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NeoReality

Average age of Game programmers and the speed of technology

73 posts in this topic

Perhaps the reason we see so many overweight programmers is not because programmers become lazy, but because lazy people find programming to be something they can do without expending to much energy.

E:cb woof!
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I''ve been programming in C/C++ for about 5-6 months, but mind you it was only a casual thing, I''ve only recently being taking it seriously for about a month. I''m only 17 and I''ve almost finished my first game, which is a multiplayer - puzzle game. I think that'' s good for the amount of time I''ve been programming.
Hey OreoBoy I know exactly what you mean. I would still enjoy a career in the games industry though. You will find that professionals are actually cooler than you think. I went to the australian game developers conference and the professionals looked nothing like what was sterotyped. In fact the only person I was supicious of was a fat guy in a hawian shirt and he turned out to be a artist. Most of the programmers looked more like rock stars with their hair half way down their backs(like mine ). I also play guitar as well. I used to be heaps into it, but I''m starting to play again as well. Instead of thinking about putting a band together, you should find a partner who is either a guitarist or bass player and has the same skills as you, and jam together and do that now. You will find yourself getting much better very fast.

David
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If professional coders were so darn anti-social, un-hygenic and a pain in the ass to work with this job would be impossible. You''re stuck with these people 9 - 5 at best and for days at a time at worst.
Most of the coders I''ve met have been fun loving people who enjoy a night out drinking and partying.
And I''ve been in the industry 3 years btw.

Mike
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I am 18 years old and I am programming (games) since I was 12 years old. I think that a good game programmer has finished at least some university or something like that... Hardcore game programming involves so much math... you just don''t understand it if you are 14 years old or something like that.

Dark

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I am 17 years old. I work at an ISP but I do games programming in my spare time. I plan to be in university for a long time, and I fear that by the time I get out, games technology will be too advanced for new programmers to be able to get into the industry If you''re thoughts on this differ, I will be interested to hear them.
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hey, don''t say that people are too young to program stuff. My first introduction to programming was when I was programming my old ti-86 calculator in basic. Then I got into assembly for the ti-86 Zilog proccessor. This was when I was about 13. I even wrote a space invader game in good-ole asm. Then I got into computer programming. I started learning C. The game concepts came pretty easily at first. Within my first year I wrote Tic-Tac-Toe,Pong,Breakout, and Space Invader clones. I am now 15 and learning about OpenGL. I am even writing a basic protal engine. I hate when people that say you can''t learn when you''re too young. Granted I have not yet experienced all of the math that is needed, I am ahead for my age in my math class.
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sorry I can''t spell worth anything, that''s portal engine, not protal engine.
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I''m 23 and I work for a service company. I''ve tried to enter the games industry but here, in Spain, almost doesn''t exist. Besides, they pay half what you can get in the rest of the computer industry. However, I still keep in touch with a few guys in the industry.

By now, I''ve decided to do amateur game programming and see what will happen in the future.
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Hope this gets posted as me (NeoReality).
I''m well chuffed on how well this post has gone. Its given me (and every one else) a look at the cross section of programmers in and trying to get into the Industry.

OreoBoy, I should soon be hooked through AOL IM as soon as ntl get me my fecking disk. To all thouse with musical tallent, I''m well jelious! I took GSCE music to find I couldn''t keep and note had no rythem and totally tone deaf! But at least i could read the music ;-P

Oh and OreoBoy! I don''t think there is Vickies secret over here,(UK) We''ve got Ann Summers Which I guess is the same kind of stuff! Oh and in Nottingham there is a two cool Bondage/fetish/Kinky underwear Shops. But the armoury''s prices are so high you need to be a tory politician to afford any thing ;->

MagicDude at 15 you''re doing damb well. At the same age I was following a similar path. In scouts one of the two badges I got was the computer badge. Then (10 years ago) we played with BBC Micros. Where in the UK are you? At school I excelled in the same areas, but I found jeliousy from some of the older kids who ran the computer club. If you encounter the same crap give them the finger and do it your way!
Oh And dont fear not being able to get into the industry if the stuff posted here is true, its just a case of time and effort! C++ at 15 you''ve got the skills!
And as for books you''re right on there finding information here is crap, but www.pcbooks.co.uk and amazon.co.uk should be all you need if your folks can help put up the cash!

