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Chun-I

Member Since 13 Aug 2006
Offline Last Active Nov 08 2014 09:15 PM

Posts I've Made

In Topic: The functions on game scoring system

07 February 2014 - 10:25 PM

 

 

These all seem to look at score on the 0 -> infinity or maximum scale.  What about score such as X alignment vs. Y alignment?  Good vs. evil is the most obvious example, with evil being negative, neutral being 0, and good being positive.  But there are many other options, like faction A vs. faction B vs. faction C, with all 3 being positive.  Or in a dating sim, some actions will please one date, some will please all dates, some will please one but displease others, and there can also be checkpoints; for example a checkpoint would be if a date falls in love with the player at a threshold number, the player's score with that date will never go below the threshold number even if he switches to pursuing a second date.

 

Also, what about gauges?  These are scores that fall over time, and the player periodically must do something to raise them so they don't hit 0.  The Sims series is all about this kind of gauge, as are most "babysitting" games.

 

Score can affect available dialogue or action options, then making a dialogue choice or taking an action can change the score, in an interactive story feedback loop.

Thanks for your feedback...
I indeed notice the alignment which you mentioned such as "Black & White". It is composed of "Measurement "(e.g. success, fail, evil, good, strength) ,  "Identity/Role" (e.g. good god, evil god), "Manipulatable" depend on player's behavior, and "Progression"(e.g. being good god or evil god, being dead or alive). Perhaps I should modify "Progression" to "Tendency" should make more sense. 
 
For me, I would say gauge is like alignment as well(e.g. hungry and full, dirty and clean, sleepy and energetic). The difference between these two is it automatically fall or not.
 
The third one you mentioned is interesting! can you give me an example?

 

For progression or tendency, I think of it more as philosophy or personality.  It usually corresponds to the player's pattern of choices within the game, and the player makes that pattern of choices because of their personality or philosophy.  The game (ideally) recognizes the pattern of choices, allowing the game to respond in a way that recognizes the player's personality or philosophy.  Titles are one way that a game recognizes a player's choices and allows the player to label themself so that other players can also see that player's personality or choices.  For example, in the MMO Runes Of Magic there are a wide variety of titles players can earn, then they choose their favorite earned title to display to other players.  Sometimes a titles is earned by accomplishing a single thing within the game, but sometimes it is earned by accumulating a score. (100 levels in a crafting profession, 1,000 kills in PvP, 100 collectibles collected, 1,000,000 coins earned...)

 

Examples of score affecting dialogue options, and dialogue options affecting score.  The Harvest Moon series (and many dating sims) have dialogue or other NPC interaction options that only become available once the player has built a minimum relationship score with that NPC.  But, if a player can repeatedly take the same action toward an NPC, the value of that action can change depending on the player's relationship score with that NPC, or the score of number of times the player has already taken the same action.  Skyrim is another game where the player may have completely different options available when talking to an NPC depending on their previous actions in the game (which the game "remembers" by scoring them).  There are many games where you have to gather XP within a faction to get awarded a rank within that faction to gain access to speak to NPC members of that faction; then when you speak to them you might please them and gain more score with that faction or you might betray or offend them and lose score with that faction.

 

Score is very much like the memory of a game, actually.  That's why poker chips or other tokens were first invented for gambling, to remember who had won or lost how much money.  The score of a game like baseball is recorded on a timeline of innings, like a historical record.  And score in pinball and other early games was the method by which the top player could write their initials in the game, as a marker of conquered territory or social dominance.

 

 
I agree with the point of philosophy or personality, that's one of the reasons why I interested in scoring systems. The game designer design the score, but the player consider the score to be a different meaning. I will make a survey after collecting scoring functions, it will help me to further analyze the dimensions of the scoring system.
 
Yep, relationship score seems common on many games. However, it still seems to add meaning on progression, measurement, and status. It doesn't seem to be a function.
But score has a "Concealed" function that can't be seen or be conscious, I think it make sense.

In Topic: The functions on game scoring system

07 February 2014 - 09:39 PM

 

 

 

How does the score abstraction of "loot" fit into your taxonomy? Many games are built around using items as score.


What do you meant by "loot"?

 
'loot' is game slang for taking items and money off of dead enemies, out of treasure chests, and from other defeated or discovered sources of wealth.
"Loot usually refers to treasure or wealth that is found or stolen; see looting." - Wikipedia
 

I agree with this; normally I think of loot not including money, only items, and also including items rewarded for quests, but that's a minor detail.  Related to the idea of loot is the idea of "vendor trash".  This means an items which has no use within the game except to be turned in to a vendor NPC for a small amount of money.  The game simply rewards players with items instead of money for flavor (and realism, since killing an animal wouldn't logically yield coins).

