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#21 DarklyDreaming   Members   -  Reputation: 366

Posted 03 December 2011 - 08:09 PM


Don't use "studios" unless you command more than one studio; otherwise, it's dishonest.

Odd, it never occurred to me that "<name> Studios" is more than one studio.

Matter of fact, when I hear "Studio" what comes to mind is not a huge office complex, but a artist's studio, which is usually just one or two rooms set aside for art in an average person's home. More frequently, I think "studio apartment".

A studio seem indie to me. Studios seem 'small' like the solo painter of times past, or the workshop of a crafter and his apprentice.

Calling a one man shop a 'studio' doesn't seem dishonest to me, but maybe I'm just too immersed in old-fashion studios (Where a 'studio' is an artist's equivalent of a 'study').
Calling it 'studios' doesn't seem dishonest either, in my opinion. The word 'studios' seems oddly fitting even if it's a singular location, though I don't know why - I can't immediately lay a mental hand upon a similar 'singular plural'

Calling it "Enterprise" or "Corporation" or something like that, would seem deceptive to me, but maybe not to others.

To me calling a one-man shop working from home "Blablabla Studios" is just about as inversely accurate as me calling a Nimitz-class carrier a 'boat'. Anyone can name their company whatever they want within the law of course.


Either way, the word has been mangled into whatever seems to 'fit' and at current that seems to be putting <<company name here>> studios for whatever reason -- I don't know, but to me it seems a lot more honest to put: interactive, entertainment, productions or anything else on the end.
"I will personally burn everything I've made to the fucking ground if I think I can catch them in the flames."
~ Gabe

"I don't mean to rush you but you are keeping two civilizations waiting!"
~ Cavil, BSG.
"If it's really important to you that other people follow your True Brace Style, it just indicates you're inexperienced. Go find something productive to do."
~ Bregma

"Well, you're not alone.

There's a club for people like that. It's called Everybody and we meet at the bar."

~ Antheus


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#22 Servant of the Lord   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 21198

Posted 04 December 2011 - 12:23 PM

I think different people attach different mental pictures to the words we are describing. Putting "Productions" at the end of a indie developer would be much more dishonest then studios (in my mind) unless you financially fund other studios' games and not just your own. You may not have the same mental pictures associated with the word 'productions' that I do (and mine is probably less accurate), since you find it acceptable for a indie, whereas I have different mental pictures for 'studios'.

It seems to me, when you think 'studios' you think big Hollywood movie studios (Paramount Studios or Universal Studios for example) - despite that not being the most accurate meaning of the word 'studios', that seems to be what comes to your mind, which maybe speaks "AAA, The Big Guys, Suits, Professionalism, Large Budget" (which is what I think about the word 'Productions')

When I think studios, I think a stereotypical starving artist's (in france) room or even nook in his house... complete with unfinished canvases, paint splattered on the walls and floors, and sparse furnishings, which to me speaks "Barely (or Successfully) Surviving, Working from Home, In It For The Art, Creative Risk-taking, Not Afraid to Mess Up, Rather Have Creative Freedom Then Financial Stability But Would Like Both"

When you think productions, I'm not sure what comes to mind, but you said it's acceptable for an indie.
When I think productions, I think Steven Spielberg bank-rolling major movies (Film producer) - despite that not being the most accurate meaning of the word 'productions', nevertheless that's what comes to my mind.

Some words may have very well established meanings but others don't, and even knowing the literal definition, people may think entirely differently about those words. And that's perfectly fine! But it shouldn't be demoted as 'dishonest' just because some people think about it differently, especially when it's not the actual definition of the word.

I fully understand that you don't want to name your studio, "Triple-A Gold-Medal Games" or "Skyscraper Enterprises" or "BiggestPublisherOnTheBlock Developer". But 'studio' is a very acceptable name for a indie developer.
It's perfectly fine to abbreviate my username to 'Servant' rather than copy+pasting it all the time.
All glory be to the Man at the right hand... On David's throne the King will reign, and the Government will rest upon His shoulders. All the earth will see the salvation of God.
Of Stranger Flames - [indie turn-based rpg set in a para-historical French colony] | Indie RPG development journal

[Fly with me on Twitter] [Google+] [My broken website]

[Need web hosting? I personally like A Small Orange]


#23 DarklyDreaming   Members   -  Reputation: 366

Posted 06 December 2011 - 01:42 PM

Sorry for the late reply, wanted to make sure I could answer you proper this time :)

I think different people attach different mental pictures to the words we are describing. Putting "Productions" at the end of a indie developer would be much more dishonest then studios (in my mind) unless you financially fund other studios' games and not just your own. You may not have the same mental pictures associated with the word 'productions' that I do (and mine is probably less accurate), since you find it acceptable for a indie, whereas I have different mental pictures for 'studios'.

