80 replies to this topic

[MaulingMonkey]

Funny you should mention python

Disregarding the irony of a developer depending on Python 2.x complaining about distros are shipping old versions, why not simply put Python 2.6 as a dependency and explicitly specify #!/usr/bin/python2.6 rather than #!/usr/bin/python as the first line of any executable script?

Oh, sure, you can hand pick a specific dependency revision and add the ability to compile it into your toolchain -- maybe even check it into your main repository for outright OCD levels of control.

That this kind of thing is necessary, however, defeats much of the purpose of having a central repository in the first place I'd argue, however, and certainly any convenience advantages of repositories over "downloading from websites". Don't get me wrong, the idea is great -- it's just that depending on a horde of (unpaid?) volunteers to keep all the relevant packages up to date and working cleanly, including for the "less common use cases" (such as multiple versions side by side), can add... significant delays and more.

(Also, complaining about incompatible "broken" Python versions when your application is written in Ruby, a language with no official specification, seems... odd.)

Not too odd when you think about it. Python's been a bit more willing to aggressively improve (and in doing so, break backwards comparability) in their language. Just because Ruby lacks a spec doesn't mean it's less stable -- which is the main compounding factor for these matters, making version picking more important.

In fact, there is such a guarantee. I don't know how they do it in RPM land

Presumably using mechanisms such as "alternatives" as mentioned in the article, which according to TFA horribly breaks itself when upgrading python on a number of systems?

Don't get me wrong, Linux is a pretty cool guy, eh powers servers and doesn't afraid of anything -- and I guess the OP might be able to better lock it down so his wife can't install the latest round of facebook trojans since it "doesn't have viruses" (heh). And I guess it works as one method to install uninstall OEM crap (conveniently ignoring that installing windows properly does this too).

Even some of the linux users can be insightful. Unfortunately, this thread doesn't seem to be -- you're seriously trying to argue for linux on backwards compatibility grounds? Try fiddling with window's comparability options next time. Meanwhile, WineHQ calls this atrocious counter strike comparability "platinum". When it crashes and makes entire program features unusable, that's "silver". Hilarious.

[MrDaaark]

See, I told you. Linux makes for crankiness!

[mikeman]

The funny thing about people like MikeP is that they genuinely think they're intelligent. Sucks to be them in a decade or so, when they realize they're actually not.

Yeah, I somewhat doubt that's going to be the case...

You're right I guess. Some people like to delude themselves. Oh well...

[phantom]

You're right I guess. Some people like to delude themselves. Oh well...

oh dear god I'm drowing in the irony!

help....!

*glub*

[mikeman]

lol, yeah I man, I totally didn't see that coming! Nicely done

See what I mean about thinking you're intelligent?

Kudos!

[Aardvajk]

Interesting. I vouch the opinion to a respected member of this site that something he posted was, in my humble opinion, "a bit harsh" and a bunch of lounge lizards who, from their posting history, don't actually seem to be doing anything productive, wade in on the behalf of someone who really doesn't require their input and help the topic descend into purile nonsense.

Do you not have anything better to do? Like actually doing some programming or something? Man, the fricking lounge.

[phantom]

You can tell how productive someone is via their posting history? wut? o.O

[AndrewBC]

This thread was purile nonsense from the very beginning.

And no, it's the weekend, I'm sitting here in a house with no furniture at all, barely working internet over a tethered cellphone, and no comfortable position in which to focus long enough to code, no tech/hobby related meetups this weekend, and no friends free to go do something with. I quite literally have nothing better to do. Do you have something else to entertain you up on that vaporous high horse?

[Aardvajk]

You can tell how productive someone is via their posting history? wut? o.O

Well, call me old fashioned for caring about GDNet but posting history used to be a good indication of actual contribution to GDNet rather that lizard-level rambling. Clearly I'm out of date.

[phantom]

Yes, but 'posting' is hardly 'productive'...

[Aardvajk]

Do you have something else to entertain you up on that vaporous high horse?

It appears that by making what I feel was a valid, calm and reasonable objection to a post, I have now become the target. I'm quite okay with this although it does seem to me to detract from the point I was trying to make.

AndrewBC - are you of the opinion that objecting to someone being unfair counts as vapourous high-horsedness? What, in your esteemed option, doesn't count as vaporous high-horsedness?

[AndrewBC]

Your snark is also amusing.

[Aardvajk]

Your snark is also amusing.

Sorry, could you clarify what you mean? I'm afraid that putting a smiley at the end of a sentence doesn't actually mean a great deal to me.

[AndrewBC]

It's in reply to the same thing which I directed my vaporous high horse line. That you would bring up the tired "Don't you have anything better to do than participate in this conversation with me!?" as if you were somehow above such a judgement. Further snark based on making assumptions of usefulness of a person based on your very thorough personal review in the name of caring about the community is also directed to by my snark comment.

