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Respect for the player. Forgetting violence fetishism. Exploration. Notgame?


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#1 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 05:54 AM

I am prototyping a "non-traditional" game about free exploration without arbitrary limitations. Deterministic algorithms enable a procedural universe (potentially infinite) with minimal system requirements for the player. In the vein of abolishing arbitrary restrictions, I am using WebGL to allow anyone with a browser to play it, eschewing platform restrictions.

You control an organic entity through space. The universe is still young, unstable after the big bang. The laws of physics are having trouble making up their mind, putting space and time in an uncertain and malleable state. You encounter not only planetary systems, black holes and nebulae, but irregular, strangely behaving clumps of matter. As with all things in the world, you can only travel very close to the speed of light, but incoherencies in the curvature of space allow you to seemingly cover immense distances of space in seconds.

You are encouraged to pick a direction and interact with the world as you see fit. Rather than leading the player with a carrot on a stick, the experience seeks to evoke feelings of wonder, immersion and joy. The universe is alive, responsive and vibrant, inspired by the what-ifs and unproven theories of astronomy. It is enthusiastic about your presence.

I enjoy when there is trust and respect between player and developer. A sort of mutual understanding. My goal is to treat player as the intelligent, emotional beings they are. I am also very interested in including some level of persistence in the universe (not an MMO), in the manner of allowing player behaviour to result in data used to drive changes to the universe, allowing the algorithms to mutate themselves. This kind of world excites me, because even as the developer, I can never discover everything it is capable of.


Edited by Reruined, 12 July 2014 - 05:59 AM.
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#2 ShiftyCake   Members   -  Reputation: 569

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:33 AM


I am also very interested in including some level of persistence in the universe (not an MMO), in the manner of allowing player behaviour to result in data used to drive changes to the universe, allowing the algorithms to mutate themselves. This kind of world excites me, because even as the developer, I can never discover everything it is capable of.

 

I'd explain this more in-depth, this is what captured my interest (I'm not aiming to join the project however).


If, at any point, what I post is hard to understand, tell me. I am bad at projecting my thoughts into real words, so I appreciate the knowledge that I need to edit my post.

 

I am not a professional writer, nor a professional game designer. Please, understand that everything you read is simply an opinion of mind and should not, at any point in time, be taken as a credible answer unless validated by others.

 

I do take brief bouts of disappearance so don't worry if I either don't reply to you or miss certain things. I am quite a lazy fellow.


#3 Tom Sloper   Moderators   -  Reputation: 10159

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:44 AM

Respect for the player. Forgetting violence fetishism. Exploration. Notgame?


It doesn't matter that some people might say it's "not a game." The concept is viable. By the way, I deleted the recruitment wording from your original post, because we don't permit recruiting in the discussion forums. Good luck with your project!
-- Tom Sloper
Sloperama Productions
Making games fun and getting them done.
www.sloperama.com

Please do not PM me. My email address is easy to find, but note that I do not give private advice.

#4 Orymus3   Crossbones+   -  Reputation: 10630

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 08:24 AM

Probably deals with a niche of potential players, but these are players nonetheless.

Good luck.



#5 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 09:54 AM

 


I am also very interested in including some level of persistence in the universe (not an MMO), in the manner of allowing player behaviour to result in data used to drive changes to the universe, allowing the algorithms to mutate themselves. This kind of world excites me, because even as the developer, I can never discover everything it is capable of.

 

I'd explain this more in-depth, this is what captured my interest (I'm not aiming to join the project however).

 

Absolutely. Creating discussion is as important to me as finding collaborators.

 

I'll try to explain an example. Let's assume that a process periodically collects player data, such as their time spent in certain locations. This data can then be used to assign a weight to the most popular/unpopular locations, letting the algorithm generate more (or less, depending on what you are after) objects in that area. Maybe the temperature of nearby suns increases.

 

Another example would be a cosmic event, such as a supernova. If, during the explosion, many players perish, the star will be reborn larger and hotter than it was before its death, subsequently affecting other nearby celestial bodies. If, on the contrary, nobody perishes, the star may instead scatter its matter across the universe, providing more energy for other distant star systems.

