Six paragraphs comparing yourself to people who actually made the board games you name drop....check.

Try to appeal to programmers via a punch card reference? Yeah, that's going to work.

Lots of talk about how Rube is the greatest thing since sliced bread without ever actually describing it concretely or how it should be implemented....check.

Good luck with your endeavors.

Also, Axis and Allies was a terrible game.

I actually make them, too.

An attempt by the adults to explain the current height of the field of game and simulation design to the spoiled little children playing in the sandbox at the edge of our field... I can play your propaganda game with you, if you want...

I have been describing Rube too you, you are just so far behind actual simulation design that it is indistinguishable from magic too you. You could learn a lot if you put down your bucket and shovel and listened to your betters for a little while instead of becoming insulted whenever we speak. I'm sorry that your self-worth is based on your misguided belief that you are the experts in this field, and that you can not tolerate our presence.

You to... maybe in 30 years you will actually manage to reach a level of knowledge that is equivalent to Avalon Hill's Panzerblitz... maybe. Probably not, if you are going to continue to become enraged whenever a real game designer attempts to speak as you have been doing for the last 30 years.

I don't mean or want to become Pirate Lord again here, but you people really are something! And I will just leave it at that. I am only responding to your tone here.

Well, I've got to be honest Kavik Kang, I've spent the better part of the past 10 minutes reading parts of this blog and other blogs you've written about Rube and I still don't have the foggiest idea what it's all about or even if it's a game. Do you have pictures or something to show other than your current ideas? I'm curious and would like to know what you're trying to make.

I'm getting the impression you're a connoisseur of games and game design. Do you have a top 3 that you think best represent the art of Game?

This post was really about trying to convey the history of where Rube comes from. I have been trying to explain Rube to people for nearly 2 years now. I've come to realize that only people with a deep understanding of Avalon Hill's phased-turn system, which is also a part of SFB, and SFB's Impulse Chart have any frame of reference from which to understand Rube. In the end, Rube is the world's first functioning simulation of God, or time combined with reality which look for all the world like the same thing. That's really what it is. But there is a long way to go to get from understanding games as "Turn 1 I go, Turn 2 you go" and being able to comprehend Rube. It really would take a book to explain Rube, that is part of how I discovered it. The best way for me to explain Rube is to just make Territories. If I can't find a way to make that happen, I could basically strip the Territories off of Rube leaving a "functional model" of the "spine" of Rube to demonstrate on a table top. If I was going to just try to explain Rube and forget about making my games that is what I would do. That would be a lot easier than writing a book to explain it. Maybe I will do that if I can't just find a way to make Territories and do it that way. But I'd rather just make Territories to do that which is what I am trying to do now.

Rube is a way of simulation time combined with reality that has evolved over many decades. It begins with simple turns. Turn 1, I go. Turn 2, you go.

Then came "phased turns". Turn 1, Phase 1, I go. Turn 1, Phase 2, you go.

Then subphases. Turn 1, Phase 1, I move. Turn 1, Phase 1, you move. Turn 1 Phase 2, I shoot. Turn 1, Phase 2, you shoot.

And it kept evolving from there. Notice that in a board game the phases actually make no real difference in sequence. Players are still moving back and forth if you watch them play. But in their minds, and the design of the game, they are moving and acting simultaneously. In a computer version... they really are acting simultaneously. This was the very, very beginnings of what has eventually now evolved into Rube.

I'll also add, for the fun of it, that I've made a point to watch the Matrix a few times since stumbling on to all of this and there is something that really jumps off the screen and stands out too me when I do. Something that they just did because they thought it looked cool... but actually hit the nail right on the head when they did. In some scenes you see a information display of activity taking place in the Matrix on the monitors. It is like a waterfall of separate lines falling down the screen. This is just amazing too me. If I assume that is an interface that I have made track activity within Rube... I can make complete and total sense of those "falling lines". If that were the interface for Rube that effect makes me envision, and you were one of those falling lines... I could tell you everything about the rest of your future from that screen, and re-program you future from their as well. Those falling lines are so dead on, they make perfect sense too me as an interface for tracking "living entities" within Rube. This actually isn't relevant to anything, I'd just been dying to mention it;-)

"I have been describing Rube too you, you are just so far behind actual simulation design that it is indistinguishable from magic too you." - “Kavik Kang” (2017)

This makes it read like you are a programmer explaining how the internet works to cave men.

