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Banner advertising on our site currently available from just $5! # Minecraft Old topic! Guest, the last post of this topic is over 60 days old and at this point you may not reply in this topic. If you wish to continue this conversation start a new topic. 33 replies to this topic ### #21Matias Goldberg Crossbones+ - Reputation: 4679 Posted 22 June 2011 - 12:07 PM Now what I'm curious about is WHY the game took off. The concepts of it are similar to various other games that never really were successful, after all. This is interesting, though, I suppose Minecraft isn't as original as I thought it was. Without having actually played the game, I would dare to say it's because it has the *CRAFT in it After it, people just found it addictive. Less cynical thoughts: From what I'm reading, the concept wasn't new, but it has been retouched and tweaked several times until it took off. Well, that's how good games are made: through iteration until you find the right formula. It's amazing how some tiny unsuspecting detail can make a whole difference. Don't forget the quality is often in the details. Cheers Dark Sylinc Twitter: @matiasgoldberg Sponsor: ### #22Kaze Members - Reputation: 948 Posted 22 June 2011 - 12:46 PM I feel minecraft succeeded because infiminer didn't have much gameplay beyond editing blocks and dwarf fort's learning curve is a mile high cube of solid steel. Dwarf fort in particular I used to play a lot but gave up due to later versions skyrocketing complexity compounded by very quirky fundamental gameplay, losing every fort from impossible to meet noble demands was the last straw. ### #23SuperVGA Members - Reputation: 1123 Posted 22 June 2011 - 01:35 PM But after the minecraft terrain is generated, its freely manipulable, as a frigging volume. All terrain that has even been manipulated (which tends to happen a lot in minecraft) also needs to be stored in memory from that point on. Actually I think youd even need to store all terain that has ever been seen, considering there is a lot of dynamic stuff like tree growth and monster spawning going on, even when these areas are nothing even remotely resembling being in view. I myself am pretty amazed at how well minecraft handles this. These worlds are not just infinite in theory; there are videos in which people actually build insanely long roads for instance, without showing any signs of slowing down. I havnt seen its equal yet Store the Seed Data for a chunk, then a 'mask' that contains the difference between the seed and what the current state of the chunk/subchuck is. When you then go back to the area the computer takes the seed value and regenerates the land 100% the same as it was the first time, then applies the masks to make up for the changes. Most chunks will have next to no mask data, some chunks will have more. Additionally you can apply some basic compression methods to your masks to reduce the data needed to actually store the mask. How you implement the mask would then depend on how the world is generated and what you expect to be done with it. Thats all rather obvious, but the bottom line is that i have not see anyone do anything of similar complexity. Well, if it's trivial to you, how come you are pretty amazed by it? Dwarf fortress is much, much more complex. And you're likely to find many roguelikes and 3d liero projects that attain at least the same degree of complexity... ### #24AutoBot Members - Reputation: 109 Posted 22 June 2011 - 02:58 PM Without having actually played the game, I would dare to say it's because it has the *CRAFT in it After it, people just found it addictive. Less cynical thoughts: From what I'm reading, the concept wasn't new, but it has been retouched and tweaked several times until it took off. Well, that's how good games are made: through iteration until you find the right formula. It's amazing how some tiny unsuspecting detail can make a whole difference. Don't forget the quality is often in the details. Haha, Minecraft, Starcraft, Warcraft, etc... But the concept of iteration seems like a good idea, as you explained it. I suppose a game can be good enough if it was *inspired* by another game, not just a mimic. As far as I've been told however, more than CPU power, bandwidth is a serious issue... I suppose that ordering a dedicated server like servercraft or brohoster might be a good idea, then. I don't want my internet connection lagging because of a minecraft server, lol. ### #25ChaosEngine Crossbones+ - Reputation: 3008 Posted 22 June 2011 - 03:32 PM Did you even read the OPs post? He wasn't saying "hey check out this awesome new game", he was asking about map generation and server maintenance. And your point is what, exactly? I gave him enough information to find an article about Minecraft map generation, should he choose to pursue it, and also added my own playfully ribbing comment that he obviously missed the boat on the whole Minecraft craze. Have you helped him out in any way? And yes, he was saying "Hey check out this awesome new game. In a nutshell its a sandbox game.... The website is minecraft.net, I believe they have the beta out for$15.

Did you read the OPs post??

Sorry, you're right. For some reason I parsed your initial post as much harsher than it reads. My apologies. I think lack of sleep is getting to me.
if you think programming is like sex, you probably haven't done much of either.-------------- - capn_midnight

### #26Eelco  Members   -  Reputation: 301

Posted 22 June 2011 - 03:32 PM

Thats all rather obvious, but the bottom line is that i have not see anyone do anything of similar complexity.

Well, if it's trivial to you, how come you are pretty amazed by it?
Dwarf fortress is much, much more complex. And you're likely to find many roguelikes and 3d liero projects that attain at least the same degree of complexity...