 

Note that you still play locally, on your computer. There is just a process that sends data to a central server at infrequent intervals. When travelling, you download the few bytes of relevant player data for your location, altering how the game looks like for you. This kind of loose coupling requires not even a fraction of MMO infrastructure, maybe even less than a regular multiplayer game.

 

I am still in the process of prototyping and figuring out how viable all of this is. But I hope to inspire some discussion and new ideas in the meantime :D

 

 

Probably deals with a niche of potential players, but these are players nonetheless.

Good luck.

Definitely. I am making the kind of experience I personally want. My ideal is to include anybody (gamer or non-gamer) in being able to play, but not to appeal to a mass market.


Less is more, more or less


#6 ShiftyCake   Members   -  Reputation: 569

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 10:09 PM


Absolutely. Creating discussion is as important to me as finding collaborators.
 
I'll try to explain an example. Let's assume that a process periodically collects player data, such as their time spent in certain locations. This data can then be used to assign a weight to the most popular/unpopular locations, letting the algorithm generate more (or less, depending on what you are after) objects in that area. Maybe the temperature of nearby suns increases.
 
Another example would be a cosmic event, such as a supernova. If, during the explosion, many players perish, the star will be reborn larger and hotter than it was before its death, subsequently affecting other nearby celestial bodies. If, on the contrary, nobody perishes, the star may instead scatter its matter across the universe, providing more energy for other distant star systems.
 
Note that you still play locally, on your computer. There is just a process that sends data to a central server at infrequent intervals. When travelling, you download the few bytes of relevant player data for your location, altering how the game looks like for you. This kind of loose coupling requires not even a fraction of MMO infrastructure, maybe even less than a regular multiplayer game.
 
I am still in the process of prototyping and figuring out how viable all of this is. But I hope to inspire some discussion and new ideas in the meantime

 

You'll still need to have constant online streaming to implement it however. i'd recommend making it optional in your settings, as a game that's predominately offline should be able to be played in offline.

 

Or you could make it simpler. If there is no access to the internet it simply doesn't update. It could check at regular intervals to see if the internet is back up or not, and act accordingly. It'd be seamless and no-one would be the wiser, it might make the players feel more involved in the world and think of it more as a world then a game, as they wont know the cause of the changes in the atmosphere.


If, at any point, what I post is hard to understand, tell me. I am bad at projecting my thoughts into real words, so I appreciate the knowledge that I need to edit my post.

 

I am not a professional writer, nor a professional game designer. Please, understand that everything you read is simply an opinion of mind and should not, at any point in time, be taken as a credible answer unless validated by others.

 

I do take brief bouts of disappearance so don't worry if I either don't reply to you or miss certain things. I am quite a lazy fellow.


#7 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 11 July 2014 - 05:48 AM

 


Absolutely. Creating discussion is as important to me as finding collaborators.
 
I'll try to explain an example. Let's assume that a process periodically collects player data, such as their time spent in certain locations. This data can then be used to assign a weight to the most popular/unpopular locations, letting the algorithm generate more (or less, depending on what you are after) objects in that area. Maybe the temperature of nearby suns increases.
 
Another example would be a cosmic event, such as a supernova. If, during the explosion, many players perish, the star will be reborn larger and hotter than it was before its death, subsequently affecting other nearby celestial bodies. If, on the contrary, nobody perishes, the star may instead scatter its matter across the universe, providing more energy for other distant star systems.
 
Note that you still play locally, on your computer. There is just a process that sends data to a central server at infrequent intervals. When travelling, you download the few bytes of relevant player data for your location, altering how the game looks like for you. This kind of loose coupling requires not even a fraction of MMO infrastructure, maybe even less than a regular multiplayer game.
 
I am still in the process of prototyping and figuring out how viable all of this is. But I hope to inspire some discussion and new ideas in the meantime

 

You'll still need to have constant online streaming to implement it however. i'd recommend making it optional in your settings, as a game that's predominately offline should be able to be played in offline.

