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Blender for making Games?


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Poll: What do you think about Blender? (62 member(s) have cast votes)

How useful is Blender?

  1. Unusable. (5 votes [8.06%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 8.06%

  2. I use it sometimes. (21 votes [33.87%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 33.87%

  3. I prefer it! (36 votes [58.06%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 58.06%

How stable was Blender when you have used it?

  1. Crashed all the time. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  2. Every now and then it would crash. (17 votes [27.42%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 27.42%

  3. Never had any crashes I can think of! (45 votes [72.58%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 72.58%

How does the design of Blender strike you?

  1. Unorganized, confusing, bad! (13 votes [20.97%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 20.97%

  2. It's okay, I can get around in it. (35 votes [56.45%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 56.45%

  3. It's very intuitive! (14 votes [22.58%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 22.58%

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#21 JTippetts   Moderators   -  Reputation: 8508

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Posted 15 March 2014 - 10:36 AM

There has been an interesting recent development.

For the last several weeks, Dalai Felinto has been working on Blender Cycles baking. For those unfamiliar with it, Cycles is a renderer for Blender (an alternative to Blender's traditional Blender Internal renderer) that provides a shader-like node-based material system, path-tracing, support for the Open Shading Language, and support for GPU acceleration of rendering using CUDA or OpenCL. Cycles provides excellent lighting using node-based lights, emissive materials, etc... However, the largest drawback for Cycles in game development pipelines has been the lack of ability to bake the various data out to texture maps. The work that DFelinto is doing is intended to fix that. It's still very rough, and very much in progress, but in the future we can look forward to being able to use Cycles' powerful capabilities to bake light maps, environment maps, normal maps, diffuse, etc... It's going to end up pretty powerful, I think.

As always with experimental and in-development Blender stuff, you can check out builds at graphicall.org; in particular, tungerz has a Win64 Cycles baking build here that is kept fairly up-to-date from DFelinto's git repo.

Sponsor:

#22 Tutorial Doctor   Members   -  Reputation: 1630

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Posted 15 March 2014 - 01:55 PM

Thanks for the tip Jtippetts!

They call me the Tutorial Doctor.


#23 Tutorial Doctor   Members   -  Reputation: 1630

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 07:04 AM


Maya Autodesk and zBrush are probably my preference for 3D modelling. Autodesk is great for animation

 

That Zbrush model is awesome. I miss Zbrush! I have Sculptris, which can do basic stuff, but there is nothing in the league of Zbrush. I can only imagine the features they have in it now since I last used it. 


They call me the Tutorial Doctor.


#24 Tutorial Doctor   Members   -  Reputation: 1630

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 07:07 AM


As far as exporting that, the engine is the one that does the blending usually as part of the shaders used when rendering

 

Ahh, okay, thank you. I figured it was the BGE doing the rendering. I might look around for a plugin that could help with this. Right now the API for the engine I am using doesn't have many animation functions, so we have to hack stuff. Blending animations based on keyframes is proving a bit too much for the speed of workflow I am going for. 


They call me the Tutorial Doctor.


#25 riuthamus   Moderators   -  Reputation: 5531

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Posted 19 March 2014 - 07:47 AM

I dont mind blender, i just hate the bad practices it generates for people who start with it.



#26 Serapth   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 5485

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Posted 19 March 2014 - 12:58 PM

I dont mind blender, i just hate the bad practices it generates for people who start with it.

 

I'm curious what you mean?  I didn't start with it ( 3ds (not max... )) personally, but dont really see what bad habits it would form?  



#27 riuthamus   Moderators   -  Reputation: 5531

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Posted 19 March 2014 - 02:33 PM

Most people in blender leave seams, verts are almost never welded, and their edgeloops are horrid. This is because the tools make it seem like the model is complete and ready for export when in reality it can cause some serious issues when used in real game development. I guess the complaint is the program is too easy thus people dont learn the proper methods for creating assets for game development.



#28 Ashaman73   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 7573

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 02:01 AM



Posted Yesterday, 03:33 PM

Most people in blender leave seams, verts are almost never welded, and their edgeloops are horrid. This is because the tools make it seem like the model is complete and ready for export when in reality it can cause some serious issues when used in real game development. I guess the complaint is the program is too easy thus people dont learn the proper methods for creating assets for game development.

You need to consider, that most people using blender do it , because of not having (legal) access or enough money to use max/maya. Most people who use max/maya are professional or atleast students, who study art and have better access to this tools. The effect, that their art has better quality is just the result of an higher time investment and not the result of  the tool.

