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Member Since 12 Dec 2012
Offline Last Active Jan 16 2013 10:16 PM

#5018105 Some ideas on what to do with our game

Posted by on 06 January 2013 - 01:43 AM

Because of poor mechanics and lazy modeling... I'm sorry to say it so bluntly, but it's true and it's nothing you can't change.

 The flying, enlargement after eating, minecraft blocks, assault weapon... They are so tacked on. The flight makes it REALLY easy to escape, also, it just looks like someone is in dev mode when they fly. Where are the effects?


It's boring because nobody wants to shoot primitives(cubes, spheres, cylinders) with a pasted on texture using cheap effects....


 This would just be me bashing you if I didn't put in advice and I DO want you to improve your design. 

 Put more effort into the visuals. This is YOUR work, YOUR creative output into the world, are you really proud of how it looks? 

 This world is foreign with odd monsters and odd rules. Throw out the modern weaponry, maybe give them a neat alien blaster, a primitive sling shot, something that goes with YOUR vision. Flying is fun! But not in this game, you are not soaring, you are oddly moving along axis like you're in spectator mode within CS:Source. Have different speeds, gliding, make it more involved. This is flight we're talking about, if you ask someone their chosen superpower it probably would be flight!

 Tie in being airborne with something else. Maybe you fly to high peaks as those are the only habitable places (ground being inhabited by the monsters). You need to fly down to get food, eating TOO MUCH food makes you slow down and if you CARRY too much you won't be able to fly.  Maybe you carve INTO those high peaks, using the dynamic terrain, to make a cave as your home.

 Just some ideas man, I wish the best, please keep us updated.

 I'm serious.

I'll find you.

#5013834 So I have the skill and the ideas, what next?

Posted by on 23 December 2012 - 09:14 PM

 You're thinking too much. Just do it.

 That's all, just do it - do it so you can do it better next time, do it so you can learn, do it for YOURSELF and so you don't become another "would be" game developer.

#5012038 The sandbox mmorpg

Posted by on 18 December 2012 - 07:46 AM

Your asking us details on a concept so generalized, its impossible to do so.
Sandbox is literally "free roam". A concept that the player is given a world, and the choice of what to do with said world. Therefore the only way to make your game successful is by creating "prolonged gameplay + replayability".
This means that the gameplay must be enjoyable over a long period of time, and not lose its fun factor after one playthrough. This is the basis of Sandbox creations, and its the only way to make them successful.

If you wish for a good reference on these sort of games to start you off, either visit Don't Starve or Minecraft. Both are true sandbox games, and will give you an idea of what you can accomplish with them.
And yes, Sandbox games can have an ending to them. But they always give it as a choice, otherwise it would just be a story game. Minecraft does this, with The End, but allows you to play after.
If you want to see more of a strategy-based Sandbox game then a survival-based one, look up Triple Town. It's a simple game, yet elegent, and its concept is as original as it gets. Another one is Age Of Empires. Yes, it is a sandbox game.

He did specify MMO, however, so that changes things up a bit.

A recent one coming out is Darkfall, but that is developed by a lackluster group of individuals. I don't consider it as a serious entry into the market.

The last sandbox MMO I played.. was Eve, I enjoyed it, but it didn't captivate me very long.

I think sandbox MMOs can be great, but honestly OP, I don't see the point in gauging markability/player enjoyment from a section that averages maybe 10 posts per thread. Feedback is FOR the concept, not a precursor TO the concept. Approach this more statistically - look up games that are sandbox MMOs, look at their forums, look at other MMO forums, maybe create a poll on each one?

If that's what you want to make, then make it. Unfortunately, the chance of more than a few people ever playing your game is slim so it gives you a great excuse to ditch popularity and pursue YOUR game. I call it "positive negatives" - be realistic, but still keep things optimistic.

#5011609 My Tentative Idea Thread

Posted by on 17 December 2012 - 03:43 AM

@Tom Sloper - I thought the two threads were significantly different in content.

I'll respond to the Rock Game idea. I'm actually kind of anti-religious, but if I ignore that part the rest of the concept kind of catches my interest. I like "restarting after an apocalypse" settings, or "dropped into a different world with different rules" set-ups. The method of the apocalypse is actually not important to the concept, that's just a bit of cinematography. The main idea here is "Humans failed at an undefined task, so when they are accidentally destroyed the task-setter transforms them into golems for another attempt." The immediate question is, "Why golems? How are they different from humans? Do these differences give us a clue what the task was supposed to be?" It would certainly be possible to make an argument that mechanical bodies would be an improvement on biological ones. I dunno if these golems are supposed to be silicon life forms or what, but they don't seem too different from, say, being a Transformer; which would be a big step up from human, at least in terms of durability, traveling ability, and lifespan. If one were being optimistic, one could assume golems are less vulnerable to disease, less quick to suffer from lack of food/water/air, etc. Can they reproduce? If so, maybe they have more control over that than humans, eliminating unwanted pregnancies and such. (Disclaimer: sunandshadow probably reads too much transformers fanfiction.)