If that is how it is don't bother: we cave men will understand Rube when we, ready to make own Rube.

"Rube literally plans the future. It does not simply predict the future"- “Kavik Kang” (2017)

There is two problems with this, first is size: If you store a point in space for a object and every turn a object can move to two points the results will grow exponentially.

Note the following math is inaccurate, however it still explains the basics. If you feel like doing the detailed math to get one or two decimal more, please do.

Assuming every point stored is per second and in bites.

(1bit* 2 possible positions) = N

1N*2N*3N ... etc.

2->4->8 ->16->32->64->128->256->512->1024->2048->4096->8192->16384 = 16kb for 15 seconds.

A more realistic example is a matrix with 9 floats = 9 bites = 147kb for 15 seconds = 590kb for 1 minute and 9mb for 15 minutes.

So 9mb for one object * 1 000 objects for a mid size space game = 9 GB of data written to the hard drive at any given second to predict the next 15 minutes of object locations, in a game where a object can only move two points in space and once per second.

Now if the object can move in only 360 degrees, that is no decimal degrees, and has a speed value that can only range from 1-10, again no decimals.

Then: 9*360*10(bit size* (position*speed = possible points) = 32kb -> 116mb-> 420 gb-> 1.5 petabytes -> etc.

considering that 120 petabytes is a supper computer you can only store 4 steps for a single object moving in 2D space constraint to 360 degrees and only 10 speed.

1.5 petabytes to predict a single 9bit point.

"I am aware of how you use what you term “predictive” mechanics to compensate for

networking issues, so this is a concept that you are at least familiar with."- “Kavik Kang” (2017)

Not the same thing, networking uses linear math, there is no or very little possibilities in the math.

For example predicting the character's standing to crouching point is as simple as knowing the animation speed. The animation speed tells what point of the animation the player will be in when the bullet overlaps.

The thing to note here is that both the bullet and animation travel in a straight line, there are no possibilities. The collision boxes are relative to the animation.

"You did not, and still don't. I know. I was there. I've been here all along. To this day you still can not comprehend how a board game can be a “real time game”. "- “Kavik Kang” (2017)

Who doesn't, games run in loops and tics, Programmers learn this when they first attempt a real time event. In turn based games the tic just takes longer.

I think I see what you want to do with this part, predictive math is small only one or two steps away, so you will optimize the math by limiting the steps that can be predicted. That will only work in a turn based game or in a game where you only change large events using the data you collect.

Considering that there are games doing this I assume that Rube does more.

Now the second problem, a computer can't imagine.

So even if you found some way to predict the future of the world and store it, so that your computer can use that data. It would have no way of turning it into a story.

From your cards example maybe you plan on using a AI that reads patterns, so you feed it 10 stories it sees common examples an creates a story. There are AI like this, however they are in the very early stages.

Rube doesn't function in the same way you are talking about. Within Rube a future moment of time containing reality is a static thing. There is no location that needs to be tracked. As I said, I understand that you know the very basics of the Avalon Hill phased-turn system, I know that you understand that things run in increments of time. That's part of how a computer operates, too. I was using the word "prediction", and that concept, only to try to get you to see a similar situation where you "play with the future" in ways most people can not understand. Rube plans the future, it doesn't predict it.

Right now I am confident that you will see Rube one way or another. I have never tried to make board games before, I was only interested in computer games. I can probably get Territories published as a board game fairly easily. I am not a total outsider in that world like I am in yours. Even the board game version of Rube is very impressive... at least once it has that extra 300 card expansion. That 200 card limit in the initial game is still a problem I am trying to work out, that is pretty... spartan.