 

The quality of my code I write does not differ if written with VS2012 or notepad, but I'm much faster with VS2012. The quality differs only, because I study it and dedicated 20 years to code more or less each day, so , please don't blame the tool.



#29 nweissberg   Members   -  Reputation: 170

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 07:31 AM

Most people in blender leave seams, verts are almost never welded, and their edgeloops are horrid. This is because the tools make it seem like the model is complete and ready for export when in reality it can cause some serious issues when used in real game development. I guess the complaint is the program is too easy thus people dont learn the proper methods for creating assets for game development.

 

Almost every 3d professional and artist that uses blender knows how to make a proper edge loop and how to not leave seams. There are only two kinds of professional the one who is and the one who isn't. Independent of the tool, knowledge makes the artist. Any program can be excellent it just depends on who is using it.



#30 riuthamus   Moderators   -  Reputation: 5531

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 08:02 AM

 



Posted Yesterday, 03:33 PM

Most people in blender leave seams, verts are almost never welded, and their edgeloops are horrid. This is because the tools make it seem like the model is complete and ready for export when in reality it can cause some serious issues when used in real game development. I guess the complaint is the program is too easy thus people dont learn the proper methods for creating assets for game development.
 

You need to consider, that most people using blender do it , because of not having (legal) access or enough money to use max/maya. Most people who use max/maya are professional or atleast students, who study art and have better access to this tools. The effect, that their art has better quality is just the result of an higher time investment and not the result of  the tool.

 

The quality of my code I write does not differ if written with VS2012 or notepad, but I'm much faster with VS2012. The quality differs only, because I study it and dedicated 20 years to code more or less each day, so , please don't blame the tool.

 

 

While your point is great in theory it cant be anything further from the truth. The tool is SO simple they are not forced to learn those things that are crucial to GOOD model design. You ever see somebody put FRONTPAGE on their resume for being a "website professional"? You sure as hell don't now but you sure did back then. Everybody who had access to a computer could make cool clipart webpages but it doesn't mean they knew anything about making a real website. The same could be said for Photoshop and the people who use filters to make "cool flame art" but have no idea what the filter is actually doing and most of their work looks generic and cant be used for anything other than a silly signature on a forum page.

 

This actually goes deeper than just blender if you really wanted to get into it. It is the whole concept that the further we advance in technology the more we loose in basic knowledge and skill. I wont bore you with the details here and we can discuss in private or in another thread if you wished... but the point is this is MY opinion of the program.

 


Almost every 3d professional and artist that uses blender knows how to make a proper edge loop and how to not leave seams. There are only two kinds of professional the one who is and the one who isn't. Independent of the tool, knowledge makes the artist. Any program can be excellent it just depends on who is using it.

 

You make a solid point here. Problem with this is that blender is free and easy to use so the COMMON non-professional gets their hands on this program and creates the issue stated above. The OP's question was should it be used for gamedev, and while I believe the tool can be used to do so I hate it as a standard because the common person ( most indie people ) don't know how to create proper models or uv maps.



#31 nweissberg   Members   -  Reputation: 170

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 10:05 AM


You make a solid point here. Problem with this is that blender is free and easy to use so the COMMON non-professional gets their hands on this program and creates the issue stated above. The OP's question was should it be used for gamedev, and while I believe the tool can be used to do so I hate it as a standard because the common person ( most indie people ) don't know how to create proper models or uv maps.

+1

I agree, nice reply!



#32 Tutorial Doctor   Members   -  Reputation: 1630

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 05:06 PM

One thing I know about a true artist, it doesn't matter what tool is used, as long as the tool is usable they can make a masterpiece with it. My brother always says, "I hate artists man, they are good at everything."

What he is saying is that everywhere there is art, there is also good art. At one point I was so broke that I only had clay to paint with. I painted a portrait with it.

The whole "quick filters" thing is true though. I see so many photoshop tutorials that are just "this filter, that filter, done." But the principles of art are lost along with it.

If a person has the principles down, I am sure they can do good modeling and Uv unwrapping and such in Blender or Maya or Max or some random abandoned software.

Now, the indie devs who started as a hobby and were forced to use Blender to make games, and perhaps never learned proper techniques for making game models, might be the ones who don't know proper techniques, but this would apply to those who use Max or Maya without proper techiniques also.


Edited by Tutorial Doctor, 20 March 2014 - 08:31 PM.

They call me the Tutorial Doctor.


