause so much of it (and have caused so much over the ages).

Let this not go into petty bickering though... What can we make of all of this? Um, we could use RELIGIOUS WAR IN A GAME! Yeah! Then you could have Martyrs who will die for their cause and make their believers follow more insanely... Hehehe... that oughto be good, and the only way to win is to abolish religion and start a ''humanity'' (ie, no religion, and just a fellowship of man [and woman for that matter ]). Could be interesting, as long as it is set in the medieval period and you have castles, dragons, dwarves and elves

-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers'' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL
The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche

          


#51 kseh   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 1976

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Posted 20 November 2000 - 08:31 AM

I always figgured that religion was the beliefs you hold, not the people you hang out with.

The States does indeed produce movies and TV with complete sexual situations that are not automaticly rated X. They usually include warnings like "The following contains seens of nudity, human sexuality, and corse language. Viewer discresion is advised." They''re usually rated either 14+ or 18+ (Canadian TV rating).

I like the holy war idea. At least as an element of a game''s plot or setting. Otherwise I can''t quite picture it as the whole focus without loosing the ''pointfull death'' thing. I can just see it. An other wise noble undertaking of a controversial topic quickly becomes a hack n'' slash fest whose message is lost on a generation brought up slaughtering waves of goblins.


#52 dwarfsoft   Moderators   -  Reputation: 1214

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Posted 20 November 2000 - 11:28 AM

Maybe you could explain the goblin vs. human wars as a religious thing. Humans tried to convert goblins (as they always try to do) and the goblins told the humans to f*** off with their biassed prejudiced ways. Then, the player must stop a holy war that has been raging for many years. How do they do this? Well, they could slaughter every goblin in existence, or every human for that matter... Or they could work in some more constructive means (political insinuation)... Anyway, it is just an idea

-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers'' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL
The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche

          





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