So, okay, golems. But why split into elements? (I'm gonna ignore the gem in the palm thing because I personally think it's tacky, just like when Elemental Gelade did it. I'd be way more awesome if their whole bodies were made of colored crystal anyway.) What do the elements represent? Personality type? The fact that no human being (or golem person) is complete in themselves or even with a single partner, instead it requires a group to really carry out the essential purpose of human society? When these people start fighting against each other, are the immediately heading down the path to failing at their task of they mysterious assigned task? Is this task something the player should care about trying to push their new species toward, and if so, how?

Also, that is an opening scenerio, not in fact a plot at all. You do not have plot holes, you simply don't have a plot yet. It's not a plot without some kind of overall goal, some way for the player to progress at mastering the world (including understanding the whys and how) and using that mastery to do meaningful things that eventually add up to the player "winning at life" somehow. MMOs (which this seems to be) are kinda weak on endings, but the player still needs to have a series of goals while playing (besides get an epic mithril horse mount or diamond eagle flying mount). Mastering one's class or faction abilities, for example, should represent being able to use that class or faction's philosophy to achieve victory over some of the world's problems (and I don't mean by bashing top-levels of different classes or factions over the head). So, basically I think you need to brainstorm some plot here and clarify your theme to take the next step in developing this idea.

Well, the "task-setter" (I love that term by the way) is not that at all. An omniscient creator that realized humans were programmed to fail their expectations and resurrected them from an unjust punishment. They leave the world from a realization that they are not all-knowing. The reason for golems is that since there needs to be a vessel for soul, the only reliable source IS earth as it can handle the multitude of an entire world population. The gems, well, in the opening scene magma is removed and the "transformeration"( Posted Image ) caused a lot of pressure. This is what creates gems in the real world, an over simplified explanation but valid nonetheless. I do agree the palm thing felt a bit "meh".

Now I could use your idea and twist it a bit, to have gem ridden golems. I want to keep those matte tones which a pure crystal golem wouldn't allow and also they'd need to be inbetween rock as the creation OF said gems would not forego the rock body completely. Reasoning for the four elements is just a representation of the simplification within the world due to purity while division still exists. These rock creatures do harbor faint recollections of past, giving way to them separating into groups. Being abandoned by their creators, it IS up to them on how to continue and the direction of a new life is a high conflict point.

It's simply easier, I feel, to embody these groups with different elements. I also like the allusion to almost reverting back to the times of Aristotle, but with a heavy Islamic influence. Not to mention, kingdoms of Earth, Fire, Water, and Air are SOO cool (legend of Zelda style, not Avatar - not a fan of anime at all). The goal of the game is yet to be determined, DEFINITELY not an MMO - I would never seek to create that hassle. For now, I want all my games to be solid singleplayer, as I think MP is a different beast entirely. The placeholder goal is mastering spell craft within ones respective field.

This game would be classless, I'm a subscriber of affiliation and freedom progression, not locking the player into any one thing. I think limitation has it's place, but not within the character.

Thanks for the reply, it revealed a lot of issues and decisions to be made. Very constructive and very helpful, I always look forward to your posts, Sun.

#5010627 My Tentative Idea Thread

Posted by on 14 December 2012 - 09:07 AM

A few of the posters in my thread "unfocused discussion" have encouraged me to go forward and post an Idea thread. While it's an uncomfortable thing for me to do, you all have been great thus far and very open; I'd like to return the favor. Mind you, I do not hold value in these ideas, I just wanted to discuss the prevalent ones in my mind. If my idea is somewhat similar to yours, talk about it! I have no issue with a thread becoming derailed and if this thread spawns another's question, go for it. We're all here to learn. So let's get started:

Oh, I'm going to use placeholder titles, to make response a lot easier.

"Rock Game"

The back story with this game will be Christianity influenced(I am not religious by any stretch, but am consistently intrigued by Theology) and while it will not be so close to call it Christianity themed, I'd like for it to be easy to see the derivatives. An intro to the setting would be, perhaps, to the world as whole. A few still shots of a busy city, with many people, loud yelling and clamoring. Zooming out, from clouds, galaxy, and innevitably the entire universe, whiteness. A whisp of electricity that is vaguely hand shaped opens, then closes. Zooming back into space, to a collection of meteors that are floating among the void, you see them ignite into fire and speed off into a direction. This direction, of course, is Earth; where the doomsday gang is hurtling. At impact, after the explosion, there is a molten planet which was once ours - now filled with lava and bare rock. Infinitely quiet, a stark contrast to how it was seconds before. I want this to be quickly, to bring home the fidelity of these creatures.