Coming up with a sketch of the architecture isnt the hard part: actually making something that works is of course a different matter in general, and in particular here since i hadnt seen it done before.

### #27PrestoChung  Members   -  Reputation: 197

Posted 23 June 2011 - 08:10 AM

Also Minecraft's popularity is probably helped by running from a browser.

3d liero projects

I remember liero it was awesome. Are there some fun 3d clones out there?

### #28SuperVGA  Members   -  Reputation: 1123

Posted 23 June 2011 - 09:14 AM

Also Minecraft's popularity is probably helped by running from a browser.

3d liero projects

I remember liero it was awesome. Are there some fun 3d clones out there?

Fun? Naah, not yet at least as far as I know!

There's this XNA project: http://liero3d.blogspot.com/,
And Silvermans unfinished project based on voxlap: http://www.advsys.ne...ap/voxlap02.htm

Then i saw a guy here at gamedev who has a marching cubes renderer capable of rendering vast terrains with nice lighting,
forgot his name though.
Also there was one other guy whos page i bookmarked a while ago, who got some simple ai working in a software raycaster written in C.
And then another one taking place on an irregular-shaped planet with COG and working multiplayer. I got my hands on that back then, so I think i can dig it up. It's sort of a small planet, though.

I hope for a voxel game revolution. That could stress hardware manufacturers to produce specialized units to deal with raycasting on
legacy hardware, and we'll be a step closer to simulating molecules.

### #29Krohm  Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 3748

Posted 25 June 2011 - 09:14 AM

I suppose that ordering a dedicated server like servercraft or brohoster might be a good idea, then. I don't want my internet connection lagging because of a minecraft server, lol.

Beware, it was my understanding that his server is running in some high-profile server farm... but as I previously wrote, I know nothing for sure.

Then i saw a guy here at gamedev who has a marching cubes renderer capable of rendering vast terrains with nice lighting,
forgot his name though.

I think I know what you're talking about! That was rather slick (and properly filtered LOL)!

I hope for a voxel game revolution. That could stress hardware manufacturers to produce specialized units to deal with raycasting on
legacy hardware, and we'll be a step closer to simulating molecules.

I hope not. I don't see how this helps in simulating molecules. The days of fixed function pipes are long gone...

### #30 owl   Banned   -  Reputation: 368

Posted 25 June 2011 - 09:41 AM

I personally think that those who don't understand minecraft / manic digger success never played (or enjoyed) Lego.
I like the Walrus best.

### #31Oberon_Command  Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 2470

Posted 25 June 2011 - 10:05 AM

I personally think that those who don't understand minecraft / manic digger success never played (or enjoyed) Lego.

This. I've only played Minecraft once or twice, but playing it felt just like playing with Lego.

### #32greentiger  Members   -  Reputation: 145

Posted 30 June 2011 - 01:14 PM

In my opinion is not as much of who came first, but who ran with it the best, For all anyone knows, some guy might of came up with the photoelectric effect but never published it, While Eistein won the noble prize for it, There are no real "original ideas" anymore, everything is a derivitive of another.

Most if not all human knowledge is advanced by building off the knowledge discovered by someone else--that's how all of science advances.
It's pretty interesting that calculus was independently discovered by two individuals (pretty interesting actually http://en.wikipedia....Calculus#Modern ).

I see no problem with building off of someone else's work so long as you acknowledge that you did so (and as far as I can tell Notch freely admits Minecraft's origins). If you invent super happy funball and don't do anything with it and if someone else invents super happy funball and becomes a billionaire, that was just a missed opportunity. And besides, history is fickle--a good idea may not take off right away--an inventor ahead of his time can and does happen frequently

I don't like the "game" of MC ... I'd rather just build ala LEGOs and I could totally see it as a MMO construction kit. "Insert mob here, add quest-giver NPC there, add treasure-key item here, build mega-fort-castle there, add king NPC, etc ..."
Destiny of the Sword -- multi-player turn based war game and TRPG:

### #33SimonForsman  Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 6685

Posted 30 June 2011 - 05:23 PM

I prefer dwarf fortress for the 3d building w/ mechanics.

Thanks for reminding me... I haven't checked on progress on that in a while now. Last time I was playing it had sort of stalled out.

Dwarf Fortress is moving along quite nicely it seems and is definitly worth a look if you can get past the initial learning curve or don't mind losing alot.
I don't suffer from insanity, I'm enjoying every minute of it.
The voices in my head may not be real, but they have some good ideas!

### #34Amaz1ng  Members   -  Reputation: 131

Posted 30 June 2011 - 05:40 PM

The minecraft concept has been around for like 7-8 years atleast. I remember playing warcraft 3 mods that are pretty much mirrors of the minecraft gameplay. That particular concept of "building a fortress before the baddies come out at night" isn't new by any means. I guess that guy just found some formula that "clicked" with people...now he's a millionaire a few times over.
http://innercirclegames.freeforums.org
Email me at: innercirclegames@hotmail.com

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