Naturally, I think much the same! I never meant to imply that we all should think "STUDIOS=BIG!" but, personally, I feel it does. "Studio" I think, is a different matter. Whether that's silly or not is up to you, but when I hear "studio" I hear "indie" but when I hear "studios" I think "AAA+". Probably a bit discorteous of me to say "dishonest" - I really ought to have said "misleading" as that's more aligned with my opinion; which, again, is really only one man's opinion.

It seems to me, when you think 'studios' you think big Hollywood movie studios (Paramount Studios or Universal Studios for example) - despite that not being the most accurate meaning of the word 'studios', that seems to be what comes to your mind, which maybe speaks "AAA, The Big Guys, Suits, Professionalism, Large Budget" (which is what I think about the word 'Productions')

I do. Mostly.

When I think studios, I think a stereotypical starving artist's (in france) room or even nook in his house... complete with unfinished canvases, paint splattered on the walls and floors, and sparse furnishings, which to me speaks "Barely (or Successfully) Surviving, Working from Home, In It For The Art, Creative Risk-taking, Not Afraid to Mess Up, Rather Have Creative Freedom Then Financial Stability But Would Like Both"

I think much the same, when you omit the extra 's'.

When you think productions, I'm not sure what comes to mind, but you said it's acceptable for an indie.
When I think productions, I think Steven Spielberg bank-rolling major movies (Film producer) - despite that not being the most accurate meaning of the word 'productions', nevertheless that's what comes to my mind.

When I think productions, I think of it as a more generalized form of saying "I work on a lot product(s). I produce stuff -- I am my own business."
Now, whether that's correct or not, is quite beside the point we're each making, isn't it?

Some words may have very well established meanings but others don't, and even knowing the literal definition, people may think entirely differently about those words. And that's perfectly fine! But it shouldn't be demoted as 'dishonest' just because some people think about it differently, especially when it's not the actual definition of the word.

No, I agree. It was a bit of a jumpy reaction. I guess I should explain: I get bored with the number of people who start a business, sign a few legal agreements, and suddenly think they own HUGE COMPANY AAA+ STUDIOS ENTERTAINMENT and appoint themselves CEO (without acknowledging that you can't be a CEO without a board of directors or that you have to put up a certain monetary amount to even form a corporation). It shouldn't leak out to the point where I disregard anyone's naming preference, but it did. I apologize for that, it was rude calling it dishonest - though I retain my position that I feel it's misleading; but then again, you feel the same way with 'productions' so I guess we can leave that at "we agree to disagree" right? :)

I fully understand that you don't want to name your studio, "Triple-A Gold-Medal Games" or "Skyscraper Enterprises" or "BiggestPublisherOnTheBlock Developer". But 'studio' is a very acceptable name for a indie developer.

Yes, that's more the intent I was trying to push. Studios is acceptable, though I think "studio" is a better fit (at least my mental picture switches to a starving artist rather than a fully equipped and housed "game studio"). Studio though doesn't seem to have the "ring" to it -- like Big Fish Studio vs. Big Fish Studios. Funny that! I guess if we're going to talk about honesty (which was silly of me, thinking back to it) the most "honest" naming scheme would be "Blablabla Games" since that's about as direct as you can go (or, if wanting to be more general, "entertainment" might be a good fit).

I enjoy the debate, thought admittedly it matters little to me what a studio is called -- whatever the naming is, I rarely look at the name for much establishment. It's a plus if it's smart, and a non-problem if it isn't -- though in the latter case I might forget about the studio easier.
"I will personally burn everything I've made to the fucking ground if I think I can catch them in the flames."
~ Gabe

"I don't mean to rush you but you are keeping two civilizations waiting!"
~ Cavil, BSG.
"If it's really important to you that other people follow your True Brace Style, it just indicates you're inexperienced. Go find something productive to do."
~ Bregma

"Well, you're not alone.

