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#501 Anonymous Poster_Anonymous Poster_*   Guests   -  Reputation:

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Posted 24 December 2001 - 06:56 AM

i hate microsoft and all its products.BUT i just love the games on pc.:-<,
actually i just wanted to be one to post the 500th post. :->

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#502 Anonymous Poster_Anonymous Poster_*   Guests   -  Reputation:

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Posted 04 January 2002 - 04:59 AM

Yeah i heard on telly in UK that only 20% of people know how to set the time for record and even set the clock... :p

#503 shurcool   Members   -  Reputation: 439

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Posted 04 January 2002 - 05:31 AM

i agree with the second post by Null And Void a lot. but there''s a simple solution to all this:

USE LINUX

the only problem with linux is that there''s a LOT more software written 4 win. as soon as they make a free (or cheap) emulator, that emulates all .exe''s i need, i''ll switch to linux completely. othervise, install them both. :D and when more people switch to linux, more companies will make games/software for linux.

there r rumours that "linux is really advanced, and it''s hard to use. i''ll never be able 2 install it...". THAT IS SO NOT TRUE!!! linux is advanced, and there is a lot of stuff u can do, that u can''t on win, but that doesn''t make it harder. for everyday needs of word processing, etc. and etc. u don''t need to be an advanced user! that''s my opinion, so don''t flame. thanks.

thanks,
shurcool

#504 cowhand214   Members   -  Reputation: 122

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Posted 05 January 2002 - 04:25 PM

Hi all.
My stepdad got us a new computer for Christmas and it''s running XP. I just wanted to say that it''s not SO bad but there are so many wizards and ''help'' things that I can''t figure out how to do stuff anymore! It seems xp hides a lot of stuff and the screen is so "busy" visually that sometimes it''s hard to find stuff.

On the plus side I have a very nice flat screen monitor!

BQ

#505 shakazed   Members   -  Reputation: 138

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Posted 05 January 2002 - 10:52 PM

Well for one. XP sux!

<>

#506 Lifepower   Members   -  Reputation: 118

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Posted 07 January 2002 - 01:38 PM

People, you're messed up here with non-proven ideas and misunderstood and wrong information (at least in first three pages of this thread).

What's very TRUE is: only THAT OS is good, WHICH you know better. Otherwise it's BAD OS, but ONLY for YOU. Try to think that way - you got a pen and a pencil. You've always been using the pen for your personal reasons (it goes smoother, it's more visible, more comfortable, etc). Some other person might prefer pencil (can be easily cleaned, less weight, etc, etc). That fact tells you that pen is good for YOU and pencil is good for another person and it's not intelligent to say "it sux" just because it does for you.

WinXP is basically same as W2k (NT 5.0), it just have beatiful interfaces (u can switch to old ones, though, if u don't have 3D video card). As any Win NT it can be configured to use less resources (disable some services).
I have WinXP Pro with Office XP and neither one *FORCES* (just ask, where I usually answer "no") me to register it. WinXP Home edition actually needs you to register it but after knowing what it is about I think... this OS is actually WORTH its price. Of course, for very poor people like me (), you can always download some Warez version off the internet or get it from your friend who downloaded it and that's only for Home use (in your office if you're good - can always argue with ur boss to get $$$ for system upgrade or ask your friend who is better talking to ppl than u). With all that, I think u got my point... Only stupid people lose, but again... if in doubt, ask your neighbor

Personally:
1) I dislike ppl who say Win9x / Me is good and W2k / XP (they usually don't know NT 4.0) suck... these ppl are considered fools by me (sorry 'bout that)
2) I don't use Linux (though I have it installed) 'cuz for what I do (programming, 3D modelling) it's pretty much useless. Besides it takes much more resources (right after install... of course u can configure it) than any Windows system and as I've seen it - it's very unstable and you have to manage processes from console (after its shell has crashed again). Anyway, it's good and unique for network servers (sorry M$... u have to work a lot harder on that...) And this GNU license "chaos" of Linux makes it even more messed up...
3) Of course I miss old DOS days, where I (as probably any programmer in these times) felt like a god of the whole system. Oh well... if I could just get back in time and never return
Still... I think M$ is doing ok to improve its products (XP actually IS changed from previous Windoze versions).

