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Alpha_ProgDes

NTFS vs. FAT32... games for which

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When I was reading WGP (by LaMothe), he said that whatever game you make with DirectX you can play on 95, 98, and NT systems. Because they use the same API. Yet on many boxes (or better, some boxes), they show needing DX drivers but only working on 98 NOT NT. So why is that? Is there any way to get them to work on both straight off? Or do you have to do/code something special to the game to run both OSes?

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It''s not a question of filesystem, it''s a question of "consumer-level" multimedia functions that only existed in the 9x branch and not the NT branch. Conversely, NT had Unicode support while 9x did not. And so on.

So yeah, there are compatibility issues between the different windows branches.

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It''s quite possible that MS has put system calls into newer versions of DX that are not available on W95. - and all that Fruny said too - I didn''t see his response.



"Beautiful maiden," answered Candide, "when a man is in love, is jealous, and has been flogged by the Inquisition, he becomes lost to all reflection."

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Guest Anonymous Poster
To my knowledge, WinNT only supports up to DX 3, though I think one of the later service packs gives you DX 5 (or part) support. I have WinNT with SP 3 and can only get DX 3 functions to work.
Supporting both NT and 9x (XP) is not as easy as just writing your game in DX 3 either. You will come up against some pretty serious performance issues with later version of DX on win9x machines, as DX 3 functionality will be emulated (software) - a big performance hit.
eg. Work - NT SP3, PIII 128MB RAM, on board video -> 21 FPS
Home - XP, AMD 1900 512MB RAM, GF4 128MB video -> 8 FPS
Unless you have specific reason to write for NT, I''d recommend going for supporting win9x with later versions of DX.
Just my experience.
Crow_knee.
*login won''t work*

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So I have the DX 6.1 SDK which also come with the runtime drivers (is that the right term?)

If I loaded that on an Win NT/2000 machine, it still would run my game (which i wrote with DX 6.1) with a software emulator?

that doesn''t sound right.

also since i read it..... (AP)
quote:

Supporting both NT and 9x (XP) is not as easy as just writing your game in DX 3 either. You will come up against some pretty serious performance issues with later version of DX on win9x machines, as DX 3 functionality will be emulated (software) - a big performance hit.
eg. Work - NT SP3, PIII 128MB RAM, on board video -> 21 FPS
Home - XP, AMD 1900 512MB RAM, GF4 128MB video -> 8 FPS



if i write my game with DX7 (DirectDraw) and run it on a machine with DX9 (directgraphics) i would get lower/slower performance?
even with the backward compatible capability?

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Sure.

Windows NT 4 (workstation, server, or whatever) can have DX3 installed (or DX 5 with the latest service pack).
Windows 2000/XP can have DX7+ installed, and thus supports each versions'' calls.
Windows 95 can have up to DX7 installed; support for 8 was dropped or strategically left out by Gates & Co.
Windows 98/Me come with DX5+ preinstalled, thus support the full range of calls appropriate to the installed version.

Since D3D from DX3 uses display lists (from my memory, could be wrong so someone please correct me if need be), and doesn''t necessarily use later-driver optimization for rendering stuff, you won''t get T&L acceleration (introduced with DX 6 I believe).

Some of the stuff Lamothe does, he uses the basic DX1 interface for, without QueryInterface()ing for later versions'' COM interfaces. This (QI()ing) can''t be done for DX8 (and possibly DX 7, can''t recall as I''ve not used it in a while) since you must use DirectX8Create() and the associated creation functions from that release, to be able to use features from that release.



MatrixCubed
http://MatrixCubed.cjb.net

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No, it wont. Dx 6 is not supported on NT.

Care to read at least?

Now, why the **** should anyone use A Dx version below 9 - ups, 8 :-) I mean, NT was never meant to be a game system (or a multimedia system). Stick with 98, MR, 2000, XP. Forget about 95 - that is history.


Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)

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The service pack that added DX5 to NT only added DirectPlay, not DirectDraw or Direct3D. So on NT you have DX5 DirectPlay, DX3 everything else.

Depending on the type of game you''re writing, aiming at DX3 may be a good idea. A lot of popular puzzle games run on NT and are purchased by people who play them at work. Starcraft only requires DX3. It was a big hit for after-hours LAN play.

Though if you''re interested in doing anything 3D I''d really not recommend it.

Stay Casual,

Ken
Drunken Hyena

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quote:
Original post by Alpha_ProgDes
so if i wrote a game using the DX 6.1 code, it will work on NT/2000/XP! Great!

Thanks alot guys; if anyone wants to add to the info please do.


Forget about NT Server as most people who use WinNT use it as SERVER and hence won''t play games with it. As for WinNT workstation, if they really wanted to play games, do you think they''d have NT on there. No. People who install NT usually tend to know what they are doing a bit more than normal users. At least, those I got when I worked as Tech for a (consumer)ISP did..

In other words, don''t bother with NT, code for Win2K, Win98 and XP and you''ll cover the most PCs... As far as I can tell...



[Cyberdrek | the last true sorcerer | Spirit Mage - mutedfaith.com]

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Heh, I hope I don''t cause to much of a ruckus, but that''s one reason I''ve always used OpenGL.... I could write apps on my work machine with hardware acceleration (NT 4.0) without worrying about what version of DirectX/D3D I could install (as it was VERY limited).

Billy - BillyB@mrsnj.com

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If you absolutely have to support NT then you had better stick to using DirectX 3. I''m not sure how good DirectX 5 is for NT but I have never tried it.

If you are writing a game, I would suggest you ignore the NT users market. Not to be mean to them but there aren''t many NT users and it isn''t worth your time as a beginner to be trying to cater to them. Win2K is basically the next version of NT and it supports the latest DirectX. NT users can migrate to Win2K if they want to maintain their NT capabilities and still play modern games.

Win95 supports up to DirectX 8.0 as far as I know. DirectX 8.1 is not compatible with Win95.

Win98, WinME, Win2K and WinXP all support DirectX 8.1. If you are just starting to program games, I would suggets you go with one of those operating systems and use DirectX 8.0/8.1. It seems easier to work with than the previous incarnations. If you only have NT on your machine then you might want to look into purchasing one of the other operating systems. You can get them for between 80 (Win98/ME) and 125 (Win2K).

The file systems you referred to (NTFS and FAT32) are a moot point when it comes to the game. Games don''t care.

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Ummm....
I may be wrong here, but is it at all possible that when someone says "WinNT" that they may not be talking about WinNT4 ?

remember, Win2000 is NT5, and XP is NT as well... The original poster was asking about NTFS, which all versions of NT have... I really don''t think he is talking about NT4 Workstation...

Anyway, as of now, any version of DX will work on 98 and up... only systems that are now restricted are 95, and WinNT4. I wouldn''t be surprised if MS took out support for 98 soon!

I may be wrong, anyway.... hope that clears some things up...

Mike

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Oh, one word on 95 - FORGET IT :-)

8.0 works, no new thing will EVER work. MS has stopped working on it, no fixes, no nothing will come out.

98 has the same fate, IMHO during 2004.


Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)

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