Don't get me wrong, though. I'm glad you care enough about the community to contribute such snark.

Smiley faces are purely for the sake of the women. Women love smiley faces.

[jtagge75]

Oh come on. "Maybe she wouldn't bother sticking around" was an "honest commentary"? Whatever. That's trolling of the highest degree. All because he made a like-Ubunty thread?

The funny thing about people like MikeP is that they genuinely think they're intelligent. Sucks to be them in a decade or so, when they realize they're actually not.

He is intelligent enough to be one of the main programmers behind a technology that put the final nail in the coffin of Managed DirectX (though it was pretty zombified before SlimDX came out) and is used by professional game studios. I'm sure you've done something equally impressive to warrant such an opinion of him that you would like to share with the world.

Interesting. I vouch the opinion to a respected member of this site that something he posted was, in my humble opinion, "a bit harsh" and a bunch of lounge lizards who, from their posting history, don't actually seem to be doing anything productive, wade in on the behalf of someone who really doesn't require their input and help the topic descend into purile nonsense.

Do you not have anything better to do? Like actually doing some programming or something? Man, the fricking lounge.

Trolling on an internet forum doesn't mean you can't be productive. I enjoy stirring the pot on the forums I frequent and my job pays me stacks of cash every week because I'm so productive at what I do.

And to be honest, I don't think there was any malice behind what he said. If memory servers he has been vocal about the lack of a rating system and being able to punish people that post comments like that. I think he is just reinforcing the point. And of course the OP should have realized the topic would have turned into a flame war in the first place.

Finally, I think people need to stop getting so butthurt about stuff like this. Its the internet, people post crap because they can (I know I do). If you don't like it then get over it and walk away. Its not like a couple of posts telling the guy he is bad is going to make him stop posting things like that. I do often wonder if people are just trying to be the morality police to make themselves feel better about their own situation.

[Mike.Popoloski]

OK guys, I think that's enough now. My original post was basically a joke that may or may not have had a kernel of truth to it (as the best jokes always do). Too harsh? Maybe.

Anyway, the thread has run its course. It was amusing at first but now it's just pointless bickering. I appreciate both the people who stood up for me as well as those who voiced their displeasure. Discord is what makes life fun.

[phantom]

Discord is what makes life fun.

That and caffine and sugar highs... mmmmmm sugar highs...

[way2lazy2care]

Discord is what makes life fun.

That and caffine and sugar highs... mmmmmm sugar highs...

all of these things are so much better than alcohol...

[valderman]

Funny you should mention python

Disregarding the irony of a developer depending on Python 2.x complaining about distros are shipping old versions, why not simply put Python 2.6 as a dependency and explicitly specify #!/usr/bin/python2.6 rather than #!/usr/bin/python as the first line of any executable script?

Oh, sure, you can hand pick a specific dependency revision and add the ability to compile it into your toolchain -- maybe even check it into your main repository for outright OCD levels of control.

That this kind of thing is necessary, however, defeats much of the purpose of having a central repository in the first place I'd argue, however, and certainly any convenience advantages of repositories over "downloading from websites". Don't get me wrong, the idea is great -- it's just that depending on a horde of (unpaid?) volunteers to keep all the relevant packages up to date and working cleanly, including for the "less common use cases" (such as multiple versions side by side), can add... significant delays and more.

Agreed.

(Also, complaining about incompatible "broken" Python versions when your application is written in Ruby, a language with no official specification, seems... odd.)

Not too odd when you think about it. Python's been a bit more willing to aggressively improve (and in doing so, break backwards comparability) in their language. Just because Ruby lacks a spec doesn't mean it's less stable -- which is the main compounding factor for these matters, making version picking more important.

I'm no Ruby user myself, but I've heard Ruby people complaining not only that different implementations have different semantics, but also that different _actively developed_ versions of the reference implementation differ in their semantics, that doesn't sound very stable to me.

Even some of the linux users can be insightful. Unfortunately, this thread doesn't seem to be -- you're seriously trying to argue for linux on backwards compatibility grounds?

No, definitely not; I'm trying to argue against HURR DURR RETARD LUNIX DOOD SUX LOLZ. Linux has its shortcomings, but that's no reason to be a jackass towards someone just because he expresses a preference.

Try fiddling with window's comparability options next time.

I've spent countless hours doing just that, and trust me, there are a lot of applications that flat out don't work. It works quite well in general but sometimes it's just not enough.

Meanwhile, WineHQ calls this atrocious counter strike comparability "platinum". When it crashes and makes entire program features unusable, that's "silver". Hilarious.

Luckily for me, Counter strike is not one of the applications I want to run, and if I wanted to I'd just use my Windows machine. Wine can be really hit and miss, and what works on one setup might not on another. When it does work though, I find it works pretty well.

[Tachikoma]

I'm yet to meet a woman who likes playing games, let alone use Ubuntu and get to adore her for it!