Hi I was wondering if you folks hire out to master your audio, or if you do it yourself? For hiring out, what prices should I expect to pay? How do I go about finding a good mastering house? Everything I find is geared towards mastering for cd's. To my ear there seems to be a difference between games and cd's. Mostly in the area of dynamic range, but also overall loudness and frequency distribution. I can sort of fake it, but that finishing touch is so very important. I have heard mediocre compositions that sound great because of the final polish, and great music that sounds mediocre because of a lack thereof.
Stuff you may not be interested in: I am putting together some demos, learning the tools, etc for game audio production. WHile I have found many great topics, there seems to be not a whole lot out there in the realm of mixing and mastering specifically for games (well there is 'mixing' using things like wwise but that is not really what I am looking for at this point). So far the best I have found is that mastering for games is similar to mastering for movies as opposed to mastering for commercial cds.
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Finalizing Audio For Game
Started by Panphobia, Feb 08 2012 07:47 PM
15 replies to this topic
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#2 Members - Reputation: 196
Posted 09 February 2012 - 05:28 AM
Hello,
Mastering is the last step in preparing the music for its final application.
Most music we hear has little dynamics, I'm sure you've heard of the term "Loudness War" - basically every pop/rock track that's supposed to air on the radio is mastered for the purpose of going head to head with all the other tracks.
With game music it's a different thing. You've already mentioned a certain similarity between game music and film music: picture yourself meticulously scoring a track to a cinematic scene - the music can end up having a lot of dynamics, which is actually desirable in this case. Mastering this with the same hard multi-band compression and limiting approach as the pop/rock music would be quite counterproductive.
Another thing to think about is playback systems: while mastering engineers for movies have the big cinema speakers in mind, we game people need to consider the music might get played back by the tiny speakers of an iPad - and still needs to be audible.
That said, for game music I don't outsource the mastering process but rather do it myself: I don't need the biggest most artfully compressed "sausage wave", I simply need to make sure it sounds good on the system it needs to sound good on and has the dynamics needed for the scene/level/menu screen/whatever. Giving that job to someone else would make me lose some of the control of the overall sound.
The mastering process's sonic influence is overrated in my opinion: a weak mix will sound weak even after the best mastering, and a good mix will sound good even without mastering.
Cheers,
Moritz
Mastering is the last step in preparing the music for its final application.
Most music we hear has little dynamics, I'm sure you've heard of the term "Loudness War" - basically every pop/rock track that's supposed to air on the radio is mastered for the purpose of going head to head with all the other tracks.
With game music it's a different thing. You've already mentioned a certain similarity between game music and film music: picture yourself meticulously scoring a track to a cinematic scene - the music can end up having a lot of dynamics, which is actually desirable in this case. Mastering this with the same hard multi-band compression and limiting approach as the pop/rock music would be quite counterproductive.
Another thing to think about is playback systems: while mastering engineers for movies have the big cinema speakers in mind, we game people need to consider the music might get played back by the tiny speakers of an iPad - and still needs to be audible.
That said, for game music I don't outsource the mastering process but rather do it myself: I don't need the biggest most artfully compressed "sausage wave", I simply need to make sure it sounds good on the system it needs to sound good on and has the dynamics needed for the scene/level/menu screen/whatever. Giving that job to someone else would make me lose some of the control of the overall sound.
The mastering process's sonic influence is overrated in my opinion: a weak mix will sound weak even after the best mastering, and a good mix will sound good even without mastering.
Cheers,
Moritz
Check out my Music/Sound Design Reel on moritzpgkatz.de
#5 Members - Reputation: 103
Posted 10 February 2012 - 02:31 AM
I agree with Moritz too, very good points.
We recently did all the audio by ourselves to a title we are about to release (http://www.gamedev.n...-upcoming-game/).
I feel that mastering for game music is not well developed, especially if it is made for non-PC devices or handhelds.
The missing tool that I'd like to have is a VST or some plugin that simulates the output of a device such as the iPhone. Or even better, a setup that will stream the audio output from the audio software directly to the device itself in real time - this way it'll be much easier to tweak the sounds and volume/compresing etc.
Cheers,
Guy
We recently did all the audio by ourselves to a title we are about to release (http://www.gamedev.n...-upcoming-game/).
I feel that mastering for game music is not well developed, especially if it is made for non-PC devices or handhelds.
The missing tool that I'd like to have is a VST or some plugin that simulates the output of a device such as the iPhone. Or even better, a setup that will stream the audio output from the audio software directly to the device itself in real time - this way it'll be much easier to tweak the sounds and volume/compresing etc.
Cheers,
Guy
#6 Members - Reputation: 196
Posted 10 February 2012 - 03:52 AM
GetLastError, on 10 February 2012 - 02:31 AM, said:
The missing tool that I'd like to have is a VST or some plugin that simulates the output of a device such as the iPhone. Or even better, a setup that will stream the audio output from the audio software directly to the device itself in real time - this way it'll be much easier to tweak the sounds and volume/compresing etc.
Check out my Music/Sound Design Reel on moritzpgkatz.de
#7 Members - Reputation: 200
Posted 10 February 2012 - 04:49 AM
GetLastError, on 10 February 2012 - 02:31 AM, said:
The missing tool that I'd like to have is a VST or some plugin that simulates the output of a device such as the iPhone. Or even better, a setup that will stream the audio output from the audio software directly to the device itself in real time - this way it'll be much easier to tweak the sounds and volume/compresing etc.