 

Or you could make it simpler. If there is no access to the internet it simply doesn't update. It could check at regular intervals to see if the internet is back up or not, and act accordingly. It'd be seamless and no-one would be the wiser, it might make the players feel more involved in the world and think of it more as a world then a game, as they wont know the cause of the changes in the atmosphere.

 

Of course. Implementation details such as this crop up during development, but for now there are more pressing issues such as: Will it be meaningful? Will it matter? What kind of data should be collected? How far should I let the world change? How will people feel about having their in-game behaviour be tracked?

 

The semi-persistence part of the project is a non-essential feature I am leaving for later, as it exists to enhance the existing core design principles, rather than make or break them. The cherry on top, if you will. But I am happy that the subject interests you so smile.png


Edited by Reruined, 11 July 2014 - 05:48 AM.

Less is more, more or less


#8 klefebz   Members   -  Reputation: 244

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 04:02 AM

My first thought is that it sounds like Minecraft creative mode in outer space.

 

Now, how do people interact with the world? Is it possible to modify it? Can you create solar systems or terraform planets?

From your description I dont really know what does the player do in this game.

 

 

I enjoy when there is trust and respect between player and developer. A sort of mutual understanding. My goal is to treat the player as the intelligent, emotional being she is.

 

Are you assuming other developers dont treat their players as such? Also, are you trying to target the game to women specifically?

 

If you want to treat the player as an intelling being you should put some mental challenge, like puzzles or something. If you want to go for the emotional aspect, put something the player can relate and attach to. I think its hard to attach to some stars, planets and space phenomenon, unless they have inhabitants, but I could be wrong.

 

Finally, what other games have you played before?


I don't play MMOs because I would become addicted

#9 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 06:36 AM


My first thought is that it sounds like Minecraft creative mode in outer space.



Now, how do people interact with the world? Is it possible to modify it? Can you create solar systems or terraform planets?

From your description I dont really know what does the player do in this game.

 

I am still figuring out exactly what the player can do, it's important that any kind of interaction is intrinsic to the theme (which I guess could be condensed to 'the wonder of exploring a world of astronomic weirdness'). The game is mostly about exploration, but I do know that the best kind of exploration is when you can touch and turn and prod at your environment and everything in it. I am considering simple eco-systems, primitive forms of life, with very simple input and outputs, that the player can knowingly or accidentally use for various purposes. I would love to hear any thoughts you might have, even negative.

 

 

 


Are you assuming other developers dont treat their players [with respect]?

 

As a small developer, there is a limit to what you can focus on. Every developer does not have the need, willingness, or resources, to create a bond with the player in a way that doesn't directly translate to more sales. There is also a somewhat common pattern in large productions (that I thankfully don't see as much of in smaller budget titles) to handhold the player excessively, through constant objective prompts or restricting the player to solving a particular problem in one specific way. I don't see that as giving the player much respect. Sometimes the developer has no choice because of project constraints, but in my specific game it is core to the game design process to respect the player.

 

 

 


Also, are you trying to target the game to women specifically?

 

I am taking the approach of making the game available to as many "target groups" as possible, but not targeting a specific one. It is designed after what my team would enjoy having in a game. But I have edited my initial post to clear that misunderstanding.

 

 

 


If you want to treat the player as an intelling being you should put some mental challenge, like puzzles or something. If you want to go for the emotional aspect, put something the player can relate and attach to. I think its hard to attach to some stars, planets and space phenomenon, unless they have inhabitants, but I could be wrong.

 

The human intellect is not all about solving problems and challenges, we are very multi-faceted beings who differ greatly in what brings us pleasure and satisfaction. I personally find it important to pause to consider the universe and my own existence, a healthy practice in our fast-paced modern world. I like going out in a random unexplored direction, just for the joy of seeing new places, or trying out and experimenting with new systems, to see how they will react. This is mostly what the game is about, difficult as it is for me to put into words.

 

 

 


Finally, what other games have you played before?