A scene switch back to the far reaches of the universe, where the Hand entity was, there's a man. Sorrow filled, shaking his head. He turns mournfully, giving the being a glance and then quickly vanishing leaving behind the same type of electricity. A view from the ground up on Earth, amongst the molten rock he appears in an explosion of lightning. With a quick and smooth outward gesture, the landscape begins to change. The lava evaropates, the sun brightens onto the land, and below ground rocks are tightening. This pressure and the cooling action of the removed lava creates a multitude of gems, which are now shaking at full speed and slowly rising. Around the god-like man these rock beings quickly rise - each have a crystal embedded within their palm. Standing around him, he looks up. Some dialogue will come forth at this point, I don't know what, but an explanation of unjust punishment for acting how they were programmed and that they are now purely soul - that the deities will leave them to an immortal life without intervention. This is when the game would start.

Again, this is simply outline, there are probably plot holes and a lack of accurate descriptions but that'd most likely resolve if I even move forward with this.

The game itself would be magic based as the unobstructed soul would allow for wordly manipulation. Communication rudimentary, but some remnance of basic wording because the soul had still been through civilized life and remembers it's past. I was thinking that the rock beings would quickly separate into their own groups, each pursuing a different ideal of how to proceed in this new world. This is where the combat takes place. Dependent on your group, you will amass a certain type of spell craft (I'm thinking based on the elements, while cliche I think the idea of one controlling fire or water or air OR earth entirely cool. NERD ALERT! Posted Image). Instead of spell creation I would like to allow spell manipulation.

To draw a comparison, I'd say it'd be like chess. You have pieces that have defined movements, but their purposes are endless. I think it's fine to predefine spells and I don't think that is the issue with spell systems. I think the issue is the lack of weight. If you're creating the typical fireball, you are doing an amazing feat. I want the fireball to have WEIGHT, to act like a hurling ball of fire and to react like a fireball. Here's an example:

You have at your disposal the manipulation of fire. Determined by some user input, you can alter how the fire will be executed. Maybe a long click will allow a spray, or one click followed by holding the right mouse button directly after will create a fireball and the duration you hold increases size. Spraying towards the ground might allow you to quickly move out of the way acting like a jetpack since it's pressurized. This is basic but I like the idea of a contextual type of spell cast. That when these things are released you FEEL the power. I want combat to be slow and dliberate, these are hulking creatures that cannot move quickly. I don't want a lot of spells being thrown back and forth, I want each spell to be large and have a multitude of options to counter or redirect it. I am not sure how damage would be governed, I'd love to do a high lethality system with a fun destruction-physics animation, but I'm not sure.

As an aside, the earth spells would only work on inanimate earth, these beings are the blblical golem and more clay like than boulder like.

Art style would most likely be matte colors among earthy tones. Kind of that grounded but extraordinary religious feeling you get in old paintings.

That is the basis for the above idea, which... I kind of feel embarrassed for even typing. I had to force myself through that. The other idea I had has been in my mind since childhood but again, not completely developed. Though with a bit more knowledge of the industry I can make a more educated detail of the idea than what just sounded cool.

"Hunter Game"

A game set in the early ages amongst the werewolves and vampires and all other badies we've heard about. I want these creatures to be rare and for you to be the hunter. Living among a few towns that would be entirely made up, you'd spend a lot of your time sparring different forms of combat with others or managing a business or keeping an hear/eye on local talk; Or all of the above!. The talk would be text based as I'd want it to be completely randomized ala Gnomoria/Dwarf Fortress. These would either lead to inconclusive or conclusive beasts that you would in turn, hunt. The preparation would, again, be slow. Amassing the weapons, the text on said creature, more villager topics, and the like SHOULD be difficult work. I'd like the combat to be a bastardization of Jedi Academy and Mount and Blade. Meaning, the ability to block but also have controlled directional attacks. I prefer the movement based directionals in JA to the Mount and Blade mouse directionals, but I'm unsure. I would not opposed to having one universal block button.

I want fights to last for a long time, where there is a lot of build up. More over, I want each situation to be different. This could work by setting up a variety of assets for the environments then using a tracking system similar to "The Hunter" ( a hunting game) in which the target has a randomized path that leaves behind "footprint" assets that indicate direction. Upon successfully finding the enemy (let's assume vampire) you will be attacked and you can block, use other equipment, grappling, and ultimately come out on top or die. I'd like for the fighting to make it clear that if you lost, it was your fault. So maybe you hit him with holy water, direct him to a church amongst the cross, or just combat him.