#8 Members - Reputation: 196
Posted 10 February 2012 - 06:52 AM
Relfos, on 10 February 2012 - 04:49 AM, said:
GetLastError, on 10 February 2012 - 02:31 AM, said:
The missing tool that I'd like to have is a VST or some plugin that simulates the output of a device such as the iPhone. Or even better, a setup that will stream the audio output from the audio software directly to the device itself in real time - this way it'll be much easier to tweak the sounds and volume/compresing etc.
Check out my Music/Sound Design Reel on moritzpgkatz.de
#9 Members - Reputation: 103
Posted 10 February 2012 - 02:16 PM
To other composers, do you use master bus EQ or compression on your tracks?
I'm not all into the loudness war thing and crushing the dynamics because I know that takes the emotion out, I make hip hop/rap beats and I still don't do that
But what do you do to give your audio track that final crisp and sparkle that's ready to go into a game?
I'm not all into the loudness war thing and crushing the dynamics because I know that takes the emotion out, I make hip hop/rap beats and I still don't do that
But what do you do to give your audio track that final crisp and sparkle that's ready to go into a game?
www.majesticmastermind.tumblr.com - Creative, Original, and Passionate Music For Games
Twitter - @Majestic8390
Twitter - @Majestic8390
#10 Members - Reputation: 196
Posted 11 February 2012 - 06:24 AM
Hey Lavontae,
Why don't you post this in the recent thread about mastering? Would have been a perfect fit.
Maybe Nate could merge the two topics? (EDIT: Thanks Nate!
)
Depending on what the track needs, I either use the PSP VintageWarmer, iZotope Ozone or both in combination.
The PSP VintageWarmer is for coloring the track with a bit of drive, while Ozone is a very neutral tool. I usually don't try to "fix the mix" - if I've done a good job selecting good timbres and blending them well, all that's really needed on the mastering bus is a bit of EQ and a bit of multiband compression, mostly to deal with the lower frequencies and to add a bit of air, and a limiter to bring things up to a good loudness level.
The great thing about the down- to mid-tempo break beats you hear in rap music is that you can compress really hard and turn them up really loud and they'll still have good dynamics because they usually involve single hits/short notes/good amounts of silence in-between that keep the music alive.
Cheers,
Moritz
Why don't you post this in the recent thread about mastering? Would have been a perfect fit.
Maybe Nate could merge the two topics? (EDIT: Thanks Nate!
)Majestic_Mastermind, on 10 February 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:
But what do you do to give your audio track that final crisp and sparkle that's ready to go into a game?
The PSP VintageWarmer is for coloring the track with a bit of drive, while Ozone is a very neutral tool. I usually don't try to "fix the mix" - if I've done a good job selecting good timbres and blending them well, all that's really needed on the mastering bus is a bit of EQ and a bit of multiband compression, mostly to deal with the lower frequencies and to add a bit of air, and a limiter to bring things up to a good loudness level.
Majestic_Mastermind, on 10 February 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:
I'm not all into the loudness war thing and crushing the dynamics because I know that takes the emotion out, I make hip hop/rap beats and I still don't do that
The great thing about the down- to mid-tempo break beats you hear in rap music is that you can compress really hard and turn them up really loud and they'll still have good dynamics because they usually involve single hits/short notes/good amounts of silence in-between that keep the music alive.
Cheers,
Moritz
Check out my Music/Sound Design Reel on moritzpgkatz.de
#12 Members - Reputation: 103
Posted 12 February 2012 - 05:55 AM
Relfos, on 10 February 2012 - 04:49 AM, said:
GetLastError, on 10 February 2012 - 02:31 AM, said:
The missing tool that I'd like to have is a VST or some plugin that simulates the output of a device such as the iPhone. Or even better, a setup that will stream the audio output from the audio software directly to the device itself in real time - this way it'll be much easier to tweak the sounds and volume/compresing etc.
Please let me know when it's out
#13 Members - Reputation: 106
Posted 29 February 2012 - 01:44 PM
I've gone thru lots of mastering tutorial videos for Logic Pro. They were usually for more rock oriented stuff with the "loudness war" multi-band processing. I was confused by why they were doing this until I researched a little more. Since I was mostly doing rock music (not game music) this stuff worked just fine.
I'd assume the other stuff I saw in those tutorials is still valid, taking out some of the real low frequencies, using a limiter, etc.
My question is, what does something like Ozone (which I'm considering buying) do for me besides these things I've learned to do myself.
I'd assume the other stuff I saw in those tutorials is still valid, taking out some of the real low frequencies, using a limiter, etc.
My question is, what does something like Ozone (which I'm considering buying) do for me besides these things I've learned to do myself.
#14 Members - Reputation: 196
Posted 29 February 2012 - 03:38 PM
Azul, on 29 February 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:
My question is, what does something like Ozone (which I'm considering buying) do for me besides these things I've learned to do myself.
You can try it out, too - iZotope has a demo on their website.
Check out my Music/Sound Design Reel on moritzpgkatz.de
#15 Members - Reputation: 106
Posted 01 March 2012 - 12:45 PM
Moritz P.G. Katz, on 29 February 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:
[Of course, Ozone isn't a one-click wonder machine - but it's a good all-in-one combination of several very neutral sounding tools and well-programmed analyzers.
After watching some tutorials of Ozone4, I'm definitely getting it! I have learned to do some of these things in Logic but it seems like a much more logical workflow and it simply sounds great.
