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# We programmers. Are we alone in this world?

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Ok, im feeling kind of depressed and I decided to come to the fourms... Anywho, I was wondering who still attemds High school. if so, are you a REAL popular person? Are you active in your school? ...man, Im none of these things......As soon as I decided to tale up programming, Everyone thinks i''m some sort of geek. It really sucks yuo know, this is my senior year in high school and im no way invloved in my senior class... I wont even be graduating with my class... gah!!!! What will I do!!!! Sometimes I feel like complety isolating myself from society and moving to canada, build a house and live in it'' s basement and program for the rest of my life. I dont know what I should do... hmm... This post might come of as soft, but it''s true. Ok, lets think of bill gates, I wonder how he did in school. Was he the most popular kid around or just some geek that dreamed about building a smaller transistor the size of a nickle? oh well, you know GDnet people, you dont even have to post here... I guess I just needed to get some stuff of my chest, I had a really bad day. I went to my computer science class after school and some JERKOFF would not let me in, (He calls himself a PROGRAMER) Are programers really this mean to other programers? oh well, just some thoughts, cya GDnet and have a nice weekend!!! (Dont stay on your computer all weekend trying to code up your new game

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Bill Gates did extremely well in school and went to Harvard, which he dropped out of to start Microsoft. I do very well (mostly A''s, a few A-''s) in school but I am vastly detached from the majority of my classmates, in that I rarely attend football games dances, etc. I am athletic, though. I am one of the best tennis player in my state and I avidly work out to maintain my superb physical condition.

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I know that highschool seams the only thing that matters when you are in highschool but once highschool is over and real life begins, all those popular people who are so cool now will envy you.

