why not hide the numbers?

nefthy · 2005-06-29T17:57:27

I recently read "Let's Put the Magic Back in Magic" by Ernest W. Adams. To sum the article up, it sugest hiding the numbers from the player. I have since thought a bit about it, but I have not come across a good answer as to why the numbers are still around, especialy in RPG's. I mean, the numbers are heritage from the pen and paper RPG's, where you need them to run the game. But even in p'n'p RPG's the can kill the game experience. Just think of players discussing how to brake a door having an supposedly ingame dialog like this Player A: "Who has the greatest Breake Doors value?" Player B: "I quess you, I only have 15%" But with computer games we can get rid of this. We can hide the numbers behind the sceens. For example, we could adjust sound volume according to how sucessfully a player is at his listen skill. Or increse an objects transparency (or contrast) if its hidden and the player messes up with his spot hidden skill. Even skill advancement kann be done behind the sceens. What comes in mind is a mechanic used by the Call Of Cthulhu p'n'p RPG. If you have sucessfully used a skill you get a chance to raise it at the end of the session. This can be translated directly to a computer RPG system, if you find a hiden object you get skill might increase making it easier to spot hidden objects. As a free bonus the characters skills adapt to the players style. If someone uses magic all the time he will become better with magic over time. Also think of the replay value if the game actualy feels differend if you play it different. But anyhow, here is my question: Are there any good reason for keeping the numbers visible to the player or showing the direct results to the player (thing AD&D CRPG's "hide in shadows failed")?

Game Design and Theory Game Design

Started by nefthy June 13, 2005 07:58 AM

342 comments, last by Ranger Meldon 18 years, 9 months ago

Anonymous

June 29, 2005 09:55 AM

Ok, I'm done for now. I'm eager to see what other things get posted in response to this question of what sucks.

~Ranger Meldon~ M.M. .:

I like your post here but I'm just feeling that perhaps this should be moved into a new thread since the topic is fairly different and this topic is getting very large?

nefthy

184

Author

June 29, 2005 10:00 AM

Quote:Original post by makeshiftwings
I agree that games that allow more actual role-playing would be fun, but I don't necessarily think they need to replace the existing form of RPGs. If there were a hardcore political intrigue, nearly combatless, role-play heavy game, I would probably buy it and enjoy it. But I'd also still want to buy stat-heavy, combat and tactics-only games as well, since I also enjoy those.

Think of it as an exercice. Take away the number. See how you can make the game interesting. Add them at the end if you still want them ther :) IMHO, numbers atleast cut down creativity, in certain parts of the development process.

As my guitar teacher once told me: "You want to play cool solos? Try playing a good solo with no more than three notes. If you can do this the rest won't be a problem"

Quote:Ranger Meldon
Ok, I'm done for now. I'm eager to see what other things get posted in response to this question of what sucks.

Isn't this a topic on its own? why not start a new thread about it?

Ranger Meldon

198

June 29, 2005 10:08 AM

Quote:I like your post here but I'm just feeling that perhaps this should be moved into a new thread since the topic is fairly different and this topic is getting very large?

Quote:Original quote by Nefthy
Isn't this a topic on its own? why not start a new thread about it?

I suppose I could. It just seemed highly related, because you can't fully figure out how to avoid unnecessary numbers in games unless you understand in what situations it really sucked to have numbers or in what ways numbers were used badly. But very well. Fourteen pages is getting rather excessive.

~Ranger Meldon~ M.M. .:

[Edited by - Ranger Meldon on June 29, 2005 10:08:23 AM]

~Ranger Meldon~ M.M. .:

Ranger Meldon

198

June 29, 2005 05:57 PM

Ok, I created a new thread here.

Check it out if you'd like to contribute your own ideas and experiences.

~Ranger Meldon~ M.M. .:

[Edited by - Ranger Meldon on July 13, 2005 5:57:06 PM]

~Ranger Meldon~ M.M. .:

why not hide the numbers?

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why not hide the numbers?

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