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Cybird

hi-polygons

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Hi, I currently use poser 4 as a modeling tool for my characters, then i export it into 3ds max to optimize it. The problem is that it give me about 40 K POLYS with all that props ect(they are awesome) This is alot of memory, and i wonder if I can share vertices for all those models(use the same geometric meshes as entities and animate entities). Does it is possible to do so? i mean, 40k is really really too much for realtime rendering? newest adapters can easily render millions of polys, right? why all peaple still using very low polys? It will be an outdoor engine, so i need to keep cycles for landscape, wich will be dynamic. How many polys u guys are rendering in your scenes. thx.

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It''s not just the number of polygons that you are rendering to the screen that will affect your fps. Animation, AI, collison detection, lighting, special effects, particles, physics... etc. All of these use cpu/gpu cycles and keeping a lower polygon count can means, in many cases, more of the above can be included. In the absence of all of the above, sure, you could have wonderfully high poly models, but thats all. Thanks to many of the texturing effects now available in real-time rendering (bump-mapping, per-pixel lighting, etc) it is not necessary to have high polycounts to make things "look" more realistic. Now that processing power can be put towards making them "act" more realistic.

Just a thought.

Chris Z.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
I believe I read an article about Unreal 2 a short time ago stating that each model was roughly between 5000 to 7000 polys each. And quite frankly these models look real good. Doom3 with it''s almost CGI like graphics doesn''t even come close to doing 40,000 polys per model. This is why poser isn''t used in the gaming industry. Sure it''s models look nice however they blow polygon budgets out of the water. I''d be honestly suprised if even the Geforce5 video cards could handle more than 10 of these models on screen at one time on a flat plane never mind a dynamic terrain.

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that''s about 10x too many polys man. UT2003, which uses probably the best (commercial) graphics engine that will be out for the rest of the year, uses models of about 3,000 polys. You have to keep in mind that you''re not just rendering the character, you''re rendering everything in one view. This means multiple characters, the environment (possibly terrain with many polys), any decoration type meshes in the view, etc, etc. With 40k poly characters poly counts could quickly shoot to 500k+ and there''s no way anybody''s hardware can handle that.

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quote:

newest adapters can easily render millions of polys, right?



When a video card boasts a certain number of polygons, it''s usually flat-colored, single pixel polygons they are talking about. Also, even if a card can handle so many polygons per second, you are limited in speed to the bus if you are not storing all data in video memory. When reading card specs, you can safely cut the number of polygons down by 1/2 to 1/4 to get a real-world estimate.


*** 500 error x 1

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As Jim says, the published specs are often "maximum measured throughput" nothing else. If you have a GeForce type card, download BenMark5 from the nVidia website, this shows you what the card can **truly** do on your particular system (mobo drivers make a huge difference).

Those polys are small and untextured. You''d expect 15million of those *real* triangles per second out of BenMark5...

15m / 60Hz = 250000 polys per frame @ 60Hz

Say, half that for lots of texturing: 125000

Then, say another half for "practicalities" such as dividing into different render states, engine efficiency, s/w animation etc: 62500+ per frame should be quite easily possible on a GF1 with a properly written engine. If not, the engine is at fault OR the configuration of the machine is at fault.

We had an 85000 poly animated character with 3 realtime vertex point lights going on a GF1 way back in 1999 - and that version of the engine had some serious bottlenecks... [nVidia used the demo in some of their press presentations, the engine was used later in Pac-Man:Adventures in Time].

Usually though it isn''t as clear cut as "maximum poly count" either - if you overcommit texture memory you could end up uploading textures all the time which would drastically reduce the count. Same with too much dynamic data etc...

--
Simon O''Connor
Creative Asylum Ltd
www.creative-asylum.com

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