The bottom line is the bottom line. If you make more $$than them they will be shining your shoes while you write the next great piece of software. Keep your head up mate. Your have a bright future as long as you dont get distracted by the pitfalls of trying to be something you are not. A friend in arms, Hamlet "... thats the rub... #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites I''m in high school. I''m also considered delinquant and stupid to the standards set by the school... Background? Never took algebra I, so freshman year I was stuck in Geometry... The trig part isn''t hard, it''s the proofs I didn''t do well with. Sure its easy, but stupid questions deserve stupid answers. I share Einstein''s thoughts with school, who also failed math (I didn''t though), "...and I do believe that the repetitious block schedule of school is damaging for a young brain." Let''s see, 10th grade they shoved me in Alg II, and now as a junior I''m in College Algebra. The only reason I don''t take precalc is because it will drain my time away from coding. You wouldn''t belive me if I told you I have a strong understanding of mathematics, but that''s because you were probably looking at my math grades through high school. They weren''t terrible, but I did earn a D (I wont say that I recieved a D, because I did earn the D) at one point. Why am I saying this? Well some voice in my head told me to. I just wanted to point out that we (the programming community) are humans, too. The one thing that I really hate about programming is that it seems like the nicest people who use computers are online, and the meanest, most ignorant, dumbfounded people who use computers are irl. Anyway, you have my 3 cents. ~ Jesse The gl2D Project | Free programming books #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites Definetly agree with Hamlet. The people who are regard as cool in highschool are generally the boozers and pot-heads. While that might get you somewhere socially in highschool, there is simply no place in the world of success for those types. You are doing the hard thing, and it should pay off eventually. Also, when you get to college, all that stuff will be a problem. In college, expressing yourself in your own unique way is encouraged, while in highschool it is suppressed. Just hang in there. #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites *will not be a problem #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites I''m a senior in high school. I guess I''m popular within the computer-nerd clique. We had a 5 day weekend this week and I had a 12-person LAN party!! Outside of the geek community, a lot of people know me but I don''t spend much time with them outside of school. I always try to get to know whoever''s sitting next to me in a class, and usually get along with them. I don''t attend school football games or any other school events. Just be yourself and if people don''t want to hang out with you then they can f*ck off, because others will. In 9th and 10th grade I didn''t care much about my grades and got mostly B''s with a few A''s and C''s, using minimal effort. I started to care in 11th grade and now I have a 3.5 GPA. Proceeding on a brutal rampage is the obvious choice. #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites I graduated last spring, but here goes anyway: Popularity isn''t a good thing to judge yourself by. I didn''t consider myself very popular, but the people that did know me seemed to like me. That said, even if I wasn''t popular, just about everybody in the school knew me knew me because I would do things. If you feel bad about having not done anything in high school... DO SOMETHING, if there''s still time. You said you were graduating early... If there''s time, join a sport, don''t worry about how good you think you''ll be. Start playing the drums or guitar or something. It''s easier than you think, you just have to work hard at it. Try acting. Or helping with the stage. Or lighting. Or Sound. There are places that will let you help, even if you have never done that sort of thing before. You probably won''t get paid for it though The only reason people say high school was the best time of their lives was because they were young and they are too lazy to make their whole life the best time of their lives. It''s never too late to make changes in your life for the better. Most important, remember that you can program and have a life. #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites Only people in high school take high school seriously. It''s more important to like what you do than to be doing what everyone else does. As for the ass not letting you into the classroom, as I see it you have three options. One is to report him to the faculty. Second would be going to your parent or guardian. Third would be to show him that he really CAN fit into a mid-tower case. I''ll leave it to you to decide which suggestion to follow...although I''d personally skip the time and effort of the first two. Much more efficient to pop him in the nose when he ain''t lookin''. Fair play is for courts and third graders. ShadeStorm, the Day_Glo Fish #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites I am active in hs - Running and Officers. Also I am well known, and although some of my "friends" are in the popular crowd, I prefer not to be. Let me say something about popularity. It may seem like being popular is being in the crowd but that''s not true. Being popular is being known - not being in the crowd. If people know you for a game programmer, that makes you known and therefore you''re popular whether you can recognise it or not. Here''s what sucks about being popular (I wuz at 1 time but left cuz it wasn''t fun). Don''t think if you''re not that you''re missing out because you''re DEFINITLY NOT. Here''s what sucks: 1.) Friends don''t last. Populars tend to have a few close friends, but otherwise many just come-and-go friends. This may seem like they are "popular" because they know all these people but it can actually make you depressed to have friends that don''t stay for long and only last until they realize something about you they don''t like - which is every1. 2.) It''s all an act. On the outside, they seem confident and always happy. This DOESN''T continue afterwards. At home, I remember countless times how I was depressed that friends kept leaving and although from other''s view I was, that''s not how I felt. Everything seemed screwed up. 4.) Their morals and values arn''t correct. Sure, you may at first think because of this they get to have all the fun of drinking, sex, etc but there''s a definite downside to it. Not only do some of them get pregnant n such but other things collide. For example, one person (who is very popular)took this girl who wuz also popular to the homecoming dance. After the first few dances, and after he had spent all this time taking her to dinner and stuff, she left him there to hang out with upperclassman and he ended sitting in the corner along the whole time. She had a great time grinding with seniors but the unfortinate date was left alone. This was just one example but there were at least 10 other populars standing around who were left all alone there - some even crying. 5.) You can have more fun with friends who arn''t popular. When you''re with popular friends, then you have to put on an act. Unless you''re special, most people put on an act to keep their social status. When you''re with your true friends, you can be yourself. You don''t have to think everytime you go to speak and many times you can act like a complete idiot and nobody will care. True friends are the ones you can be yourself around and will have the most fun with. 6.) It''s VERY VERY easy to do things you normally wouldn''t do. Although the obvious may be drugs, sex, and other risky behaviors, this also includes for girls becomming anorexic. It''s amazing how many people are and you have no idea until the next year when their a fricken stick and it''s sooo obvious and ugly. Like all of the risky stuff, what you start to become cool you finish becomming uncool. 7.) Depression happens all the time. Believe it or not, I''d say 70% of the people in the popular crowd have thought about commiting suicide at least once. I admit I have but true friends are the ones to get you through it. Others will almost literaly let you go and make you feel even worse. That''s all I can think of rite now. Here''s another story that mite cheer you up. A friend of mine, Rosie, left our school to temporarily move to another school for the next few years in 6th grade. She wasn''t extremly popualar (average) and her friends were true ones. When she got to her new school, she became extremly popular - like the one everybody wants. She did almost everything you can think of. The thing was, nobody would have expected it because she was always so smart and obviously that wasn''t. She seriously tried to commit suicide during those years 3 times (and it was close - one time 20 painkiller and emergency close)! Her friends there didn''t care and her friends back in my school were the only ones to get her through it - also her parents and guidence. When she came back, she had so much to tell however she didn''t, under her decision, become popular here because she knew what had happen at her old school. If you can just take your regular goody-too-shoe in your school and imagine her being like that, that was how it was. So far she seems not be anything like her last-year''s school self. But now her friends, including me, are true to her and would never be like the ones there. Well I hafta go. Wish i could help u out more. Good luck. --- Brent Gunning | My Site #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites I used to be that geeky nerd back in high school that couldn't care less about girls or parties. I just played games, did RPGs (paper and pencil), programmed and loved math. I actually liked that role - but I was no means popular. Now ten years later; look at whose laughing now. The popular people in class are mostly loosers today while I my geek friends have come very far and have good well-paying jobs. At the recent party for old students it was clear that the "popular" ones envied me know. So the point is: Do what you are good at and what you love. If it is programming then you will surely be the cool one in the end. I was happy then - and I am happy now. [edited by - felonius on October 18, 2002 7:45:14 PM] #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites that''s all well & good...the balance where some ppl are intelligent while others aremore popular...but what if you''re dumb and unpopular! #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites I think Einstein failed maths because he was too busy doing his own experiments and didn''t have time for homework. He wasn''t dummy I don''t think. Two years after grad. high school I went to have a dinner at local restaurant and who served me the food? One of the high school jerks. How tables turned I was into rc planes when in high school and since noone else was I instead found a local flying club and joined it. Had lots of fun. Maybe there are local "programming" clubs around your area, check it out you never know. #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites Yeah, what then, smart happy guy??? #### Share this post ##### Link to post ##### Share on other sites Sometimes i wanna be in the in crowd again, I wanna have tons of friends even if they don''t really care. Sometimes I wanna go to these parties try everything and just let loose. Then i realize who is on the other side(so to speak). I can''t count on my fingers and toes how many jerks, @$$holes, D***s, etc. There are on that "side". I don''t wanna be like them at all and that''s pretty comforting.