 

Gaming has been a large part of my life, and as a result I have played most kind of games since the Nintendo 64 and Playstation 1. Lately I have been mostly a PC gamer. In my experience, many games that get a lot of attention today follow same-ish principles and design moments... ideas are copied and iterated on until their original visions are barely recognizable. I am thrilled by games that go in a unique direction, making me re-think what I thought was possible to do with video games. This game is my attempt to design a thrilling experience that me and other likeminded people would love, the only way I see that this can happen is if I don't look at what successful games have done in the past. Game design while keeping your head clear of prejudice and preconceptions, if you will.

 

I hope that my answers are satisfactory and that they allow you to peer into my train of thought smile.png. I am happy to incite discussion!


Edited by Reruined, 12 July 2014 - 06:39 AM.

Less is more, more or less


#10 Wavinator   Moderators   -  Reputation: 1825

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Posted 16 July 2014 - 12:41 AM

Although I'm a space game diehard and especially a fan of anything that eschews the "warporn" that seems to make up the vast majority of space games, I'm having trouble giving feedback. Your idea is quite amorphous. I like the newly born universe and potentially strange pockets of physics as well as the idea of player persistence. I think such a grand setting may struggle with having a grand purpose. Open-ended exploration games can be beautiful  in their initial freedom then deadly boring once you exhaust the creative possibilities. With such a positive focus, what about casting the player in the role of curator / protector of this universe, maybe something like the Monolith from Arthur C. Clarke's 2001? Maybe you're some sort of evolved consciousness exploring this universe from another one, and being so far beyond your biological sensibilities you only gain by engineering space-time, uplifting life and discovering the nature of the new universe (which could be inhabited by volition at a fundamental level).

 

Just to further elaborate, you could take the angle expressed by some cosmologists that the universe is inimical to life. Radiation, vacuum, cosmic debris, shifts in the state of matter itself all might be said to constantly threaten life, and life through war, ignorance and stupidity threatens itself. You could make a potentially very poetic game out of being a force of good in such a setting, as the player can't be everywhere and can't save everything, which maybe adds an element of strategy. Depending on how hard you want to make the science, your choices could span millennia, and your actions would shape the universe over epochal time.

 

Even if that's not the direction you want to go it's an interesting idea. I just hope you veer away from some of the cosmic physics puzzle games as just minecraft with stars in a meaningless cosmos devoid of life would be disappointing.


--------------------Just waiting for the mothership...

#11 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 16 July 2014 - 05:15 AM


Although I'm a space game diehard and especially a fan of anything that eschews the "warporn" that seems to make up the vast majority of space games, I'm having trouble giving feedback. Your idea is quite amorphous. I like the newly born universe and potentially strange pockets of physics as well as the idea of player persistence. I think such a grand setting may struggle with having a grand purpose. Open-ended exploration games can be beautiful in their initial freedom then deadly boring once you exhaust the creative possibilities. With such a positive focus, what about casting the player in the role of curator / protector of this universe, maybe something like the Monolith from Arthur C. Clarke's 2001? Maybe you're some sort of evolved consciousness exploring this universe from another one, and being so far beyond your biological sensibilities you only gain by engineering space-time, uplifting life and discovering the nature of the new universe (which could be inhabited by volition at a fundamental level).

 

The player being an evolved consciousness from another universe is in line with what I have in mind for the game and fits well. Bringing up life and inciting activity as a means of discovering/enabling more of the universe sounds exciting to me, and indeed could be part of the solution to the inevitable boredom of exploration games, without casting the player in an explicit role.

 

 

 


Just to further elaborate, you could take the angle expressed by some cosmologists that the universe is inimical to life. Radiation, vacuum, cosmic debris, shifts in the state of matter itself all might be said to constantly threaten life, and life through war, ignorance and stupidity threatens itself. You could make a potentially very poetic game out of being a force of good in such a setting, as the player can't be everywhere and can't save everything, which maybe adds an element of strategy. Depending on how hard you want to make the science, your choices could span millennia, and your actions would shape the universe over epochal time.

