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Randomly Loosing 3 Reputation Points


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#1 Code Fox   Members   -  Reputation: 2158

Posted 04 August 2012 - 06:11 PM

Before I begin, yes I have read http://www.gamedev.n...breakdown-r2925 many times.

I have been noticing that I have lost a lot of points, and was wondering why. I looked in my profile, and found that a lot of my posts had -3 attached to them - and it was NOT from being down voted.

What is causing this to happen ?


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Posted Image
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Edited by Shippou, 04 August 2012 - 06:12 PM.


The Internet is so big, so powerful and pointless

that for some people it is a complete substitute for life .

~ Andrew Brown


Sponsor:

#2 jbadams   Senior Staff   -  Reputation: 21839

Posted 04 August 2012 - 06:17 PM

All of the posts listed in that screenshot correctly match up to up or down votes in the listed topics... i.e. it is from being down-voted.

#3 Code Fox   Members   -  Reputation: 2158

Posted 04 August 2012 - 06:19 PM

All of the posts listed in that screenshot correctly match up to up or down votes in the listed topics... i.e. it is from being down-voted.

No it isn't - look at the topics .

Your staff - you should know it takes 2 clicks to verify what I said.
1 click on my rep points, 1 click on the post with negative points.

Literally 3 seconds.

Edited by Shippou, 04 August 2012 - 06:21 PM.


The Internet is so big, so powerful and pointless

that for some people it is a complete substitute for life .

~ Andrew Brown


#4 jbadams   Senior Staff   -  Reputation: 21839

Posted 04 August 2012 - 06:28 PM

Your staff - you should know it takes 2 clicks to verify what I said.

Do you really think I'm so lazy that I tried to answer you without following such a simple process? To walk you through the beginning of it, I:
  • Clicked into your rep points.
  • Clicked into the first listed item (which happily resides in the exact same location as the second one -- hooray for time savings!), and checked the votes on the post in question.
  • The post in question has two down-votes -- one for each listing in your rep history. i.e. it matches up correctly.
  • Repeated the above for the other listed items; they match similarly.


#5 jbadams   Senior Staff   -  Reputation: 21839

Posted 04 August 2012 - 06:47 PM

Possible source of confusion: were you aware that the voting/score widget next to any given post only shows the total number of votes effecting the post in question?

For example, after a post is voted down once it will display -1. After a second down-vote it would be -2. If there is then an up-vote the display would now be -1 (-2 +1).

The listing in your rep panel shows the effect the votes had on your reputation; there were 2 down-votes on one of your posts (displaying -2 on the widget in the topic), each of which caused a -3 effect on your reputation.

Please excuse formatting or spelling errors, as I'm responding from a mobile device.

#6 Cornstalks   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 6999

Posted 04 August 2012 - 09:36 PM

What is causing this to happen ?

Oh, I don't know... maybe it's posts like these:


All of the posts listed in that screenshot correctly match up to up or down votes in the listed topics... i.e. it is from being down-voted.

No it isn't - look at the topics .

Your staff - you should know it takes 2 clicks to verify what I said.
1 click on my rep points, 1 click on the post with negative points.

Literally 3 seconds.


But yea, it's probably what jbadams points out. The number by your post shows the composite score of that post based on votes. Each vote has an effect on your rep (not all votes are worth +/-3 points). For example, this post looks like it as 2 downvotes and 1 upvote, therefore it shows -1 by the post (-2 + 1), but in your history there's -3, -3, and +3.

For what it's worth, there seems to be a heck of a lot of unnecessary downvoting in this thread (and various other threads)... I really wish people had to earn the ability to downvote (and could lose this ability)...
[ I was ninja'd 71 times before I stopped counting a long time ago ] [ f.k.a. MikeTacular ] [ My Blog ] [ SWFer: Gaplessly looped MP3s in your Flash games ]

#7 Hodgman   Moderators   -  Reputation: 37370

Posted 04 August 2012 - 10:00 PM

For what it's worth, there seems to be a heck of a lot of unnecessary downvoting in...

N.B. down-voting someone also lowers your own reputation now, so the guy who went on a down-vote spree in that thread also just lowered his own rep by a decent amount.

#8 Code Fox   Members   -  Reputation: 2158

Posted 04 August 2012 - 10:01 PM

* sigh *

Here is a painfully obvious illustration ....

Posted Image


The Internet is so big, so powerful and pointless

that for some people it is a complete substitute for life .

~ Andrew Brown


#9 Cornstalks   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 6999

Posted 04 August 2012 - 10:25 PM

* sigh *

Here is a painfully obvious illustration ....

*sigh* you're reading it wrong. Each vote in your rep history will take you to the post that was voted up or down. Click on each one and see where it takes you. Your history shows 4 voting events from that thread: 3 downvotes and one upvote. Click each one and see where it takes you.

In chronological order:
Downvote, -3, Jul 07 2012 12:39 AM (post #26) (post numbers are displayed in the top right corner of each post)
Downvote, -3, Jul 07 2012 12:40 AM (post #29)
Downvote, -3, Jul 07 2012 01:21 AM (post #29)
Upvote, +3, Jul 07 2012 06:56 AM (post #29)

Results:
Post #26 has 1 downvote, and correctly shows -1 by it and -3 in your history.
Post #29 has 2 downvotes and 1 upvote, and correctly shows -1 (-2 + 1) by it and -3, -3, and +3 in your history.