As for grades, grades are nothing but how much your teacher likes you and how much you feel like doing this stupid work they give you. I don''t have great grades, mine range from D-B.I''m not the best person for solving math problems(especially proofs!) and programming comes so easy to me. I get an A easily in my programming classes and i don''t even try at all. Don''t think of grades as how smart you are at all cuz it has nothing to do with it.

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I am pretty popular at school. But I don''t have any close friends. To be honest, being popular is flattering, but it doesn''t take care of your inner needs. It''s weird though... I used to be a geek who everyone looked down on and had a few good friends. But back then, I was so obsessed with being popular because I wanted to look cool. Well, the tables turned. And trust me, I''d prefer things back then to things now. All the people I talk to come and go. I never have a chance to really get to know anyone. People just like me because I am funny. I don''t have any close friends because I don''t know anyone who shares my interests.

And about being popular, it came for me when I stopped trying, which is pretty ironic. I just let myself be who I am and didn''t hold back if I wanted to make a joke or anything and I made people laugh. But it''s not worth it. Popularity ends after high school anyway and this is my last year. And as
RapidStunna said, popular kids get depressed too. In fact, I struggle with depression a lot, but I mask it in front of people since I don''t think they all really want to hear about my problems. It really sucks to tell you the truth. I wish I had someone close I could tell things too and know they''d never leave me. I always wanted someone who''d love me for who I am as a person and not because I can put on a good act.

If you have a few good friends, then you are much better off. Trust me.