 

This would be a good counterpart to players bringing up life, and a way to bring synergy between player persistence and the logic of the world. Whereas I previously thought player persistence to be almost "fluff", this approach makes it more meaningful. The tension between life and death would be very obvious as all player's efforts are combined to reveal more about the world, which is perfectly in sync with my core ideals for the game.

 

Thank you for your inspirational input, Wavinator. Every reply helps me solidify parts of the design.


Edited by Reruined, 16 July 2014 - 05:19 AM.

Less is more, more or less


#12 Thaumaturge   Members   -  Reputation: 1567

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 06:18 PM

This seems like an interesting idea--and a potentially challenging one!

 

As to interactions, one thought that comes to mind--but which admittedly might well not work out--is allowing players to tinker with matter that they encounter--its state, excitation, radiation and absorption, etc.--or perhaps even with localised physical parameters--fundamental constants, etc., then allow things to evolve naturally. In some cases this may lead to blasting a planet bearing nascent life with sterilising radiation, while in others it might lead to wonderous new sights or life forms.

 

Of course, actual physics of this sort is somewhat... complex, and may be a bit much to ask of many players, so perhaps an analgous or simplified system might be in order.

 

This is all somewhat off of the top of my head, however, so take with a grain of salt! ^^;

 

 

... the only way I see that this can happen is if I don't look at what successful games have done in the past. Game design while keeping your head clear of prejudice and preconceptions, if you will.

I'm not entirely sure that I agree, but I do believe that I understand the desire that you're expressing. But I don't intend to argue that at the moment; instead, I want to mention that one thing that I do think is likely to be useful--especially for so experimental a game--is to look for and study games that attempted similar mechanics or themes, but that failed. In particular, try to determine what issues they encountered, and address those as called for.

 

In short, even if you don't look at extant successful games, I do suggest looking at unsuccessful ones.

 

I'm not sure of what games might be applicable to your project, but if none occur to you then I do think that it might be worth doing some research; simply asking on fora for examples of similar games might be a starting point. Such games might well be few, but I imagine that at least some applicable games have been attempted before.


Edited by Thaumaturge, 19 July 2014 - 06:20 PM.

MWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!


#13 Mratthew   Members   -  Reputation: 1581

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 11:15 AM

Unlike you're design this project stills adheres to a lot of the basics found in other games, many of your ideas remind me of the game No Man's Sky currently in production by Hello Games. If you haven't seen it already you should take a look at that project and consider how you want to differ from that ambitious project. I'd imagine sharing your game related influences and explaining how you want your project to stand out would help get more pointed feedback.

 

I'm personally curious. What is the player's character? Can you describe this organic entity?

 

I'm not entirely sure what the player is challenged with in your game design. However I'd like to point out that, its simple to assume combat games are just "warporn" it's important to note the challenge of achieving victory in combat has a goal that reaches beyond combat and deals with conflict at its core. Sun Tsu the Art of War describes the ideal strategy as "taking whole" or the idea of reaching victory beyond combat by knowing victory over conflict itself instead of just knowing victory over your "enemy". Although it's hard to see this in most combat games, it exists in all of them. We learn a lot about a person by "fighting" them. In a game that doesn't explicitly explore war directly, you might think you are somehow above it. But conflict is what makes our universe interesting to explore and is at the heart of any challenge and even puzzle. If the player has control over any physical matter in the game, they will be exploring conflict in an attempt to "leave their mark". To respect humans as emotional is to respect our "lower brain" or the more conflict prone part of our brain that evolved earliest. That part of our brain will do anything to survive. Be sure to consider that in your design.

 

Respect players by knowing that they game to meet challenge safely but still crave the raw intensity of it feeling dangerous.



#14 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 03:52 PM

Thanks for the replies, always boosts my motivation :).

 

Below I have tried to compile a summary of how I believe my game stands out. Keep in mind that we're discussing an early prototype, with a lot of malleable parts, as I am hoping that this thread will help me bring the ideas into a tangible shape. Being alone on the project, I lack anyone to juggle thoughts with, but thanks to the awesome gamedev.net community all hope is not lost!

