Not sure if I can get into the game industry without a degree...

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13 comments, last by Runesabre 11 years, 6 months ago

Summarizing my opinion, if you can get a degree - do it, you can definitely benefit from that. However, it shouldn't be the main point on your resume - do extra work and create a few demos, so you can always prove your practical skills. This can really increase the chances of getting hired. I recommend you to watch the video I posted in another thread. It should give you some more insights on what companies, such as Valve look for.


I do agree with most of the points you stated, for I believe that a degree is only necessary for certain types of people, and of course a degree should only be a supplement. And experience will always trump education, however my comments were geared towards the posters situation, and their are many things that must be considered:

1. For the most part, game companies can be broken into two major categories 1.) Large development studios which are usually publishers (Activizzard, EA, Valve etc..) and 2) Smaller development studios which independently develop (indies).

Without a college degree, you are already pretty much cutting out your chances of getting a job with the first group. That is because they receive such a high volume of resumes daily that they have higher and stricter standards and policies, so HR will look for certain things (Certain buzzwords, education, etc...) BEFORE they pass it on to the departments that actually do the hiring. Therefore, unless you know someone with some kind of pull in the company to vouch for you, your pretty much out of luck.

With the second group, the indies, you have a much better chance of getting hired. However, it still wont be easy because they will be turned off by your age. It is VERY risky hiring someone straight out of high school for a key position (Which most indie teams require, they need a few people to do ALOT, not alot of people to do a little [ie few entry positions]) simply because they are unproven. It is much easier to show nice art in an art portfolio, but is is MUCH more difficult to show your extent of programming knowledge in any kind of portfolio.
Additionally, you must look at it from an employers perspective, the average developer stays at a company for ~2 years since they jump around alot to get diffrent experiences. If an employer has to spend 1-2 years training a guy whos fresh out of highschool to make them truly effective, usually they are ready to jump jobs at that time.


2. Another big thing that is being overlooked is college diversity. Although you can learn things much faster out of school, their are alot of useful things you would have learned in school that you wouldnt have taken upon yourself otherwise. When you are taking computer science, their are many things that you will learn about that you simply didnt know you needed to know (computer hardware, programming in assembly, linear algebra, computer networking, algorithms, technical writing, programming in Lisp, Prolog, etc.). Some of these things would probably not have been learned on your own, however ALL of them will be extremely handy in your job.
Additionally, you say that you learn allot of theoretical knowledge and other unpractical stuff in college. this is true, however this is a good thing. It is simple to teach yourself how to do things and what is the best way to do things, however it is MUCH harder to learn WHY it is that you do that. WHY is doing the game loop way x is faster, or WHY is way Y the most effiecient way to cache data. You wont be forced to do things how other people are doing, you will learn about the underworkings of a computer and why certain things work better certain ways. This is MUCH harder to teach on the job then simple syntax and other similar stuff.


Once again my advice to the OP,
Try and apply for various jobs with your current Resume and Portfolio, but at the same time apply for colleges. If you get a sweet job lined up, then go ahead and do that if you want, but you better have a good plan if you are not continuing on to university. I am in a similar situation where I do not want to go to college, so it is my backup plan should I not be able to get a legitimate job. I would advise that you go to local gaming events and start networking with people that do hiring at companies so you will have a leg up.

ps. In reference to your portfolio, I meant unimpressive in sense of the appearance of the portfolio itself. It is confusing to navigate, and tough to see what you actually have done. You say that it is a makeshift portfolio that you threw together, so I hope that it does get cleaned up. Just make sure that as soon as they click on the link, the looker is impressed, not just staring at a blank, grey screen. Also keep in mind your audience, if you know actual programmers are going to be reviewing it, it is ok to have programmer art. However if it will go through some form of HR, it needs flashy graphics to impress HR turds. Just do your reasearch before you apply.

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1. For the most part, game companies can be broken into two major categories 1.) Large development studios which are usually publishers (Activizzard, EA, Valve etc..) and 2) Smaller development studios which independently develop (indies).

Without a college degree, you are already pretty much cutting out your chances of getting a job with the first group. That is because they receive such a high volume of resumes daily that they have higher and stricter standards and policies, so HR will look for certain things (Certain buzzwords, education, etc...) BEFORE they pass it on to the departments that actually do the hiring. Therefore, unless you know someone with some kind of pull in the company to vouch for you, your pretty much out of luck.