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I finished high school back in ''96 and must say that I was never considered a nerd or geek, even though I was very much a programmer. Much of this was due to the fact that I don''t look like a programmer and am involved in contact sports such as boxing.
But, what I found is that this popularity stuff really didn''t count for anything. Sure, in high school being popular meant that you got the girls and didn''t get picked on, but after school, things tend to change dramatically.
The thing is that, the ones who spent the time studying rather than partying will tend to be more successful (financially) which will lead to a happier existance. Many of my popular school friends ended up being heroine junkies, extreme pot-heads etc. etc.
On the other hand, some of my nerdy school friends have gone on to successful careers.
And another thing, if you look like a nerd then believe me, this will help you in the end. I can''t count the amount of job interviews I''ve had where I''ve been told that I''m perfect for the job over the phone, then am rejected at the interview based on the fact that I look more like a thug than a programmer. I then find that the job was given to someone less qualified and less able to demonstrate their abilities, simply because they look more the type.
So basically, being a nerd is probably going to benefit you in the long run. So leave being popular for when you''re earning good money from all that hard study!

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Being popular doesn''t mean you have to drink, smoke pot etc. I was popular in my highschool and everyone knew I was a straight edge. And just because someone is popular doesn''t mean they are jerks.

sonicteam, get involved with your senior class. The thing is, it might seem easier if you went home after school, because you wouldn''t have to deal with jerks. But if you stayed after school and did something with your class mates you will at least make one friend that will associate you outside the club or whatever you decided to join.

Also pick up a non-programming hobby, ice-skate, tennis, rock climb! Anything that you can do twice a week all year round. Once you pick up this hobby become half way decent if you go to the tennis court every week you probaly will meet one person there. Once you become half way decent find someone in school to play tennis with.

Join a sport, like the other poster said, even if you suck you have 20 people on the team with you that will help you out. You might have some hard practices where people are mean to you, but by the end of the season you will have made 20 friends. Teams are like that.

Also even if you decide you don''t want anything to do with highschool then thats fine. Just remeber study hard make something with your life, be the best programmer there is. Get your computer science degree make an awesome demo get on to ID''s game programming team. High school is not important except for getting you into college. There will be tons of people in college who are exactly like you and you will have no trouble fitting into the crowd.

Don''t worry bud, just hang in there

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I''m a senior, and I go to a governor''s high school for science and tech (TJHSST, if by any chance someone from there reads this). It''s like a super-magnet school, actually.

But since everyone at my school is either a nerd/genius, an overachiever, or just good at taking tests, there isn''t really one central popular group.
Instead, there are many smaller rings of friends who either came from the same middle school, or share and interest/sport. And these rings don''t really interact with each other like, say, jocks and goths might at a normal school. I''m not fortunate enough to belong to one, though.

I was in one back in freshman year, but we mainly just played cards at lunch. And as it turned out, half of the group if on the math team (I''m not), and we all like programming.

But sophmore year I got greedy. I didn''t know anyone near my house (the school is 45 miles away), and I started to edge my way into a not-so-wholesome group. Three suspensions later, I was confined to the front seat of the bus, and didn''t get to talk to my other group of friends there (I only talked to them on the bus). It was pretty much like 4 months of having 2 classes a day of solitary confinement, and I think something inside me changed.

Junior year I resolved to change, and I did. I sank all of my free time into homework and programming, and my grades sure did improve. But I still felt empty, like even though I enjoyed programming, there was no point. I also started skateboarding at lunch and almost entered the circle of skaters -- but the administration just had to put a stop to it.

The thing is, though, that this year I''ve given up caring if I''m alone. It''s actually not that bad, so long as your truly aren''t bothered by it (and aren''t just feeling sorry for yourself). That whole "self-pity to make others feel sorry for me" thing doesn''t actually work; I know, I tried.

People still feel sorry for me when they hear that I''ve never been to a dance, or a school football game, or that I spend my free time programming. But the important thing is that in a year I''ll be in college, and I''ll get the chance to have all of the LAN parties and game tournaments I want.

The other thing is that friendships never happen when you overthink them, so setting out to make friends is a really tough thing to do. Your best bet is to, in the words of the Beatles, "Let It Be". It''ll all work out in the end.