 

My intention is to focus on what happens between the planets, rather than on them. No Man's Sky is a fresh and vast game which has inspired me from the start, but from what I can gather a large part of it takes part on the surface of planets. I would really like to explore the dangers and anomalies of deep uncharted space, the precautions you need to take to avoid being sucked into a black hole, colliding with a planet or moon, being engulfed by exploding suns, exotic hungry lifeforms mistaking your ship for a meal, or contradictions in logic frying your ship's computer.

 

In EvE online, there are hidden pockets of space with old relics and databankthings which you can access with special equipment. I would really like to expand on this concept. Not to mention the pirates looking for easy prey, keeping you on your toes.

 

I feel stupid for doing little to clarify my viewpoint on combat and player challenge. I often feel that games trivialize combat, making it part of a repetitive routine. I prefer an experience where combat is exilirating and terrifying, getting my adrenaline pumping and requiring my complete focus. In Chivalry, your weapon has great consequence. With a single swing, you can decapitate an enemy (or enemies), or mortally wound your teammates. I absolutely love this and cannot put the game down wub.png .

 

Judging from official footage, ELITE has an approach of including the environment in combat, inviting you to lure your foe into difficult to navigate asteroid fields and such. It is this kind of environmental hazard I would like to take further, defending yourself from the laws of physics rather than bloodthirsty sentient beings. I am attracted to Thaumaturge's thought that the universe is harmful to life, but players can help raise it.

 

Additionally, The Binding of Isaac and FTL are good single-player examples that force you into thinking before engaging, the risk being that you lose all assets and time invested in the game. The way I would like to handle player (im)permanence is to limit the assets the player can acquire, such as gear/experience points, but have death be permanent, a pattern seen in the games I just mentioned. The goal is to make the world interesting enough for interacting with/manipulating it to be a reward in itself, rather than provide arbitrary in-game rewards. I am thinking that if the player dies in an interesting place and he can keep the coordinates of his death, he can attempt to enter that region again (or go off in a different direction and explore something else). Maybe I am naïve in my approach, but this kind of reward is what keeps me playing Dear Esther, Proteus and Bientôt l'été. Some game worlds I enjoy exploring, but layers of arbitrary game mechanics break immersion and stand in the way.

 

I am not leaving combat out of the equation in my game, I see it as a terrifying rarity. When attacked in an unknown space, you cannot know what is going to happen. This happens in Amnesia and Dead Space. Using weapons for defense is a valid option, potentially eliminating the threat completely, but you are risking your life by not running. If the player has the potential to be malicious with his weapons, such as performing genocide, I would like that to have a consequence intrinsic to how the game works.

 

Naturally, the project is ambitious and out-of-scope at this point. I want to leave alternatives open for discussion with strangers on the internet, to inspire and be inspired. When I find out what appeals the most to me, I will pick a direction and base the game on that. For now, I am playing around with prototypes and really enjoying this friendly community :).


Less is more, more or less


#15 Mratthew   Members   -  Reputation: 1581

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 05:29 PM

I'm pretty fond of the idea of playing with physics. I feel like so many games touch on physics or play at implementing physics however orbital physics is a true challenge to fly and use. Even just exploring the use of orbital mechanics to sling shot or decelerate from extreme speeds on the approach to a solar system could be pretty exciting. What types of thrust and ways of moving through space and time have you been thinking of exploring? 

 

The super complicated thrust based control system of Star Citizen is very impressive though I think it's a bit of an engineers wet dream more so then a players. Since for the player all it really means is figuring out the limitations it presents. I'm not sure what types of controls your game would present to the player to navigate the universe but I would seriously mull over the ways the player could/would do this as this represents the way your player connects with your presentation and is the way the player expresses and communicates their feelings about the experience which can even be deciding factor on the directions the game takes as you prototype the project. 



#16 valrus   Members   -  Reputation: 773

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 08:54 PM

It's be great to be some immense being, trans-universal or trans-dimensional, shepherding life through the cosmos, or not, as the whim takes me.  Maybe like a benevolent Orz, with each instance of me just being my transdimensional fingertip pressing through into conventional spacetime.

