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DaWookie

MS C++ .Net Unoptimized Compiler?

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Just curious if anyone out there can answer this. I am currently using MSVC++ 5 and am thinking about moving up to v7.0 or .NET as its called. The STANDARD edition has a "unoptimized compiler" and MS suggest "serious developers" purchase the studio level product which approaches the $1000 range as opposed to the $100 for the Standard. Is the unoptimized compiler really that big of a deal? What exactly isn''t being optimized? I can live with v5 and dx8.1 for now, but if I need/want to move to dx9 i know I have to move up to v6 or 7 of msvc++... For anyone using the newer compiler...whats ur take??? Thanks ahead for the info

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I''m curious to know about this too. If anyone by chance has both the Std and Pro for some reason, please post some benchies on a generic benchmark program.

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you don''t need both to do a comparison, just compile with optimizations turned off! while i couldn''t be bother benchmarking them, i can tell you that if your trying to do anything with much maths or access a lot of data (read game) then you really do want the optimizing compiler....unless of course you''ve got a P4 3GHz...

i''d imagine something like a tetris clone or perhaps even a simple RTS would run OK, but much more and you''ll be counting seconds per frame, not frames per second.

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Depends on where you bottlenecks are. My shadowing code is fillrate limited so no amount of cpu will cure that. I need faster gfx card. Also, some d3dx functions use 3dnow/simd instructions. In my case I use vc++6 std. and have no need for optimizing compiler at this point in time. You can always buy one when you''re nearly finished with your project then compile it w/optimizations. In normal dev cycle you''re going to be running debug libs/runtimes with bunch of asserts so optmizations are turned off or not desirable. Btw, I would try to optimize out algos instead of asm instructions because algos will have more of an impact on your speeds in my experience. After that hand tuned asm ''might'' speed up your code 2x fold or more depending on circumstances at work.

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The .NET SDK includes the standard C++ compiler. (it compiles unmanaged stuff just fine) You can get it for free, and try it out, if you''re so inclined. (and are brave enough to compile things without an IDE )

I''m hip because I say "M$" instead of "MS".

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Do you have MSVC++ 5, standard or professional? There is a upgrade for MSVC++ 5 prof.


http://msdn.microsoft.com/visualc/howtobuy/pricing.asp

Visual C++ .NET Standard (full) $109

Visual Studio .NET Professional Edition (full) $1,079

Visual Studio .NET Professional Upgrade $549

Customers who qualify for this upgrade price include licensed users of:
Visual C++, Professional Edition or Enterprise Edition, 5.0 or later


I wouldn''t buy this. These prices are outrageously ridiculous. Get MSVC 6.0++
and save yourself a couple hundred dollars.

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quote:
Is the unoptimized compiler really that big of a deal?


That depends on you. I would recommend against producing anything you intend to sell with VC++.NET Standard Edition. If you are just learning and will probably purchase another compiler before you sell what you produce, then go with it. It is just fine for learning.

quote:
What exactly isn''t being optimized?


Everything but the comments.

quote:
For anyone using the newer compiler...whats ur take???


Personally I would upgrade for the newer standard library and better language support. See if you qualify for the Academic Edition; it is the Professional Edition but at student pricing. And yes, the Academic Edition optimizes.

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BTW, you might want to see when VC++.NET 2003 ( a.k.a version 7.1) will be released and get that instead. I am not sure about the release date, and I have to go so you are on your own there.

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quote:
Original post by Evil Bill
...but you''re not allowed to release anything with it.

Wrong. There are no restrictions on what you can do with the output from VS.NET Academic.

Now go use Gamedev''s non-existent forum search feature and dig up all the previous discussions on this topic.



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