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I know what you mean. Sometimes absolutely loving programming and wanting to do nothing else can make people not like you. Sometimes I even put programming over my friends. I''m one of those people who only has a few friends but the ones I do are the BEST true friends you can get. Another thing is I don''t even go to school i HOME SCHOOL. This means that I get to do what I wan''t I focus all my subjects around programming. Already I''ve completely learnt the C++ language reackon I''m a kick arese programmer, I mean I fully understand how to program, published things other professional programmers think are COOL and I don''t even go to school and am only 14. And the way I see it is. Get yourself some true friends and stuff being popular. As for going to Canada and building your own house and programming in the basement for the rest of your life well that sounds like my idea of heaven. But then again I''m weird...

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I''m a junior, been programming for 5 years now. I live in the middle of nowhere with a bunch of cow-hicks. I''ve found a few other computer-involved friends. The only way we stay sain is through eachother. I find myself cutting off from society, and when I do I try to do somthing about it. I go on dates, or hang out with my semi-friends. I''m not "popular", but people respect me. I get mostly A''s. I find peace in relegion, and programming. Well, good luck, and don''t do anything you''ll regret (that way you won''t have to regret anything you do )

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And to comment on ph33r''s post, I''d suggest taking up a so-called "extreme sport". Skateboard, BMX or rollerblade (I suggest the first or the third option, because they''re easier and cheaper).
You''d be surprised how close skate culture is to that of programmers -- both encourage people to help each other improve. It''s a very constructive atmosphere. And, like in programming, there''s instant gratification. You learn a new trick, you feel great. You finally get a segment of code to work, and you''re on top of the world.

And another reason is that you wouldn''t believe how well you can make friends that way. If you learn to at least ride around on your own, then you can just skate around the neighborhood until you find someone else who is skating. It''s almost like we have a sixth sense; when one person is skating, other people just seem to magically flock towards them.

The other upside is that there''s no commitment. You don''t have to practice if you don''t want to, and it''s not centered around a game that determines who wins (and loses). Plus there''s no feeling quite like launching off a ramp and just hanging in the air

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Well here is my two cents worth...My friends call me a geek and a nerd...I don''t look the part, but they know I am. I have a degree in history and computer science and I am still in my early to mid 20''s.

And when I am home I love to program and surf the net and fix up old computers and play video games. My friends know that. Do they think I am a geek? Yes...Do they know I am smart? yes...when they know someone who needs help with homework do they call me? Of course.

But they also know I am funny, almost always in a good mood and would do anything in the world for them. I think we all have our thing. One of my friends loves cars and fixing them.

Find friends that don''t care what you do in your spare time and like you for yourself. If they do care they aren''t good friends

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Hey I''ll have to agree with yoda5 on this, my friends and I are the same way... I''m almost always in a good mood, yeah shit happens to me... A LOT, but I''ve just learned to take it as it comes, and do the best I can... All I can really tell you about high school, is just look ahead at life and realize that it dosen''t mean shit! I don''t want to think about how many times I''ve helped the dumbass people that I knew in school at my job, and I look at my life and compare it to what I know of theirs. Half of them have already gotten married (can you say pregnancy?), or are still working some dead end jobs that they hate. Me I''m still single (Yeah I wound''t mind a girlfriend, but I''ve got too much shit going on right now to really stress over it), I''m working two jobs, one (I work in a parts store) I like most of the time, and I''ve leared a LOT about how cars work and how fix them and take care of them. The other (I install hardwood flooring) I''m enjoying quite thouroghly, I''m getting stronger and I''m learning some more valuable skills. But hey do what you love and hang out with those who accept you for who you are (yeah it sounds corny, buts its the truth). Learn all that you can from people, it makes you a more intresting person so more people will want to be around you. If you know a lot about a lot of different things, you will be the popular one.

-Just hang in there man and don''t stress, it''ll all work out in the end.

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Personally I don''t know why people are so bothered with the geek / nerd lable. Im a geek and damned proud!!

Also when you are considered the lowest of the low in social scales and so on, think about it. Nothing you can do is embarassing because everyone already thinks poorly of you, you can do basically anything you want, in any situation and still come out with the same respect as you had before (i.e. feth all). Its extremely liberating to think like this. Also if you know that nobody has respect for you then you don''t have to care what they think.

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