 

As a mechanic, it'd be interesting to be able to manipulate the fabric of space -- to stretch and squeeze it to achieve various ends.  For example, to make a gravity well in a dust cloud that will eventually become a star.  Or to deflect a war fleet away from the cradle of life that you've been protecting.  Or to subtly guide a colonization ship to an appropriate new home.  Maybe if you make a well deep enough it goes through entirely: if the structure of this universe is (say) very folded and convoluted, you could maybe "dig" deep enough to come out on the other side of the fold, creating wormholes.

 

It could even be how you move (the area around the cursor becomes a temporary gravity well and you fall towards it).  



#17 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 04:07 AM

It's be great to be some immense being, trans-universal or trans-dimensional, shepherding life through the cosmos, or not, as the whim takes me.  Maybe like a benevolent Orz, with each instance of me just being my transdimensional fingertip pressing through into conventional spacetime.

 

As a mechanic, it'd be interesting to be able to manipulate the fabric of space -- to stretch and squeeze it to achieve various ends.  For example, to make a gravity well in a dust cloud that will eventually become a star.  Or to deflect a war fleet away from the cradle of life that you've been protecting.  Or to subtly guide a colonization ship to an appropriate new home.  Maybe if you make a well deep enough it goes through entirely: if the structure of this universe is (say) very folded and convoluted, you could maybe "dig" deep enough to come out on the other side of the fold, creating wormholes.

 

It could even be how you move (the area around the cursor becomes a temporary gravity well and you fall towards it).  

Yes! A great, immense (but humble) being from another world. I would like to play on the idea that we (humans) are great beings to start with, who can affect the world dramatically, knowingly or unknowingly. Playing with the very folds and fabrics of space and time is an appealing thought, "digging" out wormholes would be a very different mode of transportation ;). Have you got any other ruminations on the consequences of playing engineer with the void itself?


Edited by Reruined, 21 July 2014 - 04:07 AM.

Less is more, more or less


#18 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 04:24 AM

I'm pretty fond of the idea of playing with physics. I feel like so many games touch on physics or play at implementing physics however orbital physics is a true challenge to fly and use. Even just exploring the use of orbital mechanics to sling shot or decelerate from extreme speeds on the approach to a solar system could be pretty exciting. What types of thrust and ways of moving through space and time have you been thinking of exploring? 

 

The super complicated thrust based control system of Star Citizen is very impressive though I think it's a bit of an engineers wet dream more so then a players. Since for the player all it really means is figuring out the limitations it presents. I'm not sure what types of controls your game would present to the player to navigate the universe but I would seriously mull over the ways the player could/would do this as this represents the way your player connects with your presentation and is the way the player expresses and communicates their feelings about the experience which can even be deciding factor on the directions the game takes as you prototype the project. 

I've prototyped systems with newtonian physics, making movement behave more or less like it would in space and having the ship consisting of separate modules that all require power from the reactor, etc. If you, for example, pushed the engine too hard, the ship become unresponsive due to low power (power would be routed from the side thrusters or from the weapons to the main rear thruster, if you were going for max forward velocity).

 

This was indeed more fun to develop than it was to play, so I am keeping controls simple. The mouse cursor starts out in the middle of the screen, if you move it right or left it will cause your ship to rotate around the Up axis and the distance of the mouse cursor from the center decides the velocity of the rotation. This is taken straight from Star Wars Galaxies: Jump to Lightspeed (I believe Freelancer has a similar mode of control). Holding down LMB accelerates your ship, RMB decelerates. Holding down both simultaneously will take your ship to a full stop. My ideal is for the control scheme to be understandable even by people inexperienced with computers/computer games and aid you rather than fight you, I love it when an interface just works, as if my in-game representation were a physical extension of myself. After I have prototyped more features, I'll probably have a better idea of the specific requirements.


Edited by Reruined, 21 July 2014 - 04:26 AM.

