Selling your idea
I''m going to disagree slightly in the opinion that ideas are worthless. Let''s modify that to say bad ideas are worthless, and everyone does have a bad idea. Great ideas or even good ideas are hard to come by, and yes, people do pay a lot of money for great ideas. Is an idea all you need to secure a contract? I don''t know. I''ve never tried (nor have I had that great idea), but I''ll assume if your idea is great, you won''t have problems selling it. That seems to be how the rest of the business world works, so the gaming industry can''t be far off.
quote:Original post by JDBrown
Great ideas or even good ideas are hard to come by, and yes, people do pay a lot of money for great ideas. Is an idea all you need to secure a contract? I don''t know. I''ve never tried (nor have I had that great idea), but I''ll assume if your idea is great, you won''t have problems selling it. That seems to be how the rest of the business world works, so the gaming industry can''t be far off.
Nope, you´re wrong there, people in the gaming biz don´t pay for ideas (not even great ideas). And without at least a demo there´s no chance for a contract.
Again, I don''t have any experience selling a game idea, so I don''t know. Hase, since you seem to be knowledgable in this matter, perhaps you can fill us in on your first hand experience in trying to sell an idea with only a treatment.
Most people who write treatments want to make games. That means that your goals are to get funding, as well as a reliable publisher who will get your game to the largest audience possible. Since the development costs are steadily increasing you´ll definitely need some financial backing (take two years development time and twenty people, you´re above a million $/€ in personnell costs already). Since these are considerable sums, even for large companies, your investors will want as much assurance as possible that they´ll get their money back.
So the two things they´re going to examine closely are the game you want to make and your team or company. If you submit only a treatment they´ll have the basic idea of the game, but no marketing information, no idea how much it will cost, no idea about what other products may be in conflict with it.. that means that a treatment alone is more or less worthless to a publisher - this is gross oversimplification, but think of them not as game people but bank people. They don´t necessarily care or know much about games, their business is money (and rightfully so). That means that they´re interested in everything relating to the financial situation of the project (they´re the ones putting the cash on the table, as well as carrying most of the rist). What you´ll need on that side are all kinds of marketing documentation, project planning and market analyses. And since you can´t do most of that on the basis of a treatment you´ll need a more detailed concept, or better yet a complete game design document. That doesn´t mean that the potential publisher will ask for a complete gd, but you can´t do an effort estimation without one.
The second big thing they´re usually interested in is if you can actually pull off the project you´re advertising (just look in the help wanted section for a taste of this problem). To proove that you can actually do it a finished game is perfect - if you´re a startup then you´ll need something else, usually a demo... self running at the minimum, look and feel preferred.. playable at best. Actually, in the publishers ideal scenario you have already finished the game befor they shell out any money, but that´s obviously not an option for most developers.
As for selling ideas "as is" to someone who might want to develop them, that´s also not going to happen. Every developer in every studio on this planet is going to have several game ideas lying around on his desk, just waiting for the chance to actually work on one of them. In a nutshell: Ideas are worthless.
What counts is implementation, that does not necessarily mean something playable. If you really think that your idea is good then you might invest the time and work out a game design document (and don´t bother calling it that if it´s under a hundred pages). That doesn´t mean that you can sell a design document (although the chances are marginally better than selling an idea).
The reasons for this are simple: you´ll have to find a developer for your idea, which means that they have to like your already completed game design more than what they have lying around, as well as having to work with your style of design doc.
What it might be good for however is attracting freelance design work, which (contrary to some opinions here) does happen occasionally. It doesn´t work along the lines of "hey, could you write a game design for us", but more like "we need a game design for platform X, license Y and budget Z until next month". That means that (if you can convince the prospective employer that you´re able to do it) you´re a troubleshooter at best, because all the developers who are able to do big games have their own design people, which means that they use their own design docs, their own templates, etc.
If you´re troubleshooting that means that somewhere the proverbial shit has almost hit the fan - a publisher will come by soon, investors are getting edgy, or in the best case - a sudden shower of money hit the company. Otherwise the task would be done in-house.
As for the original posters question: I´d write a design doc (which takes practise too), mabye put together your own team (if it´s doable in a smaller frame - most ideas are pretty scaleable if you do it early on in the design process), or use it as a portfolio piece later on.
hope this helps.
edit: formatting
[edited by - Hase on December 29, 2002 8:57:50 PM]
So the two things they´re going to examine closely are the game you want to make and your team or company. If you submit only a treatment they´ll have the basic idea of the game, but no marketing information, no idea how much it will cost, no idea about what other products may be in conflict with it.. that means that a treatment alone is more or less worthless to a publisher - this is gross oversimplification, but think of them not as game people but bank people. They don´t necessarily care or know much about games, their business is money (and rightfully so). That means that they´re interested in everything relating to the financial situation of the project (they´re the ones putting the cash on the table, as well as carrying most of the rist). What you´ll need on that side are all kinds of marketing documentation, project planning and market analyses. And since you can´t do most of that on the basis of a treatment you´ll need a more detailed concept, or better yet a complete game design document. That doesn´t mean that the potential publisher will ask for a complete gd, but you can´t do an effort estimation without one.