Many people hate Microsoft 'cuz it's somehow monopolistic, etc. For that, I agree with M$, 'cuz I don't have a heart of capitalist and I believe the Power must be at SINGLE person to prevent chaos.

Again, sorry if I offended somebody with what I said. That's only my opinion and it's actually normal if there'll be hundreds of ppl disagreeing with me. We, people, tend to get chaotic, unless someone (who's the least chaotic) guide us. That's the reason of differences in opinions.

- Lifepower




Edited by - Lifepower on January 7, 2002 8:58:52 PM

#507 Null and Void   Moderators   -  Reputation: 1087

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Posted 07 January 2002 - 02:22 PM

I hate to reply to this thread anymore, but...

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
People, you''re messed up here with non-proven ideas and misunderstood and wrong information (at least in first three pages of this thread).

Check the date on those posts. That was a long time ago. More is now understood. I''m not arguing with your second paragraph, it seems rational. About your third and fourth: Warez is bad.

Now I get to return the claim that you''re inaccurate:
quote:
Original post by Lifepower
I don''t use Linux (though I have it installed) ''cuz for what I do (programming, 3D modelling) it''s pretty much useless.

Due to your lack of specification, you''re wrong. I think Linux (like all Unixes) is one of the best resources any programmer has. After I became used to using Linux my ability to write code has become much faster due to the true integration of the command line. I''m not going to argue your point about 3D modeling; I''m not an artist, so I''m not experienced enough to evaluate it honestly.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
Besides it takes much more resources (right after install... of course u can configure it) than any Windows system and as I''ve seen it...

I bet you don''t know how to judge the resources. You tried using "top" didn''t you? The memory it reports used and free is not what you''re thinking it is.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
- it''s very unstable and you have to manage processes from console (after its shell has crashed again).

It isn''t unstable. Linux''s stability is one of its huge perks! I''ve never had Linux lock up (I only run stable kernel releases though). I''ve had X lock up, sure; but that''s not Linux. Linux is still running in the background (go to another computer and telnet to your computer, if you''re running telnetd you''ll be able to connect readily). If you don''t choose to manage processes from X, then that''s your problem. There are numerous GUI replacements for "ps" (probably with the functionality of "grep" built in as well).

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
And this GNU license "chaos" of Linux makes it even more messed up...

Firstly, there is more than one GNU license. Secondly, it doesn''t make anything chaotic. All it does is protect the copyright of any source code released under it. You can''t steal their code, but you can look at it and use it. How''s that any worse than closed source? If anything, it must be better. It encompasses all the rights closed source gives you, but adds to them.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
I think M$ is doing ok to improve its products (XP actually IS changed from previous Windoze versions).

Maybe so, but it''s licensing scheme is the first step towards the abyss.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
Many people hate Microsoft ''cuz it''s somehow monopolistic, etc. For that, I agree with M$, ''cuz I don''t have a heart of capitalist and I believe the Power must be at SINGLE person to prevent chaos.

I''m sure you''d love to live in a corrupted communist republic then. How about a monarchy with a tyrant for a leader? Sounds good to me.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
Again, sorry if I offended somebody with what I said. That''s only my opinion and it''s actually normal if there''ll be hundreds of ppl disagreeing with me.

No, that''s not your opinion. You spoke many things as if they were facts. Rephrasing your statements would make you sound much more reasonable. Although, Lifepower, I do agree that we should agree to disagree; as long as you don''t skew reality.

[Resist Windows XP''s Invasive Production Activation Technology!]

#508 Anonymous Poster_Anonymous Poster_*   Guests   -  Reputation:

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Posted 07 January 2002 - 02:29 PM

woah
this is getting big


#509 Anonymous Poster_Anonymous Poster_*   Guests   -  Reputation:

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Posted 07 January 2002 - 02:29 PM

woah
this is getting big


#510 abdulla   Members   -  Reputation: 164

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Posted 07 January 2002 - 02:36 PM

my personal experience is that windows xp does something very odd at shutdown, i had an xfs bootdisk in floppy drive (i was having problems with my xfs partition) on shutdown, windows read the floppy and wrote to it so i couldn''t boot from the floppy which fucked me over, i swear that has to have some anti-competitive complication

#511 abdulla   Members   -  Reputation: 164

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Posted 07 January 2002 - 02:39 PM

if your an artist you SHOULD know that linux is one of THE best platforms for modelling, maya or renderman anyone? sigh...

