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Supreme Commander & C&C 3

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jollyjeffers

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Right, about time I checked in again - I still don't have internet access at home and there's only so much I can get away with in the office [grin]

I've started planning my next project in D3D10. I'm in no immediate hurry so I'm thinking it through before starting to write any code.

My current idea is based on the '3D Pipes' screensaver that's been a standard in Windows for 12 years. I generally don't use screensavers and prefer to have my monitor go into standby instead but when I do have to use a screensaver it'll be this one.

I'll be investigating the GS by having the CPU upload a line-list and get the GPU to turn these into the actual pipes complete with connections/joints between segments. Not 100% sure I've got the maths right here.

'3D Pipes' also offers a lot of scope for overdraw in an image, and the main algorithm I want to experiment with is deferred shading. I'm thinking about implementing some heavyweight per-pixel algorithms along with a conventional forward renderer so that I can do some experimentation between the relative efficiencies of the methods. There are lots of discussions about these two approaches but relatively little by way of example.

More on this as and when [wink]




I now own copies of 'Supreme Commander' and 'Command & Conquer 3: Tiberium Wars'. I knew I was going to buy them as soon as I saw them on the radar, and as far as I can tell they'll be the only two games I buy this year (don't have much time to play games [headshake]).

I'm disappointed. Very disappointed.

I like my RTS games and, depending on mood the SupCom or C&C will satisfy my needs as a player.

Supreme Commander runs like a DOG. It's almost unplayable on a pretty decent system - Athlon64 3800+ with a GeForce 8800. In any sort of game with more than 2 players (human or AI) it gets horrifically CPU bound to the extent that I can measure performance in seconds-per-frame right up until I get my arse kicked because I can't react quick enough.

I quite like long epic games with 8 players and huge maps - many a happy memory of those in Total Annihilation. Looks like I'll have to buy a whole new quad-core computer to get close to that dream [oh].

On to C&C3. This one is just plain unstable - I've been unable to get more than 30 minutes of clean gameplay out of it. Odd graphical glitches, sound dropping out, hard-resets, failure to recognise the disk...

I can tell the C&C game is there in all glory and it is great fun to play. If I could play it.

Talking purely as a consumer, I feel outright cheated by both teams/publishers. How can SupCom justify needing a super computer just to go beyond the most trivial game modes? How did C&C3 pass QA? grr.
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I read in a review that SupCom really needs a Dual core machine, such as a Core 2 Duo. Is your box single or Dual core?

You know my shit PC I told you about? I'm about to upgrade to something nicer; I don't suppose you have a spae 8800 to PIF? [grin]

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Both my systems are traditional single core systems (don't think a first-gen Pentium 4 with HT counts as multi-core?) which is where I'm getting stung.

If my company does okay and I get a bonus worth more than the price of a beer then my next investment will be a multicore system. But I don't want to wait 6 months to play SupCom properly [sad]

I have a spare 7300LE if you want it? [lol]

Jack

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I've been playing C&C3 for a few days now, and havn't had it crash once while playing (it crashes if I alt-tab out). I do get random graphical glitches, but nothing serious, and nothing that affects gameplay.

Some people on #graphicschat who also have 8800s have also been complaining about issues, but none this serious.

Have you tried running in XP SP2 compatibility mode? that might help (I assume you run Vista). There are also 2 patches out I think, and if they don't help, I'm sure a future one will.

It's a great game though, you might want to consider running it on XP (if you havn't already tried that)

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I've been playing C&C3 for a few days now
Don't rub it in!!

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it crashes if I alt-tab out
Who's not handling their lost device scenario properly? [lol]

I'm forced to 'play' C&C3 on my older XP dev machine. My Vista box is running the 64bit edition which is, for whatever reason, unsupported. My XP machine has a 512mb GeForce 6800 which isn't super-quick but I've not had any problems with other games/demos before.

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There are also 2 patches out I think, and if they don't help, I'm sure a future one will.
I downloaded 1.03 today so I'll see if that helps later. I'm not expecting much as the release notes for all the patches seem to heavily focus on multiplayer issues and no mention of any fixes/changes to the general game...

Cheers,
Jack

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If you like Total Annihilation, then look at http://spring.clan-sy.com/.

It is like TA + new 3D engine + open source + new features + other mods + active community.

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Quote:
Original post by jollyjeffers
Supreme Commander runs like a DOG. It's almost unplayable on a pretty decent system - Athlon64 3800+ with a GeForce 8800. In any sort of game with more than 2 players (human or AI) it gets horrifically CPU bound to the extent that I can measure performance in seconds-per-frame right up until I get my arse kicked because I can't react quick enough.[/b]


SupCom has some serious performance problems with hardware accelerated sounds (you can quickly test if it comes from sound by launching it in the command line with the /nosound option), especially on Creative Labs cards like the Audigy. On my home machine (Athlon 64 3500, X800), ie. a good 2 years old, I wouldn't say it runs "well", but I still get over 10 fps average in "average" battles with 2 to 4 AIs, medium sized maps. Also, if it's a sound issue, you could try to disable EAX and set sound acceleration to "basic" in dxdiag. Hope that helps :)

Y.

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Original post by jollyjeffers
I'm forced to 'play' C&C3 on my older XP dev machine. My Vista box is running the 64bit edition which is, for whatever reason, unsupported. My XP machine has a 512mb GeForce 6800 which isn't super-quick but I've not had any problems with other games/demos before.

Um, Not supported != doesn't work. I run Vista 64 only, and havn't had major problems. Have you not even tried running it on that system?

As for the device lost issue, it seems to be my drivers (I'm forced to run the Vista default drivers for my 7600GT). This isn't the first game that fails to alt-tab correctly, so I figure it isn't fair to blame this game specifically.

If you havn't already, give it a go on Vista.

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I'm much more of a fan of C&C3 right now!

SupCom is too slow for my tastes. I need action, and I need it now! I don't want to spend half the time wondering how I'm going to kill my opponent... I just want to kill him, and kill him _now_. :-)

Also, major bummers on the stability issues. Don't know what to say, cause I'm running pretty good on my Vista machine.

*Edit* P4 w/ HT (what I have also actually) is in no way multi-core and can't compare performance with multi-core. To my understanding, it just simulates two threads.

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Um, Not supported != doesn't work. I run Vista 64 only, and havn't had major problems. Have you not even tried running it on that system?
Yup, I ignored the "32bit-only" warning and tried it first on my Vista machine. I forget what happened, but it didn't work any better than it does on XP - forget if I got as far as the game though.

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If you like Total Annihilation, then look at http://spring.clan-sy.com/
Looks interesting - thanks for the link!

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SupCom has some serious performance problems with hardware accelerated sounds
Thanks for the heads-up on that. I have a crappy onboard AC'97 soundcard so I'd be surprised if its hitting the same problem but definitely worth checking out [smile]

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P4 w/ HT (what I have also actually) is in no way multi-core and can't compare performance with multi-core.
Yup, thats what I thought - but "multicore" is the new buzzword and it gets a little fuzzy as to exactly what they mean at times [wink] I'm a little cynical of most marketting departments usage of buzzwords...

Jack

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