BitBlt.. I''ve never seen a pic of Andre Lamothe, but I rate his books. And your handle is bang on!

8 Post''s left till dedicated

For all Coders in England any you guys n'' galls in or near Nottingham

What else do you need; besides a miricle.
Money. Lots of Money. or I''ll never do a sequel!
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I believe you can find a picture of Andre on his website xgames3d.com - he''s not quite what you would expect (or maybe he is, depending on the person! )

Breakaway Games
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quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster

Ok. . .I missed out on something here??? When I was twelve I did *some* programming (a cheesehead Space Invaders clone in Basic), which is about as far as I got before my teens, which were for the most part spent being an idiot. Then, at eighteen I decided that professional pot smoker is probably not a primo career choice and decided to program. My point is: Does everyone in the world know DirectX at age sixteen? If I can''t do object classes in C without a book at twenty, should I hang the whole thing up and stick to knitting? What''s the deal here?


/*Did you ever consider blaming your bad memory on pot? It is clinically proven to cause memory loss. */

I''m 13 and I know DirectX, Winapi, C++, MFC, VB, QBASIC, and some java. I found it quite easy. But that might just be thatI think rather like the computer does (I need very precise instructions for thigs I do and I take things very litterally, according to other people). I have a lot of free time and money (don''t socialise, don''t listen to music, watch very little television). However, don''t give up. You''ll make it.
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quote:
Original post by OreoBoy03

You''re just special then Anon Poster . No, I know that cool, athletic programmers do exist, like me and you. But there are some really nerdy kids at my school that spend lunch reading books about C++, the big fat kind. That scares the hell out of me! Why not be socializing with the ladies , or hanging with friends (maybe they don''t have any ), or something. If they were really desperate, there''s always that group smoking god knows what outside in the parking lot near the woods... No, cool programmers do exist, like everybody her on GameDev !!! But there are also the really nerd-geek-freak-weird kind of programmers, and they scared me away from ever wanting to be a programmer a long time ago. It''s tragic !!! Gotta run, catch you all later.


I read DirectX and software 3d books all the time. Are you saying there is something wrong with that? I think about graphics algorithms during lunch. (about the group smoking god knows what, I got one of them into trouble. The thing is, my school doesn''t report people to the police if they are caught smoking something illegal, they just suspend/expell them. I think something should be done about that, I think it is the school''s obligation to report people doing that, it is illegal. They don''t deter people enough.) I can multiply 2x2 matrices in my head and 1x4 . 4x4 matrices in my head as well. Are you saying there is something wrong with not talking to people?

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I just turned 20, sigh
I work as a programmer, and I worked as a network admin, I have my MCSE, going for MCSD this year I think
I've been coding since I was 8, then stopped to play games again and started again when I was 16. I'm currently doing some research about 3d engines, and some other stuff. I think I'll make a couple of 2d games (rts, arcade), and after that finally start with the project I wanted to create for 2 years now.. oh yeah, I'm also working on a MIDI sequencer.

Edited by - Jrz on June 11, 2000 2:38:06 PM
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To furby100:
Get a life dude
Ok, maybe you are as good in those things as you think, it''s not hard to learn that! You don''t listen to music, don''t watch tv, what do you do? don''t you know people?
If you are socially ill, like you, it''s going to be very hard to get a job, know people, know what people like etc

and ummm, you need instructions, doesn''t that mean that you can''t think of something?
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I''m 20 and my first experience with "programming" (scripting, really) was when I was 10: LOGO on an Apple ][gs. I got a computer 3 years later and started programming in gwBasic, followed by Assembly, Pascal, and C/C++. Then came Windows 95. It brought a new API, but the theory basically stayed the same.

I am now working on some new hardware that will definitely give game developers a new area to work with. But that''s something different. :-)
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I''m 32, and have been in the game business for quite a while. The bit about "being over the hill" is off target. It has nothing to do with getting behind technically, because you certainly get to know a whole lot more after years of programming than you do when you''re 18 and think you know everything Burn-out and getting too "old" are side effects of the grunt nature of the game industry. After a few project cycles, you start to think that that having a bunch of programmers furiously pound out mediocre code is a lousy way to develop products. It works, though, because it''s easy to hire desperate fan-boy coders who don''t mind working all weekend, because they don''t have anything else to do. With better planning and better architecture, many of these problems could be avoided. As you get better at the craft of software development, which is different than who can hack up UI code the fastest, this becomes more and more apparent.
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Furby~
Sorry, I posted some bad stuff about you here. I thought it was a little harsh, so I'll take it down. If I were you, I'd try to get out more, and develop some social skills! Bye!