There's a club for people like that. It's called Everybody and we meet at the bar."

~ Antheus


#24 Servant of the Lord   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 21198

Posted 06 December 2011 - 04:05 PM


Some words may have very well established meanings but others don't, and even knowing the literal definition, people may think entirely differently about those words. And that's perfectly fine! But it shouldn't be demoted as 'dishonest' just because some people think about it differently, especially when it's not the actual definition of the word.

No, I agree. It was a bit of a jumpy reaction. I guess I should explain: I get bored with the number of people who start a business, sign a few legal agreements, and suddenly think they own HUGE COMPANY AAA+ STUDIOS ENTERTAINMENT and appoint themselves CEO...

Fully agree! I dislike that also.

It shouldn't leak out to the point where I disregard anyone's naming preference, but it did. I apologize for that, it was rude calling it dishonest

No need to apologize, I didn't think you were being rude, and I was also using the word 'dishonest'. We're just having a heated, but polite, discussion. Posted Image
We haven't even descended to "your mamma" insults, and we're on the internet, so we're still miles above the average level of social decency.

(Though I feel bad for naf456, because I only just now realized I de-railed his thread beyond recovery. Oops! My fault)

...though I retain my position that I feel it's misleading;

Fair enough, and I agree the plural version can be misleading, though I personally never viewed it as such, I can fully see how it can be.


I fully understand that you don't want to name your studio, "Triple-A Gold-Medal Games" or "Skyscraper Enterprises" or "BiggestPublisherOnTheBlock Developer". But 'studio' is a very acceptable name for a indie developer.

Yes, that's more the intent I was trying to push. Studios is acceptable, though I think "studio" is a better fit (at least my mental picture switches to a starving artist rather than a fully equipped and housed "game studio").

I agree with that intent; I was under the impression both the singular and plural was under attack, and naively jumping in to defend it. Posted Image

Glad for the opportunity to debate it, as it gives food for thought as I haven't yet named my studios studio game company software workshop Uh, I haven't yet set upon a nom de guerre for doing business under, and this will help me put more thought into what a honest developer name would be - though I'd certainly love a name that'd scale up if I ever hire employees.

I'll just name my small developer company Empire Enterprises Incorporated, and humbly name myself Président de la empiré, to avoid controversy. Posted Image

[Edit:] Beaten to the name, it seems. Someone already has "Game Empire Enterprises" as a company name, and the owner apparently calls himself "Emperor".
It's perfectly fine to abbreviate my username to 'Servant' rather than copy+pasting it all the time.
All glory be to the Man at the right hand... On David's throne the King will reign, and the Government will rest upon His shoulders. All the earth will see the salvation of God.
Of Stranger Flames - [indie turn-based rpg set in a para-historical French colony] | Indie RPG development journal

[Fly with me on Twitter] [Google+] [My broken website]

[Need web hosting? I personally like A Small Orange]


#25 Servant of the Lord   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 21198

Posted 06 December 2011 - 04:18 PM

Hello.
I need a new name for my 'Game studio' (really it's just me :/). I had venom interactive first, but it just didn't sound right - so then I went for lvl2 games which is the best I came up with. then it turned into vortex games - which was already taken, now I'm currently at Trinity Games, which is taken by triniti games on the app store on the iphone.

It's not a MAJOR worry (I keep that back for the games) but I'm never satisfied...
I have thought about other querky names, like "Leg Of Lamb Games" which gets shortened down to "LOL", or maybe "Brutal"

My current logo is here : http://postimage.org/image/5pizyz9gt/



Recently needing to find a name for my own studio, I've been thinking about names also.
Some that were suggested to me by others:

  • Reckless Abadondon
  • River's Shadow Games
  • SkyQuake
  • Midnight Clockwork Entertainment
  • Horizon Games
  • Lost Trail Media
  • Lost Path Games

What I'm doing is writing down all the single-word descriptions of ideas I want my studio name to invoke in players as a starting point for choosing a name. None of the names above fit my studio, so feel free to use them if they fit yours. Some might already be taken, I haven't checked.
It's perfectly fine to abbreviate my username to 'Servant' rather than copy+pasting it all the time.
All glory be to the Man at the right hand... On David's throne the King will reign, and the Government will rest upon His shoulders. All the earth will see the salvation of God.
Of Stranger Flames - [indie turn-based rpg set in a para-historical French colony] | Indie RPG development journal

[Fly with me on Twitter] [Google+] [My broken website]

[Need web hosting? I personally like A Small Orange]


#26 ManOfThePast   Members   -  Reputation: 97

Posted 06 December 2011 - 05:00 PM

Don't use "studios" unless you command more than one studio; otherwise, it's dishonest.


