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My friend is starting to like Java (help!)


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#1 Tiner   Members   -  Reputation: 97

Posted 19 July 2011 - 02:52 PM

My programmer is starting to like java more then c++! What should I do?

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#2 Luckless   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 1886

Posted 19 July 2011 - 03:00 PM

Really? Its Java. It is a great language for a wide range of projects, and often gets more done per unit of programmer time in those domains than what C++ usually allows.

If that is one of the biggest issues you can find to talk about in this world, then maybe the real world isn't the place for you?
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#3 SimonForsman   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 6306

Posted 19 July 2011 - 03:04 PM

My programmer is starting to like java more then c++! What should I do?


This is quite natural, Java only starts to look bad when you compare it to C#, compared to C++ its pretty darn nice to work with.
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#4 Rodimus   Members   -  Reputation: 127

Posted 19 July 2011 - 03:09 PM

Your title says friend, but the actual post content gives the impression of someone hired by you. If he is is just your friend, he should be perfectly capable of making his own choice of tool depending on what he likes and need for a certain project. In the same way, he should be okay with using what tools you've defined if he is hired by you. After all, it sounds like he is proficient with both.

I like Java, and I like C++. What's up with having to choose sides? Do jokes about them Java guys if you like, but in the end we're all programmers, aren't we? Posted Image

(Optionally you can just unfriend him)
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#5 tstrimple   Prime Members   -  Reputation: 1734

Posted 19 July 2011 - 03:15 PM


My programmer is starting to like java more then c++! What should I do?


This is quite natural, Java only starts to look bad when you compare it to C#, compared to C++ its pretty darn nice to work with.


I came here to say essentially this.

#6 Sirisian   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 1793

Posted 19 July 2011 - 03:18 PM

"I know you had the best intentions, but I think it's time we moved on. It's you, not me." <_< Yeah you should probably tell him about C#/.NET development. He'd probably enjoy it more.

#7 JoeCooper   Members   -  Reputation: 338

Posted 19 July 2011 - 03:45 PM

The OP was joking, along the lines of "help! my friend has turned to cocain!"
I've worked with C++, Java and - a little - C# and am doing my current project in C#.

I like Java. I used to laugh at it too, but I like the minimalist approach of just taking a lot out of the language. I reminds me of C in spirit.

But I think C# is a winner. At its core it's like Java with hindsight and its developers (as in Microsoft) are a lot more ambitious and spirited right now (than Oracle w/r/t Java).

Buuuut I haven't been paying enough attention to Java lately to judge that with certainty. Anyone care to comment on that last point?

#8 mind in a box   Members   -  Reputation: 621

Posted 19 July 2011 - 03:52 PM

Does he want to rewrite your whole project in Java now or what?

#9 Tiner   Members   -  Reputation: 97

Posted 19 July 2011 - 04:20 PM

Does he want to rewrite your whole project in Java now or what?


Haha, no thankfully. He agrees that a game engines should never be written in java unless it's meant for the web

#10 swiftcoder   Senior Moderators   -  Reputation: 10371

Posted 19 July 2011 - 04:31 PM

I like the minimalist approach of just taking a lot out of the language. I reminds me of C in spirit.

We are surely not talking about the same Java. You do mean the language that goes to extra effort to enforce verbosity in every aspect of the syntax, and which standard library provides no less than 5 mutually-incompatible ways to read a file, right?

That said, I don't really dislike Java. I just find it to be a verbose and much less-friendly alternative to Python :)

Tristam MacDonald - Software Engineer @Amazon - [swiftcoding]


#11 The_Neverending_Loop   Members   -  Reputation: 626

Posted 19 July 2011 - 05:45 PM

Iam sorry but I just have to stand up for Java here, I <3 Java its my favorite language, Iam a .NET C# developer at work, but I much prefer to work on my own Java based projects, I dont know why but I just find coding in Java more enjoyable.

#12 ChaosEngine   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 2499

Posted 19 July 2011 - 06:27 PM

Iam sorry but I just have to stand up for Java here, I <3 Java its my favorite language, Iam a .NET C# developer at work, but I much prefer to work on my own Java based projects, I dont know why but I just find coding in Java more enjoyable.