I'm torn on the after-death condition. I think respawns trivialize and undermine the whole process. I could do permadeath, I know a wealth of players that would enjoy such a system. But, the day to day tasks MUST be equally as fun if that is used, the hunting being a treat. I think a variety of what you CAN do and keeping the tasks tangent with the hunting skills is important to sustain interest. That being a business owner you will be greeted with a "tycoon" like sim, a detective you get to utilize the random text system to find crimes, a hoodlum you get to rob and break into homes, etc...

The game should stand up as if there were no creatures.

Well, that's it. I hope myself and others learn from the results of this thread. Thanks for reading!

#5009839 Folaria - MMORPG (1)

Posted by on 12 December 2012 - 08:50 AM

I am saying this as a peer who is trying to respectfully give you the help you want.

To be honest, the idea is very contrived and generic. I don't mean to step on any toes, but we've seen this exact story rehearsed ad nauseum. I do have professional experience writing for folks to generate creative content, not much, but it's there. It was when I was around sixteen, I lied about my age and used networking to amass contacts, while I got burnt out quickly the experience was invaluable and I'd like to share some things with you a technique that I created.

Pretend your story is going to be patented. The criteria for patents is primarily originality, patents also require for you to be extremely thorough. Using this process as a base, you can easily flesh out an entirely NEW story. Now, I'm assuming you want a good story - you CAN achieve this with the same ideas of others, but it will probably be unremarkable. With that in mind, let's continue:

Before you think of characters, think of the world. Remember, originality. Commonly people don't put much emphasis on their setting and cycle through a collective group of already established ones, I.E. typical fantasy, sci fi, etc... This doesn't mean you can't use those (like if you are writing a story within Earth) but you should DELVE into them. This story is a product of you and the setting should reflect that. Be DIFFERENT, make concepts and apply them to your story's environment. Ask questions, ask as many questions as you can and then find MORE questions. How did this world come to be? How did this PLACE come to be? What happens in this world? What happened before? Are the inhabitants educated? Can the inhabitants talk? What are the general moralities? How does this world feel? Is it bleak? Is it sad? Is it happy? Is it blissful? Even if you want to write a story about a place already invented, these question all still apply.

You introduced a magical system, now, you have to be careful about this. If it doesn't feel powerful, mysterious, etc... it can fall flat, quickly. Once more, patent process! Look at other magic systems, RESEARCH, google search, do everything! Immerse yourself into your writing so it may BECOME immersive. Magic should be much more than spell casting, it (typically) relies on the energy of the world/individual influenced by the word(see why it's important to flesh out the world first?) and has many more components than just being a tool of alteration. But that's only typically, you can do whatever you want! Keep asking questions, keep writing it down!

Characters.... Now, see, this is tricky. Of course, start with the background, motives, childhood, parents, and more. Structure this out just like the two concepts you did before. Make it well rounded, choose and specify events that would foreshadow their behavior later on. Here's a little exercise to try after background checks to determine the way they interact and dialogue: For one day, think like your character, BE him. You don't have to talk like him or do what he'd do explicitly, just keep it in your mind. Set a version of yourself aside that picks out certain scenario that you come across and rationalize how he/she would handle it.

Now, write it down. You're carrying a notepad, right? Why aren't you carrying a notepad?!

There are much more variables to cover, approach them with the mindset that it must be complete, thorough. You probably won't use a lot of the information you write down, not within the text, but you'll use it each time you develop the story. When the concepts are completed(though they never truly are), write an indepth outline separate for each category (characters,worlds,magic, etc). This is, again, the patent process; you must be very detailed to earn that patent! While you are not actually going to get a patent, it's good to raise your expectations to a professional and detailed level.

Hope I helped!


#5009788 Can I do this by myself?

Posted by on 12 December 2012 - 05:38 AM

Not if you continue the way you are.

You seem to only want to make this game if it'd be successful, if it'd make money. That is not a way to sustain drive and you will quit 2 months in when it gets tough. LEARN about game design, no one is stopping you. How do you gain experience? You do it. You do not HAVE skills currently as you do not have experience, but that doesn't mean you can't make a high quality game. And most of all, make a game because you're passionate about the design, not making money. The cold hard truth is that most people make nothing off of their video games.

Grab a few art books, design books, modeling books, programming books and get to work. Just because you do programming doesn't mean you can't learn other skills related to game making. High quality means well rounded, if you only know one aspect then you will NOT achieve your goal. Learn all the skills you need and refine them - it's the difference of being a one trick programmer into what every employer desires.