In the last post I mentioned the "waterfall interface" seen in the Matrix. Since I have mentioned it so much... Although the video below is about Federation Commander, the "Candyland Version of SFB for the Masses", at about 06:00 this guy breifly goes over the SFB Impulse Chart so that you can see what it is. The basic function of it is simple to understand, don't expect to see Rube in it... but imagine that "Matrix Waterfall" falling down it, and and you will see a flash of Rube that only another life-long SFB player would have any chance of actually catching and interpreting at all;-)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_w53_a91Uow

I want to point out that I am not trying to explain Rube in this blog, in fact I am intentionally wanting to keep anyone from being able to fully figure it out while revealing enough to make people realize that this really is something real. I am completely unconcerned about the vast majority of people on the planet being able to decipher Rube from what I am revealing here. It would take a 300+ page book for me to explain Rube to most people,. Not because I am smarter than anyone else, or because it is too complicated for people to understand, but because having deep a understanding of the phased-turn, the concept of "assembling the battle" within that type of system, and the SFB Impulse Chart are the pre-requisite knowledge to have any frame of reference from which to understand it. The first 200 pages of that book would be bringing everyone up to speed with ASL/SFB, only the last 100 would even be about Rube.

This is not meant as an insult towards your industry at all, but I am not holding back as much as I am out of concern that you will figure this out, which I don't want to happen because I couldn't take seeing what really would be my games being made with me STILL not making games. I just couldn't take that. It is very unlikely any ASL player could put this together. There are, however, about 3 dozen or so world-class SFB players in this world, many of whom have probably already read this blog, who would put this together pretty quickly if I weren't intentionally being vague about specific things... especially "my" main component of this, my "Attached Board Game AI".

So this is not a situation where I am trying my hardest to explain it. I am trying to walk a tightrope of telling people enough for them to understand that it is something real while not allowing a group that I know is reading this to understand completely what I am talking about. Because they will, just like you would if you had been playing SFB for the last 40 years.

In less words, Rube is a model for creating deterministic simulations? Sounds interesting...
Played the hell out of King's Bounty. And Federation Commander looks glorious. I'll get back into tabletop gaming one of these days I swear...

The two best short sentence descriptions are "artificial universe" or "functioning simulation of God". Federation Commander is an excellent game. SVC really targeted it at modern gamers as much as he could. Miniatures have to be optional for the game to be affordable, so the basic game still comes with just counters. But the design of the game itself is actually the opposite of SFB in many ways. One important change in Federation Commander is that it uses the SFB concept of "reserve power" to allow players to use power in a flexible way "on the fly". One thing that drives modern gamers away from SFB is the forward planning that is required and the very restrictive (tiny) level of "reserve power" that is available. This change makes it play more like a real time computer game than SFB does.

King's Bounty may have been a huge hit game for TFG had they given it Milton Bradley GameMaster level production values. That thought wouldn't have crossed anyone's mind at the time. That kind of thing was very, very expensive to do in the early 1990's.

Oops...

The point, I would think obviously, is to try one last time to try to find a way to make Territories and Rube. There is no "ranting". Unfortunately I don't speak Twitter, I use full paragraphs. I would think anyone that was interested in game design would be interested in Rube... in fact, I am certain of that.

I do have issues... 30 years of banging my head against a brick wall of arrogance. I mean... look at what I am telling you here... and nobody cares? It's actually pretty amazing. It is starting to look like I am really am going to have to find a different group of people to take this too. Your industry clearly has no interest in game and simulation design. It is starting to look like you really are so far behind us that you can't even recognize what we do now as anything other than impossible magic... and you are STILL talking down too us? There really are no words to describe the people of the modern game industry anymore at this point. Footstomping, insistent, crying little children doesn't even begin to describe it. It really doesn't. You are the exact opposite of everything that you are absolutely convinced that you are. Great programmers and artists... not even competent yet when it comes to game design. Welcome back to reality! We are what you think you are, obviously... you really are just playing in a sandbox at the edge of our field. And you really can't see the pyramids we've been building behind you all along.