#33 jbadams   Senior Staff   -  Reputation: 18734

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 12:06 AM

You make a solid point here. Problem with this is that blender is free and easy to use so the COMMON non-professional gets their hands on this program and creates the issue stated above. The OP's question was should it be used for gamedev, and while I believe the tool can be used to do so I hate it as a standard because the common person ( most indie people ) don't know how to create proper models or uv maps.

Maybe a good article topic for someone suitably qualified and with the time to write it: common beginner mistakes with Blender.

If the software were more complicated or less readily available then perhaps these people wouldn't be making the mistakes, but that ship has long since sailed; the option now is to try to better educate people so that these mistakes are less common.

#34 Ashaman73   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 7573

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 12:56 AM


You sure as hell don't now but you sure did back then. Everybody who had access to a computer could make cool clipart webpages but it doesn't mean they knew anything about making a real website. The same could be said for Photoshop and the people who use filters to make "cool flame art" but have no idea what the filter is actually doing and most of their work looks generic and cant be used for anything other than a silly signature on a forum page.

This actually goes deeper than just blender if you really wanted to get into it. It is the whole concept that the further we advance in technology the more we loose in basic knowledge and skill. I wont bore you with the details here and we can discuss in private or in another thread if you wished... but the point is this is MY opinion of the program.

Your personal option, that a tool is useful or not, is ok. But to tell people, that a certain tool results in bad artists, is just BS. You blame a tool, because it is too easy to use ? You blame it, because it is too inexpensive ? You blame a tool, because some unskilled people try to make art with it ?

 

Come on, don't blame the tool for being popular and used by hobby/indie artists a lot. I use blender and my art is sub-decent, so, if I get maya my art will suddenly get a professional touch ? blink.png

 

 


You make a solid point here. Problem with this is that blender is free and easy to use so the COMMON non-professional gets their hands on this program and creates the issue stated above. The OP's question was should it be used for gamedev, and while I believe the tool can be used to do so I hate it as a standard because the common person ( most indie people ) don't know how to create proper models or uv maps.

This really sounds like a personal bad experience taken as a reason for a common rule....

 

Blender is free, blender is good, blender is used in many professional projects and blender users are able to create stunning art, so , yes it is an good option for gamedev on low-budget projects.



#35 riuthamus   Moderators   -  Reputation: 5531

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 08:26 AM


I dont mind blender, i just hate the bad practices it generates for people who start with it.

 

This was the FIRST post I made, not sure how I ever said it was a "Bad tool to not be used for gamedev".

 


I guess the complaint is the program is too easy thus people dont learn the proper methods for creating assets for game development.

 

Again, never said it wasn't a good tool, simply said that it allows for people to skip over the finer points creating issues later on down the road.

 


Your personal option, that a tool is useful or not, is ok. But to tell people, that a certain tool results in bad artists, is just BS.

 

This is 100% opinion. I already said that I do not mind the tool or the use of it; rather I despise the fact that the common person who uses it never needs to take the time to learn the proper methods for good, smooth, art production. I NEVER SAID you couldn't make good art, or that the quality of the art was bad. I said that the program allowed for people to skip past the finer details that allow for the work to be used within game development.

 


Come on, don't blame the tool for being popular and used by hobby/indie artists a lot. I use blender and my art is sub-decent, so, if I get maya my art will suddenly get a professional touch ? blink.png

 

If you actually took the time to learn maya and make models with it, yes your work would become more professional.

 


This really sounds like a personal bad experience taken as a reason for a common rule....

 

Bad experience(s) is what dictates thought and opinion to begin with. I am sorry you don't like my opinion, but the thread is about sharing your thoughts and that is exactly what I have done. From the sounds of it you seem offended by my comments. Perhaps you feel that I think less of those people who use Blender ( which I dont ) and that is why you are acting this way. All I am saying is that my default reaction to a person who uses blender is skeptical at best!



#36 Serapth   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 5485

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:20 PM

 

You make a solid point here. Problem with this is that blender is free and easy to use so the COMMON non-professional gets their hands on this program and creates the issue stated above. The OP's question was should it be used for gamedev, and while I believe the tool can be used to do so I hate it as a standard because the common person ( most indie people ) don't know how to create proper models or uv maps.

Maybe a good article topic for someone suitably qualified and with the time to write it: common beginner mistakes with Blender.

If the software were more complicated or less readily available then perhaps these people wouldn't be making the mistakes, but that ship has long since sailed; the option now is to try to better educate people so that these mistakes are less common.

 

 

This again smacks untrue to me, as every single beginner mistake I could see making in Blender is applicable in Maya or Max as well.   The biggest mistake with modelling is probably the lack of clean edge loops and use of nGons.  All three programs allow that.  As for UVmap, hell, Blender probably is the best tool in that regard.



