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Sword fighting in games?


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#1 d000hg   Members   -  Reputation: 750

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Posted 17 February 2008 - 11:56 PM

I've never seen a fast-paced action game where you fight using a sword. I know many RPGs have swords but are they ever more than "click to swing sword"? We have both fighting games and FPS type games but I've never seen one that used a sword in any non-trivial way, like Doom's chainsaw. Are there any games which use swords in some proper sword-fight, where you can parry and so on? Were there any which were good?

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#2 Kylotan   Moderators   -  Reputation: 3338

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 12:08 AM

Wasn't Die By The Sword one such game?

Also, indie game Determinance.

#3 d000hg   Members   -  Reputation: 750

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 12:47 AM

Quote:
Original post by Kylotan
Also, indie game Determinance.
Yeah, that's the kind of thing I was thinking, roughly.



#4 Buster2000   Members   -  Reputation: 1664

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 01:31 AM

I always thought the sword fighting in Gunz Online was fun

#5 stonemetal   Members   -  Reputation: 288

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 01:47 AM

Bushido blade was really cool. Weapons fighting with a somewhat realistic damage model.

#6 Ender1618   Members   -  Reputation: 242

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 06:20 AM

Don't forget Jedi Academy!!! You could essentially direct where the strike or block was going to hit.

#7 mrbastard   Members   -  Reputation: 1573

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 06:27 AM

Die By The Sword almost proved that first person sword fighting with 'realistic' controls aren't fun ;¬) It certainly convinced me of it at the time.

Bushido Blade was a great game.

Oblivion's combat was quite fun and certainly more realtime than most RPGs.

What about the Soulblade / SoulCalibur series?

#8 Almonsin   Members   -  Reputation: 180

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 06:54 AM

I really liked fighting with a sword in Prince of Persia I & II, but I'm not sure it's what you want.

#9 Rattenhirn   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 1750

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 09:49 AM

Rune

#10 RyanG   Members   -  Reputation: 122

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 10:25 AM

Morrowind and Oblivion are like that, but they still adhere to your character's stats.

#11 Jerky   Members   -  Reputation: 277

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 11:07 AM

Quote:
Original post by mrbastard
Die By The Sword almost proved that first person sword fighting with 'realistic' controls aren't fun ;¬) It certainly convinced me of it at the time.

It comes down to your own preference, I guess. I still have a copy of DBTS right here, and I remember loving it. A game that I think did it better, but wasnt totally mouse-based, was Severence(aka Blade of Darkness). Both those two cemented it for me, which is why I am designing in some minor twitch-based combat into my project.

With some tweaking, you can get Blade of Darkness to play on WinXP with a modern graphics card, you should check it out. In my opinion, it was highly underrated.
Erik Briggs (Jerky)Project Manager - Project Wishhttp://www.projectwish.comMy Blog

#12 Kest   Members   -  Reputation: 547

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 11:21 AM

Mount&Blade. Best video game sword fighting I've ever experienced.

#13 Jessebalsom   Members   -  Reputation: 122

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 12:22 PM

Are we talking 3rd/1st person? There are a huge amount of titles in which you can hack/slash/stab/block. Dime a dozen. Almost every game features a sword somewhere....

When it comes to realistic sword fight development, we should ask "what control system is most intuitive to be swinging the sword with?"

Die By The Sword had huge potential, with its VISM system, heavy use of physics, and inverse kinematics. However, the r.s.i. inflicting mouse/keyboard combo turned a lot of players off.

Consider the potential if this games controls were mapped to a Wiimote+Nunchuck!

We could potentially control our swords dynamically, in full 3D space. Cant wait to belt a baddie with the flat side of my sword to stun him, or twist the blade in thier gut for the finishing blow...

Control systems are what restrict us from feeling the immersion of potentially "dynamic" sword fights.

In other words - Bring on DBTS for Wii!

#14 Jerky   Members   -  Reputation: 277

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 04:09 PM

Quote:
Original post by Jessebalsom
Die By The Sword had huge potential, with its VISM system, heavy use of physics, and inverse kinematics. However, the r.s.i. inflicting mouse/keyboard combo turned a lot of players off.

Consider the potential if this games controls were mapped to a Wiimote+Nunchuck!

We could potentially control our swords dynamically, in full 3D space. Cant wait to belt a baddie with the flat side of my sword to stun him, or twist the blade in thier gut for the finishing blow...

Control systems are what restrict us from feeling the immersion of potentially "dynamic" sword fights.

In other words - Bring on DBTS for Wii!


Too late:
Die by the Sword - Wiimote & Nunchuk

I've just reinstalled my copy of DBTS and then found that video. I just setup my wiimote, and will report back if it makes it any better.
Erik Briggs (Jerky)Project Manager - Project Wishhttp://www.projectwish.comMy Blog

#15 PlayfulPuppy   Members   -  Reputation: 419

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 04:15 PM

Why in gods name hasn't Zelda come up yet?

All of the 3D zeldas had what I'd call perfect sword controls; that fine point between believable, responsive and fun.

#16 Funkymunky   Members   -  Reputation: 641

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 05:41 AM

couple of throwbacks for the NES:

pirates!
robin hood: prince of thieves.

#17 Jerky   Members   -  Reputation: 277

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 08:16 AM

Got my wiimote working with DBTS last night and it was pretty darn fun. I had totally forgotten that DBTS had an move editor, which is something I have been designing recently. It was good to see it in action to know what I can improve upon.

I do have to say, it is definitely a good idea to go back and play old games that have ideas you want to see in action, even if they are only slightly similar. These can help you refine your new idea in ways that you wouldn't have foreseen.

About the games not mentioned, I was going to edit my post and add Mount and Blade, but saw someone had already mentioned it. I can't believe we all forgot to mention Zelda though ;). That should be toward the top of the list for interactive combat.
Erik Briggs (Jerky)Project Manager - Project Wishhttp://www.projectwish.comMy Blog

#18 dublindan   Members   -  Reputation: 457

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Posted 21 February 2008 - 08:34 AM

What about the Tenchu series. They had decent sword fighting.

#19 Rybis   Members   -  Reputation: 109

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Posted 21 February 2008 - 09:54 AM

I also want to make a sword game but am unsure of what control method to use.

#20 Elhrrah   Members   -  Reputation: 148

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Posted 21 February 2008 - 11:47 AM

The real question is how exactly you want to be "realistic" with your combat. With current technology there are concessions to be made.
You could, for example, use the forms of Tower Fechtbuch and give your self a historically accurate combat system, for a price. You would have to limit the controls to the forms, and because of the nature of the imputes systems of today, you would be pretty much limited to the strategic side of it.
It would be great for singular combat or player versus player. But it would lack, by necessity the elements that draw players to games such as Prince of Persia, or Oblivion.
Another point to be made is the fact that realistic is not always "fun" to the average player. For instance there is edge bashing, blade to blade full on collision, or static blocking. These things are common parts of the gaming experience, they are also dead wrong. But the issue rises in how to go around that factor whilst retaining real time play. The fact remains that it can be simply more entertaining to bend the rules a bit, and allow such matters, for the simple fact that the game play is fun.
Combine all that is stated above with one additional factor. Numbers. How many times have you played a game where your death toll tops three digits? Would the average gamer enjoy having to fight enemies one at a time? While I personally would enjoy that mechanic, it is not the one that a player would seek when buying a combat game.





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