The only similar situation in all of history that I can think of that compares to this was the priests refusing to look into Galileo's telescope. That's exactly who you people are. You've proven that too me beyond any doubt now.

" I mean... look at what I am telling you here... and nobody cares? "- “Kavik Kang” (2017)

You are saying Rube is the next best thing since sliced bread, we get it. The thing you don't appear to understand is that you sound like a novice designer at best.

Almost any new designer comes of with THE GAME IDEA, that some how is better than any game that has ever existed. They tell you how the game is going to have infinite exploration, infinite missions, infinite scenarios.

The point is that it can't be done, making a game that simulates God, a universe or infinity requires as much resources as the goal.

In other words to make a game that simulates God, you need a computer as powerful as God. Considering that computers now can't even simulate a GameMaster, this is a very unrealistic goal.

If you mean that the game is a god in the sense that it governs the rules of it's universe, then yes all games are gods.

Nothing you have shown or described, proves that Rube can even be made.

In fact knowing the future is impossible, unless you limit the possibilities. SFB for example limits it to six and uses responsive AI to react when it can't predict.

"One thing that drives modern gamers away from SFB is the forward planning that is required and the very restrictive (tiny) level of "reserve power" that is available." - “Kavik Kang” (2017)

What drives people away from SFB is bad design practice. The game is so complex and badly designed, that a player has to spend over 3 hours in learning, even to play a basic battle.

Comparing your Rube to SFB is why people don't want to invest. There are more players interested in Tic-tac-toe than SFB.

At any given time SFB has only 3 000 - 10 000 players interested, if Rube is a hundred times better, it could only interest a million players players. Then considering that the chance of Rube being that much better is so small, it isn't worth the cost of making it.

At this point there is only two ways Rube will ever exist:

One, you make it.

Two, you post in online and hope someone else makes it.

No person is going to waste millions investing in a game design that has no guarantee of making money, when they could just bet in a horse race and have better odds.

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". This really is all you have just said. Confirmed what I have been saying. You are so far behind the actual field of game and simulation design that you can't even imagine what I am talking about. Rube is nothing like SFB, just like SFB was nothing like Avalon Hill games. And, in terms of longevity, only Dungeons & Dragons rivals SFB as a "successful game". In terms of innovation in game and simulation design... Rube proves that SFB was the most important advance in the field in all of history up until this point.

I have been designing games since before your industry existed. You are the novice. I doubt you have 1/4 of the experience that I have doing this. I am not the "new designer", you are. What I am doing is based on 70 years of work by hundreds of designers... what you are doing has less then half of that history behind it. You started over. But you are right, I don't have a degree from the Devry School of Game Design... so none of that counts. Right? It only counts when the programmers put their stamp of approval on it.

And, of course Rube can know the future... if you are writing the future, then you know the future. That is a big part of how Territories works. Both players always know the immediate future shortly before it happens. So they can intervene. It's a cold war game with a big focus on intervening in future events that are about to unfold on short notice. That's only one of the things that makes it unique.

There are many other ways Rube can come into existence. I can strip the Territories off of it and make it as a simple demonstration of how it functions manually on a table top. Is anyone out there making a serious effort at "cyberspace" or something like the Matrix or a holodeck? I'll take it too them, they will certainly have a use for it.

I know what I am doing, and I've been doing it for 40 years. There is no question that Rube is a very real thing, and not the imaginings of the kinds of amateurs you are accustomed to dealing with. But, you've convinced me, you are exactly the people that I decided you were 9 years ago. I'll just move on to making Territories as a board game instead, and a stripped down version for the world of science. Since your indstury really does appear to be as hopelessly defiatnly arrogant as I has believed it was for some time now.