Why do you like Java better than C#? I'm not disputing your choice, but I'd be interested to know the reasons behind it.
if you think programming is like sex, you probably haven't done much of either.-------------- - capn_midnight

#13 ApochPiQ   Moderators   -  Reputation: 16402

Posted 19 July 2011 - 06:39 PM

Death by firing squad.

It's the only way.



Seriously, though, I'd rather get stabbed in the eye with an ice pick every morning than keep using C++, so at least he's moving towards the lesser of two evils. Which is not to say Java isn't a horrid language, it's just... much less horrid than C++.

#14 RedEyedKiller   Members   -  Reputation: 108

Posted 19 July 2011 - 06:43 PM

A bullet between his eyes. It's cruel but if you are a true friend you should release him from this madness. :P

#15 Joe P   Members   -  Reputation: 166

Posted 19 July 2011 - 08:55 PM

Sometimes I think this whole elite C++ stuff is just insane. The vast majority of amateur programmers are not writing software that needs to take advantage of the "amazing speed increase" in C++. Its so silly when new people are told "use C++ its the industry standard" or "dont use Java, its slow". I can guarantee that most of these people have never even hit a limitation of Javas speed yet, let alone absolutely need to use C++.

I cant tell you how many times class mates of mine question why I program games in Java. I do it because I havent yet found a reason not too, and most of the people saying its "slow" dont even know if thats true :)

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#16 KanonBaum   Members   -  Reputation: 277

Posted 19 July 2011 - 08:55 PM

Posted Image
*I think Java is just another language. Use whatever, man.
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#17 D.Chhetri   Members   -  Reputation: 181

Posted 19 July 2011 - 09:06 PM



My programmer is starting to like java more then c++! What should I do?


This is quite natural, Java only starts to look bad when you compare it to C#, compared to C++ its pretty darn nice to work with.


I came here to say essentially this.


I came here to say essentially this also!!!
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#18 tstrimple   Prime Members   -  Reputation: 1734

Posted 19 July 2011 - 09:58 PM

Sometimes I think this whole elite C++ stuff is just insane. The vast majority of amateur programmers are not writing software that needs to take advantage of the "amazing speed increase" in C++. Its so silly when new people are told "use C++ its the industry standard" or "dont use Java, its slow". I can guarantee that most of these people have never even hit a limitation of Javas speed yet, let alone absolutely need to use C++.

I cant tell you how many times class mates of mine question why I program games in Java. I do it because I havent yet found a reason not too, and most of the people saying its "slow" dont even know if thats true :)

CRAZY TALK!


I agree completely vs C++. However C# > Java > C++. The tools are simply amazing, and the language is evolving quite nicely.

#19 JoeCooper   Members   -  Reputation: 338

Posted 19 July 2011 - 10:08 PM

We are surely not talking about the same Java. You do mean the language that goes to extra effort to enforce verbosity in every aspect of the syntax, and which standard library provides no less than 5 mutually-incompatible ways to read a file, right?
That said, I don't really dislike Java. I just find it to be a verbose and much less-friendly alternative to Python :)


Umm, yessir. I was actually thinking about the language rules when I said that. There's nothing like refs, pointers, unsigned, stack allocated classes, restricted MI (the "interface" thing), etc. Next to C# and C++ it strikes me as feature light.

I realize though there are more aspects to the product than that, such as the standard library and naming convention. You are correct. I just had something very specific in mind when I made that comment.

#20 JoeCooper   Members   -  Reputation: 338

Posted 19 July 2011 - 10:10 PM

We are surely not talking about the same Java. You do mean the language that goes to extra effort to enforce verbosity in every aspect of the syntax, and which standard library provides no less than 5 mutually-incompatible ways to read a file, right?
That said, I don't really dislike Java. I just find it to be a verbose and much less-friendly alternative to Python :)


Umm, yessir. I was actually thinking about the language rules when I said that. There's nothing like refs, pointers, stack allocated classes, unsigned integers, type punning, restricted MI (the "interface" thing), etc. Next to C# and C++ it strikes me as feature light and strict. Like safety scissors.

I realize though there are more aspects to the product than that, such as the standard library and naming convention. You are correct. I just had something very specific in mind when I made that comment.




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