 

 

 

 

 

How does the score abstraction of "loot" fit into your taxonomy? Many games are built around using items as score.


What do you meant by "loot"?

 
'loot' is game slang for taking items and money off of dead enemies, out of treasure chests, and from other defeated or discovered sources of wealth.
"Loot usually refers to treasure or wealth that is found or stolen; see looting." - Wikipedia
 

I agree with this; normally I think of loot not including money, only items, and also including items rewarded for quests, but that's a minor detail.  Related to the idea of loot is the idea of "vendor trash".  This means an items which has no use within the game except to be turned in to a vendor NPC for a small amount of money.  The game simply rewards players with items instead of money for flavor (and realism, since killing an animal wouldn't logically yield coins).

 

 

 

 

 

How does the score abstraction of "loot" fit into your taxonomy? Many games are built around using items as score.


What do you meant by "loot"?

 
'loot' is game slang for taking items and money off of dead enemies, out of treasure chests, and from other defeated or discovered sources of wealth.
"Loot usually refers to treasure or wealth that is found or stolen; see looting." - Wikipedia
 

I agree with this; normally I think of loot not including money, only items, and also including items rewarded for quests, but that's a minor detail.  Related to the idea of loot is the idea of "vendor trash".  This means an items which has no use within the game except to be turned in to a vendor NPC for a small amount of money.  The game simply rewards players with items instead of money for flavor (and realism, since killing an animal wouldn't logically yield coins).

 

I am not sure whether I misunderstood the meaning of "loot", but I think the score is not properly functioned for "loot". In this case, score seems designed for accumulating an item/loot to avoid yielding too much entity in the game. If the score mechanic is removed from them, they don't seem to lose its original meaning. 


In Topic: The functions on game scoring system

07 February 2014 - 12:43 AM

How does the score abstraction of "loot" fit into your taxonomy? Many games are built around using items as score. 

What do you meant by "loot"? Is that the meaning of the score which is used to represent an item?
Sorry for my bad English.

In Topic: The functions on game scoring system

07 February 2014 - 12:33 AM

Scores can be competitively (Player A has more score than Player B, so Player A is winning) either as the metric of winning or to give one player some kind of powerup vs another player.

 

But scores can also be used cooperatively, shared between both players. Maybe they together need to collect X amount of points to progress, or maybe (if score is a currency) they have a shared/pooled currency. Or even experience-wise, some games have both players leveling up together by sharing experience equally (which I personally prefer, rather than one player advancing ahead of the other player).

 

You are right ! Thanks a lot!
I missed  "Competitive", It is common in most of multi-player game.
 
But I can't think about which game has the second function, can you give me an example?

In Topic: The functions on game scoring system

07 February 2014 - 12:28 AM

These all seem to look at score on the 0 -> infinity or maximum scale.  What about score such as X alignment vs. Y alignment?  Good vs. evil is the most obvious example, with evil being negative, neutral being 0, and good being positive.  But there are many other options, like faction A vs. faction B vs. faction C, with all 3 being positive.  Or in a dating sim, some actions will please one date, some will please all dates, some will please one but displease others, and there can also be checkpoints; for example a checkpoint would be if a date falls in love with the player at a threshold number, the player's score with that date will never go below the threshold number even if he switches to pursuing a second date.

 

Also, what about gauges?  These are scores that fall over time, and the player periodically must do something to raise them so they don't hit 0.  The Sims series is all about this kind of gauge, as are most "babysitting" games.

 

Score can affect available dialogue or action options, then making a dialogue choice or taking an action can change the score, in an interactive story feedback loop.

Thanks for your feedback...
I indeed notice the alignment which you mentioned such as "Black & White". It is composed of "Measurement "(e.g. success, fail, evil, good, strength) ,  "Identity/Role" (e.g. good god, evil god), "Manipulatable" depend on player's behavior, and "Progression"(e.g. being good god or evil god, being dead or alive). Perhaps I should modify "Progression" to "Tendency" should make more sense. 
 
For me, I would say gauge is like alignment as well(e.g. hungry and full, dirty and clean, sleepy and energetic). The difference between these two is it automatically fall or not.
 
The third one you mentioned is interesting! can you give me an example?

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