Territories can be a very simple game to produce. If anyone is interested, I am here. I don't expect to hear from anyone, because "fire bad". But I really am a nice person and I'd love to make the real Territories instead of the mostly empty skeleton of Territories that a board game version has to be. It wouldn't cost a lot to make by your standards in it's most bare form, and if it was a success you can see there is a pretty good plan of where it could go from there. There is even a simple to produce strategy game version of Pirate Dawn that could be made in place of having to make a big MMO game.

But I don't expect to hear from you... you aren't capable of seeing what is in front of you. You are offended by the notion that anyone outside of your world could possibly be ahead of you with this stuff, even though that has always been the case, so you are just immediately certain that if you can't understand it that it can't possibly exist. So insult the person to discredit them, because we are the experts and nobody who doesn't work for us has any business even discussing the subject. Right?

So if anyone out there is interested in Territories and Rube I am here, but otherwise I will just let this stand. I don't have any desire to endlessly trade insults with people who are offended that we exist.

"I am not the "new designer", you are."- “Kavik Kang” (2017)

No, you are. :)

That was so childish I couldn't resist.

"Is anyone out there making a serious effort at "cyberspace" or something like the Matrix or a holodeck?" - “Kavik Kang” (2017)

Look into VR/AR, Pokemon Go and advances in wet ware. We aren't near a holodeck yet, considering what we know now; the holodeck is just the top of the iceberg.

We can lock a single person in a virtual world like the Matrix now, the cost of this would be extremely expensive. The damage done to the body would be irreversible and unethical. If we are lucky some millionaire will volunteer to do it.

"And, of course Rube can know the future... if you are writing the future, then you know the future." - “Kavik Kang” (2017)

"Both players always know the immediate future shortly before it happens. So they can intervene." - “Kavik Kang” (2017)

That is not knowing the future, this is knowing one possible state of the future and the least likely one to boot.

The moment the player takes action the "future" you showed them is no longer the state that the actual future is in. So assuming the player can make only 3 in-game choices and there is only two players.

Then the chance that the state you showed will happen is 5*5(Player 1 * Player 2), means your state that you show is only 1 out of 25 possible states; meaning you have only a 4% chance of being the correct choice.

If that is how Rube works, it has no idea what the future will be, at best it knows what the future could be.

People who wonder how I got 5*5, it's because there is always the chance in multiplier games that a player doesn't take action or leaves the game.

""Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" This really is all you have just said".- “Kavik Kang” (2017)

No one is arguing this point. The internet is magic to a caveman and useless, as the caveman has no electricity or computers that can run the internet.

Nothing you have shown or done, convinces me Rube is as great as you claim or that it can even be made.

"I don't have a degree from the Devry School of Game Design... so none of that counts. Right?" - “Kavik Kang” (2017)

Thanks to advances in game development, less than a percent of games made these days are made by developers with a Game Design degree.

"don't have any desire to endlessly trade insults with people who are offended that we exist." - “Kavik Kang” (2017)

What offends me isn't that you exist, it's that you dare to complain.

Do you know how many developers making games today never even received a first chance, from the very beginning they had to do it all them self?

Doing nothing and then complaining about how unfair it all is, that is what offends me. Take a look around, the game industry isn't what it use to be; anyone can make a successful game now.

Wow, this is nuts. So you're angry that no-one is jumping on board to help you create your vision of "Rube"... even though you won't really describe it in detail. The best you'll offer is that it's a "functioning simulation of God"... and yet your issue is that everyone else is arrogant. Even though you've responded with statements like:

"An attempt by the adults to explain the current height of the field of game and simulation design to the spoiled little children playing in the sandbox at the edge of our field"

and

"You could learn a lot if you put down your bucket and shovel and listened to your betters"

Pirate Lord man... I remember your first epic meltdown. You haven't learned yet that you need to do a better job interacting with people? "30 years of banging my head against a brick wall" and you haven't stopped to think that maybe it's how you approach people? It's great that you're enamored with your idea, it really is. Passion is a valuable thing in life. But if you turn people off by being rude to them, or getting exasperated that they won't just blindly trust your vision... then they aren't going to help you...