Names don't have to be honest. In fact, honest names are worse. How would Jim's Mediocre Car Repair Shop sound? Or Wang's Fake Asian Food? Or Overly Expensive Insurance Incorporated? No you're creating a brand and a brand has to invoke the image you want in the customer's head. That image doesn't not have to be honest. It just has to be effective.

#27 DarklyDreaming   Members   -  Reputation: 366

Posted 06 December 2011 - 05:16 PM


Don't use "studios" unless you command more than one studio; otherwise, it's dishonest.


Names don't have to be honest. In fact, honest names are worse. How would Jim's Mediocre Car Repair Shop sound? Or Wang's Fake Asian Food? Or Overly Expensive Insurance Incorporated? No you're creating a brand and a brand has to invoke the image you want in the customer's head. That image doesn't not have to be honest. It just has to be effective.

Do you also tell your customers you have fifty thousand employees, a three billion dollar revenue yearly, an internationally recognized brand and travel around with a G6 every day?* Being honest has it's benefits - the first one being that people will actually take you seriously if you don't make claims that are obviously beyond your means. Being honest and being undermining are different - you have confused the two: your examples are obviously devaluing the business they represent.

If I name my business, I'd like it to be as close as a representation of what I do as possible since that will guarantee that people recognize a) that I understand my limitations and b) that my customers don't confuse me with a triple-A studio and thus expectations aren't ruined (try knocking out a game with "It's gonna be the best game ever -- seriously!" and tell me how it goes; there is a reason indies generally focus their promotions less on being aggressive towards the game's world-changing power and more towards what makes it stand out).


If your point was that you shouldn't name your brand with any prefixes that says "Look at me, I suck!" then yes - what a great piece of advice, wouldn't you say? Obvious advice too. There is a difference between that and proclaiming "OMEGA-ULTRA TRIPLE-A RIP-ASS-TITS STUDIOS" is the best name evar! Posted Image

*Obvious silliness is obvious, point being that your examples were equally silly -- in business, you have to be secure in you and your brand; you can do that without turning into a dishonest brand. In fact, it's better not to turn into dishonest practices - while sometimes effective, I've found people do appreciate the honesty we bring to the table.

  • Reckless Abadondon
  • River's Shadow Games
  • SkyQuake
  • Midnight Clockwork Entertainment
  • Horizon Games
  • Lost Trail Media
  • Lost Path Games

SkyQuake sounds great, but only makes me think of iD Software's Quake -- a good or bad association, can't tell, but it's there. Horizon Games would probably be a legal hassle if Futuremark got their panties in a twist -- after all, if 'Scrolls' can get Bethesda off from "Elder Scrolls" then "Horizon" could probably get Futuremark pissed enough to sue from "Shattered Horizon". But who knows? Ahh, the fun of doing business. :)
"I will personally burn everything I've made to the fucking ground if I think I can catch them in the flames."
~ Gabe

"I don't mean to rush you but you are keeping two civilizations waiting!"
~ Cavil, BSG.
"If it's really important to you that other people follow your True Brace Style, it just indicates you're inexperienced. Go find something productive to do."
~ Bregma

"Well, you're not alone.

There's a club for people like that. It's called Everybody and we meet at the bar."

~ Antheus


#28 ManOfThePast   Members   -  Reputation: 97

Posted 06 December 2011 - 07:25 PM



Don't use "studios" unless you command more than one studio; otherwise, it's dishonest.


Names don't have to be honest. In fact, honest names are worse. How would Jim's Mediocre Car Repair Shop sound? Or Wang's Fake Asian Food? Or Overly Expensive Insurance Incorporated? No you're creating a brand and a brand has to invoke the image you want in the customer's head. That image doesn't not have to be honest. It just has to be effective.