The second big thing they´re usually interested in is if you can actually pull off the project you´re advertising (just look in the help wanted section for a taste of this problem). To proove that you can actually do it a finished game is perfect - if you´re a startup then you´ll need something else, usually a demo... self running at the minimum, look and feel preferred.. playable at best. Actually, in the publishers ideal scenario you have already finished the game befor they shell out any money, but that´s obviously not an option for most developers.
As for selling ideas "as is" to someone who might want to develop them, that´s also not going to happen. Every developer in every studio on this planet is going to have several game ideas lying around on his desk, just waiting for the chance to actually work on one of them. In a nutshell: Ideas are worthless.
What counts is implementation, that does not necessarily mean something playable. If you really think that your idea is good then you might invest the time and work out a game design document (and don´t bother calling it that if it´s under a hundred pages). That doesn´t mean that you can sell a design document (although the chances are marginally better than selling an idea).
The reasons for this are simple: you´ll have to find a developer for your idea, which means that they have to like your already completed game design more than what they have lying around, as well as having to work with your style of design doc.
What it might be good for however is attracting freelance design work, which (contrary to some opinions here) does happen occasionally. It doesn´t work along the lines of "hey, could you write a game design for us", but more like "we need a game design for platform X, license Y and budget Z until next month". That means that (if you can convince the prospective employer that you´re able to do it) you´re a troubleshooter at best, because all the developers who are able to do big games have their own design people, which means that they use their own design docs, their own templates, etc.
If you´re troubleshooting that means that somewhere the proverbial shit has almost hit the fan - a publisher will come by soon, investors are getting edgy, or in the best case - a sudden shower of money hit the company. Otherwise the task would be done in-house.
As for the original posters question: I´d write a design doc (which takes practise too), mabye put together your own team (if it´s doable in a smaller frame - most ideas are pretty scaleable if you do it early on in the design process), or use it as a portfolio piece later on.
hope this helps.
edit: formatting
[edited by - Hase on December 29, 2002 8:57:50 PM]
I'm not clear on if your idea is a large game or not. If it is a large game, then do this:
1) Set your scope small. Find one or two like-minded people and hash out a game to create to prove to yourselves that you can create a game from concept to implementation to delivery. Then create it.
2) If you get to this step - that is more than what 99.9% of people who want to make games actually accomplish. It's a big milestone - relish it. Now repeat it. And don't neglect your first title. If you choose your first title correctly, it will sell for years, generating some income. Check out articles here and at GarageGames and Dexterity for advice on how to do this.
3) If you can repeat it, that's phenomenal. None of your games need to be a "hit". This is a learning experience, don't expect to make a lot of money. Now you might know enough and have enough contacts and enough skills in your team to tackle something larger. This would be the time to tackle a larger game (if your idea is a larger game).
If your idea is a small game - then possibly make that one of your first couple of smaller-scoped games.
Dave Myers
Vice President
21-6 Productions, Inc.
[edited by - Dave_21-6 on December 29, 2002 9:56:31 PM]
1) Set your scope small. Find one or two like-minded people and hash out a game to create to prove to yourselves that you can create a game from concept to implementation to delivery. Then create it.
2) If you get to this step - that is more than what 99.9% of people who want to make games actually accomplish. It's a big milestone - relish it. Now repeat it. And don't neglect your first title. If you choose your first title correctly, it will sell for years, generating some income. Check out articles here and at GarageGames and Dexterity for advice on how to do this.
3) If you can repeat it, that's phenomenal. None of your games need to be a "hit". This is a learning experience, don't expect to make a lot of money. Now you might know enough and have enough contacts and enough skills in your team to tackle something larger. This would be the time to tackle a larger game (if your idea is a larger game).
If your idea is a small game - then possibly make that one of your first couple of smaller-scoped games.
Dave Myers
Vice President
21-6 Productions, Inc.
[edited by - Dave_21-6 on December 29, 2002 9:56:31 PM]
what if you create an entire game, fully polished and bug free.... what kinds of deals would a publishing company make to sell your game as is (or nearly as is)?
I''m stuck in the same boat here bud.
I have exactly the same problem, an excellent idea but no way to show it. I have a friend who knows someone who works in game development, I spoke to him on the phone and what he said made things a little easier for me to cope with.
All you really need to do is find a clear way to show your game in all it''s glory, so that every angle looks clear when you look at it. (artwork, story, even sound tracks if you want)
They don''t want to have to read through loads of notes, or flick through loads of sketches, they want it as simple as you can provide it, explaining all the basics of the game.
I have exactly the same problem, an excellent idea but no way to show it. I have a friend who knows someone who works in game development, I spoke to him on the phone and what he said made things a little easier for me to cope with.
All you really need to do is find a clear way to show your game in all it''s glory, so that every angle looks clear when you look at it. (artwork, story, even sound tracks if you want)
They don''t want to have to read through loads of notes, or flick through loads of sketches, they want it as simple as you can provide it, explaining all the basics of the game.
This topic is closed to new replies.
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