It's not a vision... it is the end result of 70 years of work by the hobbyist game industry. I am not some guy with an idea, I am the end of a 70 year long chain of a thing that existed before your industry even existed. None of what you are saying is really relevant, because I am not just one little kid with an idea. I am nearly 50, with a lifetime of experience, and have happened to have wound up like I keep saying, through an accident of history, being the next in the line of people to take this to the next level. Only I wound up with the "hot potato" of being to one to finish it.

This doesn't seem to be registering at all. I am not a "kid with an idea". I am, really, the current top person in the field after having completed 50 years of work that began with Avalon Hill. And, yes, when people with 10 years of experience talk down to people with 40 years of experience like they are children, that is "arrogance". When the 40 year veterans talk down to the 10 year guys... it's not.

I do have to say that I consider it progress that you are finally willing to admit that you are not game designers, and that because of your "advances in game development" anyone can make a game these days. You used to get mad at me when I tried to explain that too you, so it's nice to see we are all in agreement on that point now. You'd think that might change your attitudes toward us actual game designers... but no, apparently.

Hey man, I was just trying to give you some friendly advice. I've watched you consistently get this type of reaction. The reason for it is that you come off as extremely disrespectful. I'm sure you have your reasons, your frustrations about not being understood or taken seriously for the magnitude of your game idea. Or the fact that you feel like your experience in game design makes you an authority. That you clearly feel like you know better than the people on this site. But just... as a word to the wise... it's not working. Again, this is why you have "30 years of banging my head against a brick wall." You're being rude, disrespectful, and you're belittling the people that you are apparently reaching out to. It's one thing to be confident in one's ability and knowledge; it's quite another to tell people that their experience is less valuable and that they should just shut up and listen to you.

I come off as "extremely disrespectful" after 20 years of trying it your way already. I get this reaction because, as has been the case for 30 years now, people in the computer game industry become literally enraged when anyone not employed in their industry attempts to claim to know anything about game and simulation design. I have seen this again and again for 30 years. There is no way of discussing game design as if you might actually know something without getting this reaction. It has always been this way. That's why I love it when the response is "We love the board game industry, just not you". You don't like me only because I was the one to finally say something, I would imagine the rest silently gave up 15-20 years ago. But I am different, I devoted my entire life to this and have nothing to lose. If I don't make at least one of my games then my entire life was for nothing.

Why wouldn't I think that I know at least as much, if not more, about game and simulation design than the people on this site? I've been doing this since before their industry existed. I have completed the work of the hobbyist game industry resulting in a functioning simulation of god... literally the holy grail of simulation design if you actually know what you are talking about. The fact that so far not a single person in the computer game industry is interested in Rube at all is actually proof that they don't understand some of the basic fundamentals of simulation design. If you don't get that a simulation of god is profoundly relevant within simulation design, then you don't know what you are talking about. I really can't believe that nobody is interested in Rube, the only possible explanation is that there isn't anyone in the modern game industry who understands simulation design well enough to understand how important a functioning simulation of god is.

Except Will Wright, of course, he would have to know this... it was in the book he read.

I am not being rude and disrespectful. I am simply not pretending to know nothing compared to them. I am just speaking as who I am, and with the 40 years of experience that I really do have. This has always enraged them. But pretending like I don't know anything didn't work for 20 years, and I won't be alive much long. I really don't see any chance of making it to Cindy and at this point, let alone Armageddon. At most I would hope to make it to Mission, and that whoever I was making the games with would finish it through Armageddon after I was gone based on what I had left behind. But really, I am just trying to make Territories. Just get to make my signature game and give the world Rube, the end result of 70 years of work beginning with Avalon Hill, with it. But apparently my "Lost Art Studios" was well-named, because this is all so far removed from modern "game designers" (programmers, really) that nobody in the modern game industry even understands the relevance of a general simulation of time combined with reality, or god.

I really am having a hard time believing that there is not a single person in the entire modern game industry that is interested in this.