#37 riuthamus   Moderators   -  Reputation: 5531

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:43 PM


This again smacks untrue to me, as every single beginner mistake I could see making in Blender is applicable in Maya or Max as well. The biggest mistake with modelling is probably the lack of clean edge loops and use of nGons. All three programs allow that. As for UVmap, hell, Blender probably is the best tool in that regard.

 

While true, most people who pick up maya dont just run in and make stuff. Those who do find that they will have a hard time obtaining anything they really desire and that only through some form of tutorial will they gain any real knowledge of how maya works. It is through these tutorials that they learn about these things ( not always but often since most people giving tutorials speak of it ).

 

With blender my 10 year old cousin came in and made something pretty decent for his first time ever using the program and never had to read any documentation. When he sent me the files to look over I noticed most of the common mistakes made by people who have no training and wondered how he was able to make such a model but with all these simple mistakes. I asked him what tool he used and then did some research. Installed it and found out that 100% indeed you could create some pretty good stuff with a tool that required little to no training to operate. I was impressed and concerned at the same time.

 

If your goal is to make art to make art than tools such as blender are amazing. I repeat, I DO NOT have an issue with blender specfically just the behavior that begates the simplicity of the program. This is no faut of the program itself but rather an over simplification of things so that EVERYBODY can use these tools. This is my mindset and there is possibly very little that would change that viewpoint. I agree 100% that the tool can be used for some great things.



#38 nweissberg   Members   -  Reputation: 170

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 03:48 PM


This again smacks untrue to me, as every single beginner mistake I could see making in Blender is applicable in Maya or Max as well.   The biggest mistake with modelling is probably the lack of clean edge loops and use of nGons.  All three programs allow that.  As for UVmap, hell, Blender probably is the best tool in that regard.

Even thou this is true, Blender is new to the nGon topology, Ive been using it for years, and only on it's 2.5+ version it was made possible.

 

There are many games made using blender one exemple is ColorCube it was the first blender game made comercial! Só answering the forums question, YES Blender is awesome for game development!

Here are some other examples:

ColorCube

 

Elpis the game (My game WIP)

 

Yo Frankie! (Blender Foundation)

 

Krum (WIP)

 

Dead Cyborg (this is on steams green light)

 

Lucy and the Time Machine (wins blender 2010 game contest)

 

And the list goes on...

These are just to name a few!


Edited by nweissberg, 21 March 2014 - 04:20 PM.


#39 Serapth   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 5485

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Posted 22 March 2014 - 09:50 AM

 


This again smacks untrue to me, as every single beginner mistake I could see making in Blender is applicable in Maya or Max as well. The biggest mistake with modelling is probably the lack of clean edge loops and use of nGons. All three programs allow that. As for UVmap, hell, Blender probably is the best tool in that regard.

 

While true, most people who pick up maya dont just run in and make stuff. Those who do find that they will have a hard time obtaining anything they really desire and that only through some form of tutorial will they gain any real knowledge of how maya works. It is through these tutorials that they learn about these things ( not always but often since most people giving tutorials speak of it ).

 

With blender my 10 year old cousin came in and made something pretty decent for his first time ever using the program and never had to read any documentation. When he sent me the files to look over I noticed most of the common mistakes made by people who have no training and wondered how he was able to make such a model but with all these simple mistakes. I asked him what tool he used and then did some research. Installed it and found out that 100% indeed you could create some pretty good stuff with a tool that required little to no training to operate. I was impressed and concerned at the same time.

 

If your goal is to make art to make art than tools such as blender are amazing. I repeat, I DO NOT have an issue with blender specfically just the behavior that begates the simplicity of the program. This is no faut of the program itself but rather an over simplification of things so that EVERYBODY can use these tools. This is my mindset and there is possibly very little that would change that viewpoint. I agree 100% that the tool can be used for some great things.

 

 

 

I am a bit confused by your argument.  I dont really get what Blender does to make the tool accessible that Max and Maya dont.  Quite literally the only difference I can think, and the crux of what you seem to be talking about, is simply the fact that Blender is free and thus anyone can try it.  Since you have a larger pool of uneducated users, you get a larger pool of uneducated results.

 

 

This seems like a ...  rather poor reason to judge a program.  Or am I misunderstanding you where?



#40 JTippetts   Moderators   -  Reputation: 8508

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Posted 22 March 2014 - 10:04 AM

Seems like we might need a 3D Modeler War tag in addition to our Language War tag.






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