Conclusion: you aren't randomly losing 3 points.

@Hodgman: I don't think that deters such downvoters... I don't think people who go on downvoting sprees care.

Edited by Cornstalks, 04 August 2012 - 10:31 PM.

[ I was ninja'd 71 times before I stopped counting a long time ago ] [ f.k.a. MikeTacular ] [ My Blog ] [ SWFer: Gaplessly looped MP3s in your Flash games ]

#10 Bacterius   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 10240

Posted 04 August 2012 - 11:16 PM

Put succinctly, the reputation events shown on your reputation page are displayed with the thread's name, it should then stand to reason that multiple rep. events in the same thread will show up with identical names - clicking each event will take you to the actual post that was upvoted (or in this case, downvoted).

Essentially, the reputation list is a permanent record of your reputation changes, while the number next to your posts represents the number of people who upvoted the post, minus the number of people who downvoted it. Therefore these two metrics may not agree, especially since rep. changes aren't always +/- 3 but depend on the voter, so you can very well end up in situations where your post has a number of 0 while still netting you +1 rep, if this makes sense.

Edited by Bacterius, 05 August 2012 - 01:14 AM.

The slowsort algorithm is a perfect illustration of the multiply and surrender paradigm, which is perhaps the single most important paradigm in the development of reluctant algorithms. The basic multiply and surrender strategy consists in replacing the problem at hand by two or more subproblems, each slightly simpler than the original, and continue multiplying subproblems and subsubproblems recursively in this fashion as long as possible. At some point the subproblems will all become so simple that their solution can no longer be postponed, and we will have to surrender. Experience shows that, in most cases, by the time this point is reached the total work will be substantially higher than what could have been wasted by a more direct approach.

 

- Pessimal Algorithms and Simplexity Analysis


#11 jbadams   Senior Staff   -  Reputation: 21839

Posted 05 August 2012 - 01:01 AM

* sigh *

Here is a painfully obvious illustration ....

That post has one up-vote, and two down-votes, which as I explained above (post #5) displays on the voting widget beside the post as -1 (that is: +1 -1 -1 = -1)

Meanwhile, as I explained above (again, post #5) your log of reputation events shows each of these three events independently with the resultant effect on your reputation score. For the post you've drawn out, the log lists one up vote (+3 to your rep), one down vote (-3 to your rep) and one more down-vote (-3 to your rep). A total of three reputation events, for a total effect of -3 to your reputation. You also have events listed for a different post in that same topic, some of which occurred at a different time and therefore appear later in the log.

It does all add up. If you're still having trouble understanding or if you think there's some other problem I'm more than happy to investigate and to try to explain things for you -- and we'll definitely take any misunderstandings or suggestions into account for improving the system and creating or improving documentation -- but I'm not really appreciating the attitude you're appearing to give.


Does the explanation make sense to you now, or would you like a complete step-by-step walk-through of your entire log of reputation events?

#12 Code Fox   Members   -  Reputation: 2158

Posted 05 August 2012 - 01:43 AM

So if I get this correctly, up-down voting is worth 3 points in the log, and 1 point on the post ?


The Internet is so big, so powerful and pointless

that for some people it is a complete substitute for life .

~ Andrew Brown


#13 Hodgman   Moderators   -  Reputation: 37370

Posted 05 August 2012 - 01:53 AM

The widget next to a post shows the balance of individual votes made.

The reputation number and log show the effect of votes. 1 vote usually results in +/- 3 rep points.

#14 Code Fox   Members   -  Reputation: 2158

Posted 05 August 2012 - 08:57 PM

Thank you for clearing that up.


The Internet is so big, so powerful and pointless

that for some people it is a complete substitute for life .

~ Andrew Brown


#15 slicer4ever   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 4320

Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:54 AM

if i might add a suggestion to the current system based off this post, I'd recommend adding some method of expanding on the post score number to see total up/down's individually.
Check out https://www.facebook.com/LiquidGames for some great games made by me on the Playstation Mobile market.

#16 Sean T. McBeth   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 1668

Posted 07 August 2012 - 11:18 AM

I see some things never change :)

[Formerly "capn_midnight". See some of my projects. Find me on twitter tumblr G+ Github.]


#17 Steve_Segreto   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 1691

Posted 29 August 2012 - 02:13 PM

I just returned to the forums after a few months break and was surprised that down-voting a post also decreases your own reputation as Hodgman pointed out. What is the rationale behind this?

#18 Cornstalks   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 6999

Posted 29 August 2012 - 02:21 PM

I just returned to the forums after a few months break and was surprised that down-voting a post also decreases your own reputation as Hodgman pointed out. What is the rationale behind this?

To try to discourage trolling/unnecessary down-votes.
[ I was ninja'd 71 times before I stopped counting a long time ago ] [ f.k.a. MikeTacular ] [ My Blog ] [ SWFer: Gaplessly looped MP3s in your Flash games ]

#19 jefferytitan   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 2422

Posted 29 August 2012 - 03:04 PM

I'd like to back slicer on that one... for a regular member being able to see the split of up and down votes would be nice, and also aid in eliminating this kind of confusion. I'd actually like to know if a post of mine is controversial vs just boring. ;)

#20 Mussi   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 2240

Posted 29 August 2012 - 03:18 PM

Clicking on the number shows the down and up voters, not sure if this is only available to GDNet members.




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