#512 executor_2k2   Members   -  Reputation: 122

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Posted 07 January 2002 - 05:23 PM

I got the answer to all your problems. GET LINUX! The only way to get Microsoft to advocate the throne is for the consumer to adopt a better operating system, ala *nix.

#513 Arild Fines   Members   -  Reputation: 968

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Posted 08 January 2002 - 12:04 AM

quote:
Original post by executor_2k2
I got the answer to all your problems. GET LINUX!

You must be a person with extremely few problems in this world. I envy you your simple existence.



Fantastic doctrines (like Christianity or Islam or Marxism or Microsoft-bashing) require unanimity of belief. One dissenter casts doubt on the creed of millions. Thus the fear and hate; thus the torture chamber, the iron stake, the gallows, the labor camp, the psychiatric ward - Edward Abbey

#514 Lifepower   Members   -  Reputation: 118

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Posted 08 January 2002 - 04:31 AM

Talking about opinions: if I somehow sound bad: well, that''s YOUR problem - don''t read, if u don''t like it. democracy, eh?

I see that you don''t notice arguments so there''s no point trying to prove anything here.

2 Null and Void:

1) "Linux (like all Unixes) is one of the best resources any programmer has"
I disagree... It has MORE resources than any other OS has, but not the BEST... "BEST" is a *BIG* topic to discuss...

2) "I bet you don''t know how to judge the resources."
And how do you know? I''ve been programming for twelve years now and have been through M$ DOS 3.0, 5.0, 6.0, 6.1, 6.2, 6.22, Win3.1, 3.11, 95, 98, 98SE, NT4, NT5 / W2k, XP. I''ve also worked on OS/2, openBSD and was working for half year on AIX4 without any graphics shell at all. On Hardware I''ve been through old 8086/88 till my newest P3. Even though DID I offend you directly now or before? If not then STFU... Usually I''m pretty friendly but I hate when someone questions my ability to judge.
The memory is NOT the only resource you have to judge anyway...

3) Linux''s stability is one of its huge perks! I''ve never had Linux lock up (I only run stable kernel releases though).
Oh... you only run stable kernel releases... now count how many releases are there... and why don''t you explain everybody how''s the process of updating your kernel? gcc? how long it takes on P2 CPU? Anyway, this topic is too large to discuss... there''re major sites about Unix Security and Stability
4) My greatest complain to GNU general public license (which is APPLIED to MOST of FREE of Linux compilers) citating:
a) "You may copy and distribute verbatim copies of the Program''s source code as you receive it, in any medium..."
b) "You may modify your copy or copies of the Program or any portion of it, thus forming a work based on the Program, and copy and distribute such modifications or work under the terms of Section 1 above..."
In other words, modify however u want it and distribute it... that''s what I call total chaos...
5) "XP licensing scheme is the first step towards the abyss."
Oh yeah? You know, you can see it from other perspective... What if M$ can think YOUR way: "because these @^$%#$ don''t respect us and our products, they''ll PAY DEARLY to continue using our services or #&%^$". I''m just exagerating & eronizing stuff so u get my point
6) "You spoke many things as if they were facts".
That''s how you interpret me.
7) "we should agree to disagree; as long as you don''t skew reality."
am I?..

2 other ppl:

1) "I got the answer to all your problems. GET LINUX!"
I got a better solution to all your problems in your live... don''t live! eh?

2)"if your an artist you SHOULD know that linux is one of THE best platforms for modelling, maya or renderman anyone? sigh..."
3D Studio Max for Linux anyone? Sorry Abdulla, I don''t have Maya =(

3) "my personal experience is that windows xp does something very odd at shutdown, i had an xfs bootdisk in floppy drive (i was having problems with my xfs partition) on shutdown, windows read the floppy and wrote to it so i couldn''t boot from the floppy which fucked me over, i swear that has to have some anti-competitive complication "
err... I once remember having Win98 mess up my HFS disk on install... that''s how it worked... WinXP lives ok and well with my current Linux distro... what really bothers me is that the big difference in documentation in WinXP and Linux is that in Linux you''ll read everywhere: "M$ Sux, use Linux!!!", especially when they speak about missing features in Linux (like font antialiasing, which isn''t really that hard to implement, even for bitmap fonts!).

