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#1 Kaven   Members   -  Reputation: 104

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Posted 14 May 2011 - 04:06 PM

How long could it take to learn C++ well and start programming some win32 and Directx11 (in native not managed) to reach the lv of a good junior programmer in a game studio or even better ????

am curious because I haven't programmed C++ in over 10years so like 30% of it would be revision... and I am not sure if it's worth all learning it even if I am really passionate about creating 3d engine because at 32 am affraid it could take too long... even if I have all day to do it all years long etc when I study the source of Quake 3 I am discouraged by the complexity and size of it, I ask myself question like will I ever be able to code like that/close to that i mean like working on a project that size etc

currently I am studying my MCITP certifications from Microsoft (IT Pro stuff, Active Directory, Dns, Dhcp, Virtualisation, Windows Server 2008 etc) and I am doing really fine, but 3d graphics seem to be my passion am just affraid a bit.... I live 4hr's of car from montreal and ubisoft recruit big like all the big studio so I was wondering, if I push it hard 10hr's a day for the next 3 years for example etc but at 1 point you have to decide what you want to do and stop learning 2-3 different things/fields


thanks a lot for your time and the invaluable advices



Kaven

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#2 Serapth   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 5012

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Posted 14 May 2011 - 04:14 PM

Impossible question. How long did it take you to learn how to write? Or swim?

Some people learn things almost instantly. Others struggle and takes months or years or perhaps never grasp the subject. Really it all comes down to you.


As to your application of prior knowledge, well frankly the C++ language hasn't changed all that much in 10 years, so if you remember anything, it should still be mostly applicable. Frankly though, if your goal is to land a game development job in Montreal, you are going about it the wrong way. The reality is, only a handful of employees in a company work on engine development, if frankly any do as a lot of studios just buy off the shelf.

You want to get noticed, work on a mod, or put together a hell of a demo for your CV.

#3 Jesse7   Members   -  Reputation: 154

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 02:09 AM

and I am not sure if it's worth all learning it even if I am really passionate about creating 3d engine because at 32 am affraid it could take too long... even if I have all day to do it all years long etc when I study the source of Quake 3 I am discouraged by the complexity and size of it, I ask myself question like will I ever be able to code like that/close to that i mean like working on a project that size etc

currently I am studying my MCITP certifications from Microsoft (IT Pro stuff, Active Directory, Dns, Dhcp, Virtualisation, Windows Server 2008 etc) and I am doing really fine, but 3d graphics seem to be my passion am just affraid a bit.... I live 4hr's of car from montreal and ubisoft recruit big like all the big studio so I was wondering, if I push it hard 10hr's a day for the next 3 years for example etc but at 1 point you have to decide what you want to do and stop learning 2-3 different things/fields


Sounds like you're undecided on what you want to do for a career. Maybe you should do some thinking and ask yourself what's the worst thing that can happen if you don't pursue your passion? On the other hand, what's the worst thing that can happen if you do? It's entirely possible that working 10 hours a day for 3 years will result in nothing significant. Of course it's also possible that working just 1-2 hours a day for 2 years may be more than enough.

Personally, I feel that you don't really get to choose your passion--I think it more or less chooses you. What I mean is that people that have a passion for something are so obsessed that they cannot see themselves living their life any other way. This is why there is a notion of the "starving artist." A person will endure failure, false starts, rejection, unemployment, hunger, hardship, etc... all because they are so stubborn that they cannot see themselves working the typical 8-5 job. Most people are not that serious about becoming musicians, athletes, artists, actors, writers, game developers, etc... which is why very few are successful. Incidentally, this reminds me of an anecdote about Socrates and a man who wanted to become as enlightened as Socrates:

One day a dispassionate young man approached the Greek philosopher and casually said, 'O great Socrates, I come to you for knowledge.'

The philosopher took the young man down to the sea, waded in with him, and then dunked him under the water for thirty seconds. When he let the young man up for air, Socrates asked him to repeat what he wanted. 'Knowledge, O great one,' he sputtered.

Socrates put him under the water again, only this time a little longer.

After repeated dunkings and responses, the philosopher asked, 'What do you want?' The young man finally gasped, 'Air. I want air!' 'Good,' answered Socrates. 'Now, when you want knowledge as much as you wanted air, you shall have it.

It's easy for us to believe that given enough hours of practice, we could also produce the equivalent of a Quake 3. Perhaps, but I would suggest reading the book Masters of Doom and you will see that the genius behind Quake 3, John Carmack, had the kind of desire that Socrates was talking about.
Good judgment comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgment.

#4 M.Jackson   Members   -  Reputation: 104

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 09:10 AM

First, the direct answer to your question is that it depends on the type of learner you are. If you learn a programming language by studding a few books until you feel that you know the language before finally tackling some code, then at 4 hours a day 4 days a week I would say you are looking at a matter of months before you start transitioning into application programming. However, if you learn through the hacker method of looking at code and trying to figure out how it works I would say that it is a matter of a week or two before you transition. Now, that is not to say that you will have the same knowledge base using the hacker method, but the benefit of that method is that you only learn things directly related to what you are doing while still learning where to go when you need to look something up.

Second, being 32 years old does not put you at a disadvantage. Look at it this way, most people are now living into their 80s, so you will likely live for another 50 years. That time will pass, and, no matter if you pass that time sitting on the couch watching reruns or sifting through code looking for that missing semicolon, you are constantly choosing how to spend that time.

#5 adder_noir   Members   -  Reputation: 271

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 01:38 AM

when I study the source of Quake 3 I am discouraged by the complexity and size of it


No sh*t. You will be. What else do you expect? You could look at the source code for even an old amiga game like Flames Of Freedom or Combat Air Patrol and be blown away at the moment. Furthermore given that each author has their own way of doing the nitty gritty I would think anyone even a seasoned uber veteran would look at entirely unfamiliar code for a project as big as Q3 and go "Wow, what the hell's that doing?".

I'm currently only 12 months into doing this seriously, and even in that period I've had several *timeouts* lasting anything up to a month!.

I'm also further on than I ever, ever could have imagined in just under a year. It has for me anyway, taken a long time and no individual effort has had any major impact alone. Sheer weight of numbers of study sessions prompted, impromptu, formal, informal are slowly winning the day. It did not happen quickly, no matter how much I tried to rush it!

32 is fine. Same age as me. Plenty of scope yet. Too much even :)

P.S. I voted up the reply above mine by Jackson. It's amazing!




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