Less is more, more or less


#19 valrus   Members   -  Reputation: 773

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 08:34 PM

 

It's be great to be some immense being, trans-universal or trans-dimensional, shepherding life through the cosmos, or not, as the whim takes me.  Maybe like a benevolent Orz, with each instance of me just being my transdimensional fingertip pressing through into conventional spacetime.

 

As a mechanic, it'd be interesting to be able to manipulate the fabric of space -- to stretch and squeeze it to achieve various ends.  For example, to make a gravity well in a dust cloud that will eventually become a star.  Or to deflect a war fleet away from the cradle of life that you've been protecting.  Or to subtly guide a colonization ship to an appropriate new home.  Maybe if you make a well deep enough it goes through entirely: if the structure of this universe is (say) very folded and convoluted, you could maybe "dig" deep enough to come out on the other side of the fold, creating wormholes.

 

It could even be how you move (the area around the cursor becomes a temporary gravity well and you fall towards it).  

Yes! A great, immense (but humble) being from another world. I would like to play on the idea that we (humans) are great beings to start with, who can affect the world dramatically, knowingly or unknowingly. Playing with the very folds and fabrics of space and time is an appealing thought, "digging" out wormholes would be a very different mode of transportation ;). Have you got any other ruminations on the consequences of playing engineer with the void itself?

 

 

Some of Stephen Baxter's sci-fi, like the books in the Xeelee sequence, has some neat ideas about things to do with spacetime engineering.  Like creating impenetrable geometries to protect a cradle of life from a threat, like I think one story takes place on the "interior" surface of a engineered hypersphere, or something like that.  Or getting enough mass -- billions of stellar masses -- to rotate around a point fast enough to rip a hole into another universe.  

 

One species perfected the construction of closed timelike curves and re-engineered its own evolution.  That'd be a crazy way to get new gameplay abilities -- by traveling into the past to tweak your own species' development.



#20 Reruined   Members   -  Reputation: 153

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 01:00 PM

 

 

It's be great to be some immense being, trans-universal or trans-dimensional, shepherding life through the cosmos, or not, as the whim takes me.  Maybe like a benevolent Orz, with each instance of me just being my transdimensional fingertip pressing through into conventional spacetime.

 

As a mechanic, it'd be interesting to be able to manipulate the fabric of space -- to stretch and squeeze it to achieve various ends.  For example, to make a gravity well in a dust cloud that will eventually become a star.  Or to deflect a war fleet away from the cradle of life that you've been protecting.  Or to subtly guide a colonization ship to an appropriate new home.  Maybe if you make a well deep enough it goes through entirely: if the structure of this universe is (say) very folded and convoluted, you could maybe "dig" deep enough to come out on the other side of the fold, creating wormholes.

 

It could even be how you move (the area around the cursor becomes a temporary gravity well and you fall towards it).  

Yes! A great, immense (but humble) being from another world. I would like to play on the idea that we (humans) are great beings to start with, who can affect the world dramatically, knowingly or unknowingly. Playing with the very folds and fabrics of space and time is an appealing thought, "digging" out wormholes would be a very different mode of transportation ;). Have you got any other ruminations on the consequences of playing engineer with the void itself?

 

 

Some of Stephen Baxter's sci-fi, like the books in the Xeelee sequence, has some neat ideas about things to do with spacetime engineering.  Like creating impenetrable geometries to protect a cradle of life from a threat, like I think one story takes place on the "interior" surface of a engineered hypersphere, or something like that.  Or getting enough mass -- billions of stellar masses -- to rotate around a point fast enough to rip a hole into another universe.  

 

One species perfected the construction of closed timelike curves and re-engineered its own evolution.  That'd be a crazy way to get new gameplay abilities -- by traveling into the past to tweak your own species' development.

 

Thank you, I will make sure to check those books out.

 

Right now I'm busy fleshing out specifics of the game, to properly answer important basic questions about how the game universe works... it is time consuming and confusing.


Edited by Reruined, 30 July 2014 - 01:00 PM.

Less is more, more or less





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