Do you also tell your customers you have fifty thousand employees, a three billion dollar revenue yearly, an internationally recognized brand and travel around with a G6 every day?* Being honest has it's benefits - the first one being that people will actually take you seriously if you don't make claims that are obviously beyond your means. Being honest and being undermining are different - you have confused the two: your examples are obviously devaluing the business they represent.

If I name my business, I'd like it to be as close as a representation of what I do as possible since that will guarantee that people recognize a) that I understand my limitations and b) that my customers don't confuse me with a triple-A studio and thus expectations aren't ruined (try knocking out a game with "It's gonna be the best game ever -- seriously!" and tell me how it goes; there is a reason indies generally focus their promotions less on being aggressive towards the game's world-changing power and more towards what makes it stand out).


If your point was that you shouldn't name your brand with any prefixes that says "Look at me, I suck!" then yes - what a great piece of advice, wouldn't you say? Obvious advice too. There is a difference between that and proclaiming "OMEGA-ULTRA TRIPLE-A RIP-ASS-TITS STUDIOS" is the best name evar! Posted Image

*Obvious silliness is obvious, point being that your examples were equally silly -- in business, you have to be secure in you and your brand; you can do that without turning into a dishonest brand. In fact, it's better not to turn into dishonest practices - while sometimes effective, I've found people do appreciate the honesty we bring to the table.


Fair enough, my examples were a bit rediculous. :) But I was trying to make a point.

Here's the thing --- and this is a bit deep so buckle up --- when you're building a brand, you're building a reality. You're creating associations of names and images in people's minds. Customers will rarely be able to discern the truth behind the brand. Nor will they care. If you're a trustworthy brand that the customers can rely on building great products and services, nothing else matters. Now you still need to be trustworthy in the first place! That means making good products/services and following through. But that's about marketing and operations. Whether you're a 1-man operation or a 100-building campus is mostly irrelevant. You're creating an idea. What do you want that idea to be? Steve Jobs, for example, was well known for pushing reality all the time. He'd walk into a room and they'd say "We can't do X by this date" and he'd say, "Yes you can", and they'd argue back, and after some time everyone in the room would be convinced Jobs was right all along. Jobs wasn't just bending reality --- he was creating it. The same goes with naming your brand.

#29 xaviarrob   Members   -  Reputation: 103

Posted 06 December 2011 - 08:22 PM

and the name of my company shall be

srand(time(0);

#30 Paul Franzen   Members   -  Reputation: 334

Posted 07 December 2011 - 07:55 AM

Maybe we should all agree to just stick with "Games" instead of "Studio," "Studios," or "Productions."

Life in the Dorms -- comedic point-and-click adventure game out now for Xbox Live Indie Games!

My portfolio: http://paulfranzen.wordpress.com/


#31 Servant of the Lord   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 21198

Posted 07 December 2011 - 11:16 AM

and the name of my company shall be

srand(time(0);


Parse error: Missing closing parenthesis. Please rename your company and recompile.
It's perfectly fine to abbreviate my username to 'Servant' rather than copy+pasting it all the time.
All glory be to the Man at the right hand... On David's throne the King will reign, and the Government will rest upon His shoulders. All the earth will see the salvation of God.
Of Stranger Flames - [indie turn-based rpg set in a para-historical French colony] | Indie RPG development journal

[Fly with me on Twitter] [Google+] [My broken website]

[Need web hosting? I personally like A Small Orange]


#32 DarklyDreaming   Members   -  Reputation: 366

Posted 07 December 2011 - 11:21 AM

Maybe we should all agree to just stick with "Games" instead of "Studio," "Studios," or "Productions."

Hey, your last name is the same as mine! Cool. :)
"I will personally burn everything I've made to the fucking ground if I think I can catch them in the flames."
~ Gabe

"I don't mean to rush you but you are keeping two civilizations waiting!"
~ Cavil, BSG.
"If it's really important to you that other people follow your True Brace Style, it just indicates you're inexperienced. Go find something productive to do."
~ Bregma

"Well, you're not alone.

There's a club for people like that. It's called Everybody and we meet at the bar."

~ Antheus


#33 Paul Franzen   Members   -  Reputation: 334

Posted 07 December 2011 - 12:06 PM

Hey, your last name is the same as mine! Cool. :)


There's another Franzen in the gamedev community?! We should be besties!



