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Arcade games from 1990

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Ive been wondering HOW Capcom was able to program such a smooth game like Street Fighter 2 10 years ago and with such a crappy hardware (CPS2)..any ideas? "Those who follow the path of the warrior must be ready to die, to stand for their convictions, live for one´s convictions, die for one´s convictions"

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Im not saying its crappy, but c´mon, they must have used very special techniques to get those excellent graphics, take a look at Mark of the Wolves, some stages have details that it would be impossible to produce with that hardware, have you seen the bells at Hotaru´s stage??..they look incredible
I would kill someone just for having a chance of taking a look at the old Street Fighter 2 source code.

"Those who follow the path of the warrior must be ready to die, to stand for their convictions, live for one´s convictions, die for one´s convictions"

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The speed comes from the hardware... looking at the source code wouldn''t help you much. The CPS2 board has hardware sprite registers and hardware-assisted blitting, much like today''s 2D accelerated cards for PCs. There is no mystery here.

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quote:
Original post by granat
Oh yes there is. They probably used Alien technology !!!!

''Tommyknockers, tommyknockers, knocking at the door...''

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by granat
Oh yes there is. They probably used Alien technology !!!!


HAHAHAHAHHAHA

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I agree with granat, high quality 2D sprites probably made all the difference. The same is true even for today''s games. Excellent texturing can really set a game apart from others.

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quote:
Original post by smarechal
Street Fighter 2 had excellent gameplay as well as excellent graphics.



So what are you saying ? That the Aliens designed the gameplay as well !!!?? It all makes sense now !

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Even today and with the commodities of OOP and a excellent hardware, people make very crapy 2D games..

"Those who follow the path of the warrior must be ready to die, to stand for their convictions, live for one´s convictions, die for one´s convictions"

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Guest Anonymous Poster
technically OOP has been around since the 70s or so. but still i think its just the nice texturing that made those graphics good. Even though i havent played all those games, i have played street fighter, and that game is just graphics and whatever they did to make the fighting work, no physics or super special learning AI to compute.

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// mybrain.cpp

...
bool MyBrain::IsSFNiceToPlay()
{
try
{
for_each(_sfgamelist.begin(), _sfgamelist.end(), PlayAll);
}
catch(HideousGraphics &)
{
return false;
}
catch(LousySound &)
{
return false;
}
catch(StupidControl &)
{
return false;
}
catch(BadGameplay &)
{
return false;
}

return true;
}
...


Hmm... compiling this I got warnings.
...
D:\dereksaw\SRC\MyBrain.cpp(57) : warning C4702: unreachable code
D:\dereksaw\SRC\MyBrain.cpp(61) : warning C4702: unreachable code
D:\dereksaw\SRC\MyBrain.cpp(65) : warning C4702: unreachable code
D:\dereksaw\SRC\MyBrain.cpp(69) : warning C4702: unreachable code
Linking...
DerekSaw.exe - 0 error(s), 4 warning(s)

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No, problem for you is most ''1990'' hardware games (including the Amiga, the C64 and a whole bunch of other awesome hardware) is that they''re SMOOTH. Smooth as silk. *SILK*. That''s not you''ll pull off on the PC easily. And they have / had graphics artists that were specialists in ''pixeling'' graphics, as opposed to render some bullshit in their 3Dmax or whatever. (flamebait)

Besides, if I gave you the sourcecode of any game 1990 or prior, be it the CPS2, the Amiga, or the C64, you''d never (exaggeration warning!) make anything worthwhile out of it, because it just can''t be applied directly to the PC anyway. Just relax. But hey, please try imitate their style, but giddy please, stay away from PONG.



Visit the 2D game programmers'' hideout!

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also all earlier console and arcade games were written in 100% asm for speed and size. also having dedicated graphics and sound hardware allowed the cpu more time to handle things like ai. since artists created art at the pixel level (ie they drew each and every pixel by hand) it look very nice at the resolution the game was played vs many games today using scaled artwork. also, no OS meant cpu only did game related stuff. so things could be garunteed to run at 60hz (ie vsyncd).

teh stuff created was not impossible to produce with the hardware, since it was produced. required lots of artists, and rom space. many newer neogeo games (like garou) were over 60 megabytes in size. thus they could afford to house some length animations for the background. also animation in general was tweaked so that the min frames required (with correct motion blurring drawn within the sprite) allowed very smooth animations. also realize that the systems being pallete based, sprites and tiles took less space (ie they had 4096 colors on screen, something pc hardware does not handly nativly).

you can EASILY immitate those games on todays hardware (even hardware from a few years back). just requires some good artists, the actual code is merely blitting some sprites and drawing some tiles. the cps2 (and other arcade hardware) are slow compared to todays pc hardware so its not a problem. remeber the games only ran at around 352x284 (cps2, neogeo ran at 320x240). a common problem ppl have trying to mimic old school games, they make the resolution too high.

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What really impresses me is HOW Capcom made all those sprites move and the excellent AI with asm, those guys must have been really dedicated, the original Street Fighter 2 staff had only 2 (TWO!!) programmers...oh God..

"Those who follow the path of the warrior must be ready to die, to stand for their convictions, live for one´s convictions, die for one´s convictions"

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I find it easier to program games with only a few people, if that many. You dont have to worry about someone messing up your code, or adding stuff and not knowing where they put it. Its hard working with a large team of programmers, working with only a few really makes it easier to get done =).

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quote:
Original post by BobBaker92
I find it easier to program games with only a few people, if that many. You dont have to worry about someone messing up your code, or adding stuff and not knowing where they put it. Its hard working with a large team of programmers, working with only a few really makes it easier to get done =).


Yes, that's one of the things I learned when studying Software Engineering. Sometimes you can make a team more efficient by REMOVING a programmer rather than ADDING one.

Many games don't have large teams of programmers. Most of the people that work on a game are artists, designers, writers, testers, etc. In fact the average number of artists on a team seems to be growing very quickly.

If there are multiple programmers, they work on entirely different parts of the application, as to not step on each other's toes.

--TheMuuj

[edited by - themuuj on June 27, 2002 4:41:11 PM]

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I don''t actually agree that smaller teams make better games.

Bad programmers make bad teams.

Good programmers make good teams.

If adding programmers to a team makes it harder to get the job done then it becomes a management problem: determine why productivity has dropped and replace those problematic programmers with good ones. Sometimes it can be the first programmer you hired who, on his own was able to make a lot of things happen fast, but if his code is undecipherable to additional programmers then you are better off without him.

Wizard programmers sometimes have the habit of causing confusion in others instead of writing well layed out code bases.

In our team there are 14 programmers. We are all given our responsibilities in different areas but we also often ''mess'' with each other''s code. This is fine since we all are capable, have no code ego, and write solid sensible code.

I would way rather work with a large group which has a huge body of knowledge and experience then with one or two so called ''wizard'' programmers who all write their code in different, hard to understand ways.

Just my two cents.

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