4) "It seems xp hides a lot of stuff and the screen is so ''busy'' visually that sometimes it''s hard to find stuff."
You can "unhide" what u need. There''re options for that. WinXP made for maximum productivity so u don''t get messed up with unneeded stuff (unlike Linux btw...)

5) "i use win me? looks shit, does shit, is shit, everybody knows it! i prefer macos, simple an stable! my question about win is: why cant they just remove all the bugs and make their system more performant! if my screen had 16 colors i were happy because there were no resource usage!"
WinME is same as Win98SE, just with different logo and hellish System Restore feature. I believe it''s no good...
there''s no bug-free softare still and I think Windoze doesn''t have that many bugs... 16 colors?! oh man... I remember when one day I figured out 15/16-bit video modes... was thinking: "damn! 65536-color palette is BIG!"... now even getting back to 8-bit video mode sounds a VERY BAD idea...

I hope everybody will manage to flame me... and that''s ok. I might be wrong with some stuff and that''s why the discussions are for - to figure out the wrong.

With respect to everybody
- Lifepower

#515 Null and Void   Moderators   -  Reputation: 1087

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Posted 08 January 2002 - 10:22 AM

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
I see that you don''t notice arguments so there''s no point trying to prove anything here.

What arguments? All I saw and commented on was opinion. Most of the factual points you made I didn''t disagree with.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
I disagree... It has MORE resources than any other OS has, but not the BEST... "BEST" is a *BIG* topic to discuss...

Yes, I stated that as both an opinion and an example. You claimed that Linux was (to paraphrase) "useless for programming." It''s quite obviously useful for me. Notice the ''specification'' sentence.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
I''ve also worked on OS/2, openBSD and was working for half year on AIX4 without any graphics shell at all. On Hardware I''ve been through old 8086/88 till my newest P3.

The experience in Windows based OS''s is somewhat irrelevent in interpretting resource readings in unixes. However, I''ll refrain from commenting any more until I have specific examples of the claimed waste of resources that I can display problems with.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
Even though DID I offend you directly now or before? If not then STFU... Usually I''m pretty friendly but I hate when someone questions my ability to judge.

I can see how what I said could be seen as insulting. My apologies.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
The memory is NOT the only resource you have to judge anyway...

Yes, but it''s the one most commonly refered to.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
Oh... you only run stable kernel releases... now count how many releases are there... and why don''t you explain everybody how''s the process of updating your kernel?

Sure. Go to kernel.org and download the source code (pick one with an even middle version number). Uncompress and untar it, then run "make xconfig" (or "make menuconfig" if you want to use the command line). I personally copy the settings from my old kernel configuration to the new one, and update anything needing it. Then run "make dep" to make all of the dependencies. Then run "make bzImage", then "make modules", then "make modules_install". Now copy arch/i386/boot/bzImage (change depending on your CPU architecture) to a good location. Now just update /etc/lilo.conf and run lilo.

I don''t see how that''s hard to do if you follow the instructions in the README (The first time I did, step by step, never having done it before; and it worked ). Now, was this a test of my ability or a statement about Linux ?

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
How long it takes on P2 CPU? Anyway, this topic is too large to discuss...

It doesn''t take much time on my older Athlon (it''s only older because I got ripped off by the people I bought it from , I''d asked for a much higher clock speed than I was given, oh well ) to recompile the kernel (I''ve done it more than 10 times to mess with features). Second sentence: Obviously .

I still don''t see your problem with the GPL. It doesn''t hurt you any, just don''t use the personalized versions that may be out there. I really don''t understand your response to my XP license statement, sorry.

quote:
Original post by Lifepower
am I?..

Are you? I''m not claiming that you were, I was merely infering it for the effect it''d have on what you say from then on.

BTW: I''m never trying to flame you (although I think you were refering to some of the other people you chose to respond to ).

[Resist Windows XP''s Invasive Production Activation Technology!]

#516 Facehat   Members   -  Reputation: 696

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Posted 08 January 2002 - 10:39 AM

I think this thread has run it''s course, so I''m going to close it (as I probably should''ve long ago). There are plenty of resources on WinXP if you''re still curious about it, or you could just review the other 26 pages where it''s probably been discussed to death .

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AIM: IanWinsAgain ICQ: 60635592 TIM: FaceHat
FaceHat Software -- Wear the hat.





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