Enclosed levels have the luxury of creating transition rooms where the end room looks the same as the room at the beginning of the level. This enables a segmented level to appear as a large environment. What tricks do outdoor world creators have? Here''s what I can think of: Billboard vista with barrier: This is a hackneyed and somewhat frustrating device where players can see part of a skyline but can''t get there. But as long as the view looks good, has some animation, and is appropriately barred (say by water if the player can''t swim) then it works. Cardboard front: Crazy Taxi, Grand Theft Auto 3 and a lot of driving games use this idea, where buildings are simply textured boxes. Mixed with areas that can be entered, this works as long as the buildings that can be entered are clearly called out. Repetition: Let''s face it, cities are repetitive. If you''re fighting, racing or driving through a city, the shape of the passageways between buildings is probably more important than the buildings themselves. However, even buildings that can be entered in a real city often have standard patterns. Combined with elements inside them that can be randomized and alterations to texture colors this might be a workable solution for creating a very large city. Chokepoints: GTA3 seems to use major tunnels and bridges not only as a reward system that allows players to get to new areas, but as a level loading mechanism. I''m not sure, but they seem to combine the billboard vista idea with this so that you can see but not get to areas across the water until you go through one of the chokepoints. Any other tricks you know of? -------------------- Just waiting for the mothership...

its not so much of a trick as it is a programming feat

--- dynamic level loading.

Its difficult, but it is possible to load a low detail version of the level (for use in sky lines and such) and then load / unload more detailed versions of regions in another thread as you enter the range of them.

You will probably need to have 4 or 5 levels of detail and to reduce the data in each make the next detailed level use the data of the previous detailed level as a base.

There are a TON of other problems, but thats what programming is all about now isn''t it :-D

Good luck! I''d love to see this working :-P

-SniperBoB-

-SniperBoB-

What if The Matrix was recursive?

Giant cities are in the end pointless if they are cardboard facades, repetitive, not rich in detail, etc.

Variety is the key. Sure, houses can in general look the same, but each should have nuances which define them as unique: different peeling paint, different furnishings, different remodeled floorplans, different porches, different roofs, different windows, etc...

Everything is similar, nothing is even close to being really similar. No single office building is like another, unless part of a business park.

Sure, concrete tilt-ups look alike, and one quonset hut looks like another, until you get closer.

Procedural algorithms are the key. The more the better. The more complex the better.

Do you ever get the feeling that the game you''re playing has no depth and is merely a cardboard environment where each succeeding section really is just built on the template of the last? How tiresome and boring is that? It''s not that much fun. I think I''d rather go outside and play Frisbee.

Don''t make another bigger city that is more of the same. Don''t even bother. Either solve the problems for a richly detailed world, or find another type of game to build.

Yes, variety is important. A lot of buildings is fine, but you need large and small buildings, some with lots of windows, some just made of concrete, large and small main streets, bridges, tunnels, back allies, parks, rural areas if possible. Some areas with trees, a body of water, etc. (Thinking about Carmageddon here)

On a side note:

I would hate living on Coruscant. The whole planet is a city!

I''ve also heard that some people living in Tokyo feel dehumanized because of the extreme lack of flora in the city.

As for tricks, try to design the city such that you can''t see any farther than beyond a certain point (using fog or curved streets) so that rendering is kept to a minimum without keying the player off to your optimizations.