Life in the Dorms -- comedic point-and-click adventure game out now for Xbox Live Indie Games!

My portfolio: http://paulfranzen.wordpress.com/


#34 ZBethel   Members   -  Reputation: 608

Posted 07 December 2011 - 01:54 PM

How about SneezeQuake Studios?

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

#35 Green_Gill   Members   -  Reputation: 139

Posted 16 December 2011 - 11:15 PM

Snizat™ U.S.
Snizat U.S.™
We get tons of publicity, and everyone knows how awesome we are.


"That's nothing to snizat™!"
"Everyone knows, your standards are nothing to snizat™!"

Will sell trademark rights for 1 million dollars, Thank You.

Or you could join my game studio. Hugo Baya Games™

It's currently me and a cricket. *squish* Whoops, just me... looks like we need a new volunteer VP of HR, I'm sure you'll do better than our last one... you are larger than a sandal, right?
Our last VP was really good, drawing in BIG FISH. A cod, a couple of mackerels, even a tuna.

With respect *Hugo Baya™ Snizat™ and Hugo Baya Snizat™(hint, hint) all associated trademarks are respected properties of their respective respectable respirating owners, please respect them.
(Yes, I was bored and reading the R's in the dictionary. You raggedy Ragamuffin)
*Hugo Baya™ Games is a subdivision of Playa Games™

Using your name, Franzen games, the closest is 'Frozen Games™" which is really too short... how about 4Zen Games™?

Seriously though, try the name generator, it gave me some really good ones.

Well, unless it's 1Man or Juan Maan Incorporated or something like that.

Small tip, 4Zen is actually too close to frozen games, it would get mispronounced most of the time, every game name in this entire document is terrible. Except for these.
Zen Men Games. Postal Games, Full Tilt West Games, Undone Games

Though, there is an advantage to having a game studio name that CANNOT be rhymed. Orange Soft And a disadvantage.
How about Myna Games™? As in the Myna bird? Lonely Fork. Organic Studios. Cracked Games, Bent Games,
Franzen... hmm... Frantic Software? Frantic Zen Games (Two opposites). Fractured Zen Games?
Imma stop at Frantic Zen. And not put an evil, evil little TM next to it. Any good? Opinions?

#36 Bacterius   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 9305

Posted 24 December 2011 - 10:48 PM

I couldn't resist but this company name generator is awesome! It gave me:

- Melon Knives Interactive

- Cat Celery United

- Falling Sawblade

- Tiny Sandwich Collective

- Damaged Ideas Interactive...

:lol:


The slowsort algorithm is a perfect illustration of the multiply and surrender paradigm, which is perhaps the single most important paradigm in the development of reluctant algorithms. The basic multiply and surrender strategy consists in replacing the problem at hand by two or more subproblems, each slightly simpler than the original, and continue multiplying subproblems and subsubproblems recursively in this fashion as long as possible. At some point the subproblems will all become so simple that their solution can no longer be postponed, and we will have to surrender. Experience shows that, in most cases, by the time this point is reached the total work will be substantially higher than what could have been wasted by a more direct approach.

 

- Pessimal Algorithms and Simplexity Analysis


#37 FableFox   Members   -  Reputation: 527

Posted 30 December 2011 - 08:51 AM

I got Green Day (on the sixth click or something). Maybe that's where they get their name from!
Fable Fox is Stronger <--- Fable Fox is Stronger Project

#38 Paul Franzen   Members   -  Reputation: 334

Posted 05 January 2012 - 09:52 AM

I don't think we should be ignoring "The Tiny Sandwich Collective" as a fantastic company name.

Life in the Dorms -- comedic point-and-click adventure game out now for Xbox Live Indie Games!

My portfolio: http://paulfranzen.wordpress.com/


#39 c0d3n4fun   Members   -  Reputation: 106

Posted 27 October 2013 - 06:32 PM

Uranus Soft
 

lol



#40 Tom Sloper   Moderators   -  Reputation: 10178

Posted 27 October 2013 - 06:52 PM

This thread had been dormant for almost two years. So that nobody thinks it's a fresh topic and tries to help the OP (2 years after asking the original question), I'm locking this thread.
-- Tom Sloper
Sloperama Productions
Making games fun and getting them done.
www.sloperama.com

Please do not PM me. My email address is easy to find, but note that I do not give private advice.




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