With the second group, the indies, you have a much better chance of getting hired. However, it still wont be easy because they will be turned off by your age. It is VERY risky hiring someone straight out of high school for a key position (Which most indie teams require, they need a few people to do ALOT, not alot of people to do a little [ie few entry positions]) simply because they are unproven. It is much easier to show nice art in an art portfolio, but is is MUCH more difficult to show your extent of programming knowledge in any kind of portfolio.
Additionally, you must look at it from an employers perspective, the average developer stays at a company for ~2 years since they jump around alot to get diffrent experiences. If an employer has to spend 1-2 years training a guy whos fresh out of highschool to make them truly effective, usually they are ready to jump jobs at that time.


You missed the whole point. Have you watched the video I mentioned? Don't put Valve as an example because it's not how they work. Also EA/Activision don't make games - they would require a degree but from a marketing/business school.

Also, there are no such things as "indie" game studios. Being indie means that you sell something without a publisher - no actual company does that. It's usually individuals working for their own money in their spare time. Unless of course, you consider a group of 2-3 people to be a studio.

By the way, regarding EA/Activision - I think you just provided the two worst companies to work in. In my humble opinion, 80% of the games they publish is rubbish.

You missed the whole point. Have you watched the video I mentioned? Don't put Valve as an example because it's not how they work. Also EA/Activision don't make games - they would require a degree but from a marketing/business school.

I wont comment on Valve since im not sure how they work, It Just seems highly unrealistic.

Both EA AND Activision/blizzard Make games (In house Studios)....... Go on their respective websites and look at careers section. They have a plethora of job postings, From Art To ENgineering to buisness, so I have no idea where you are getting that information.


Also, there are no such things as "indie" game studios. Being indie means that you sell something without a publisher - no actual company does that. It's usually individuals working for their own money in their spare time. Unless of course, you consider a group of 2-3 people to be a studio.


Once again what on earth are you talking about? We live in the now, not ten years ago. In my area alone there are over 50 independent game development studios (Boston, MA). Not 3 people teams, legitamate studios. More companies are independent than publisher controlled in the current market.



By the way, regarding EA/Activision - I think you just provided the two worst companies to work in. In my humble opinion, 80% of the games they publish is rubbish.


I do not know what you are basing your opinion on, but from the many people I have talked to that worked at EA, Most of them loved it. From what I heard, EA has a better environment then many other studios.

But we are going way off topic, so I will recommend you get back on track or we can just end this little discussion.

You missed the whole point. Have you watched the video I mentioned? Don't put Valve as an example because it's not how they work.


I wont comment on Valve since im not sure how they work, It Just seems highly unrealistic.

Perhaps watching the video, and reading the handbook also linked above, would dispel any misgivings. I haven't yet watched the video, and I dislike reading handbooks, but I've bookmarked the information as being informative and potentially educational.


Also, there are no such things as "indie" game studios. Being indie means that you sell something without a publisher - no actual company does that. It's usually individuals working for their own money in their spare time. Unless of course, you consider a group of 2-3 people to be a studio.


Once again what on earth are you talking about? We live in the now, not ten years ago. In my area alone there are over 50 independent game development studios (Boston, MA). Not 3 people teams, legitamate studios. More companies are independent than publisher controlled in the current market.

Now we are getting into a semantics discussion. I do not believe you two are using the same definition of "indie," and I do not believe there is or can be a universally applicable definition that will fit all usages of the term. Let's stop the discussion of the term "indie" right here, because that is outside the topic of the Breaking In forum. Have that discussion elsewhere - in either Business or The Lounge.

But we are going way off topic, so I will recommend you get back on track or we can just end this little discussion.

And I might close it. I probably should have before this. Anyone want to add any closing words that bring it back to "getting into the industry without a degree"?
Remember, what we're talking about in this forum is entry-level jobs.
For an entry-level job, you have to get noticed among the hundred or so other applicants.
Absence of degree means your portfolio might not get looked at.
It depends on the company, their desperation level, their location in the physical world, their pool of applicants.
If you're in North America, if you are not applying for a non-degree position like QA, a degree is fairly essential, unless you can explain in your cover letter why your portfolio deserves consideration without it. And you can pretty much forget AAA companies, where they are even more choosy.
In other countries, the degree might not be so essential.

-- Tom Sloper -- sloperama.com

As a hiring manager, I can say that having a degree is not necessarily required, however you will have the burden of proof of showing your passion and capability for me to take a chance on you. I have hired and worked with some spectacularly talented individuals who did not have a college degree, but, they are few and far between and in all cases they exhibited exceptional and proven passion and capability whether it was in Art, Design, Production or Engineering.

Kirk "Runesabre" Black
Enspira Online

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