Edited by - OreoBoy03 on June 12, 2000 9:33:55 PM
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I’m 28, Currently I''m a Professional Contractor/Consultant and have been for a lil over 5 years. Can''t imagine myself professionally counting my experiences with programming back in the Basic, Qbasic, and or C64 days/era. It just doesn’t count... I started my programming career off when I was 20 and helped develop my first Enterprise helpdesk Software and was compensated poorly (but that is how you start). As far as the dislikes for "furby100", I must say that his social skills needs some work but that will be fixed through time! As far as his other comments goes.... In regards to thinking all the time about games etc.. Well that is how I got into the business and how I stay in the business! Do I have a life? Well I have a wife and 1 child is that a life??? Do I like TV... no I do not .. (except for SiFi Movies).. Do I listen to radio''s no.... am I a great person so socialize with, well people have their issues with me... But in crunch time can I get the job done.. Meaning am I dedicated enough to spend my weekends and weekdays for up to 2 months straight on a project because of a change that runs us into the RED… Yes!, and that is why I get paid. Business are successful because they make money not because they have a chatty crew! And by the way after 2 - 3 weeks coding on one part of the grand scheme, again, and again, and again how social do you think your team is going to be?

Just my pennies.

"For a moment, nothing happened. Then, after a second or so, nothing continued to happen." Douglas Adams
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Hello everybody out there!

I just wanted to say that I got 16 now, I have been programming for 6 years now, but don''t think I have nothing better to do than sitting in front of the computer the whole day! In reality I''m programming in the evening for about 2 hours a day...and then, if I''m not too tired, I go out and HAVE FUN!!!
I would like to get into game industry, but I fear (as someone of you already wrote), that the techniques will be too advanced for me to have a chance...
I don''t think that I''m a bad programmer (Hey, what do you think I did in the six years? ), but I know nothing (ok...nearly nothing) about 3D programming and Windows.
I rely on Linux becoming the most popular OS, and therfore I''m quite good in programming in Linux...
By the way: With the compiler I use, I can port to Windows and DOS without changing one single line of code...
Now I''m working in a team on a game in order to improve teamwork ...I think that''s the main key to game industry, because in NO firm there will be just ONE programmer (even if programmes like a god ...)

Yours,

Indeterminatus
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To furry:

What the hell do you do? I bet you are sitting in front of your computer as soon as you are at home, and there you stay until your (pretty wising) mother tells you to go to bed!
The hell, don't you have any friends? I couldn't think of algorithms during lunch, I wouldn't even get the idea of thinking of them! (cool sentence )
Come on, the computer shouldn't be your life!
Who is more important? Human beings or computers? The computer exists in order to entertain and help you, not vice versa!
You can swear me now, if you want, I don't mind! But I have FUN, I meet my friends very often, and I'm riding my bicicle very much! If I were you, I would think your situation over, and maybe decide not to fully become a "computer idiot".
There are programmers out there, who are advanced WITHOUT sitting the whole day in front of the computer (like me)...
That's all what I had to say now...SIGH......
Ok, I'll quit now, that's enough, I think

No, there's another thing:

If you don't talk to any people, how -the hell- do you want to work in a team??? I don't think that programming alone is enough for a job...you should be able to work in a team too...

Yours,

Indeterminatus

Edited by - Indeterminatus on June 13, 2000 8:59:29 AM
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Well, I''m the youngest of all of you, I''ll just say i''m less than 15, so, I don''t have the "sense" of being out of date... yet,,,



unixGuy - Fighter for the better OS
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I''m 35. 5''9" and weigh +/- 185 lbs.
I''m also a single parent and have been raising two daughters for the past eight years. They live with me full time.
I''ve been programming since the age of 13, the usual progression of languages, Basic, 6502asm, 68000asm, C, perl, C++...

When I was young and playing baseball, my father told me that if I wanted to be good at it, I needed to "Eat, Sleep and Play baseball." I played ball for 13 years and I took what he said to heart. When I discovered my love of programming, I did the same with it.

My usual day is:
Day()
{
Get_up();
Take_the_girls_to_school();
go_to_work();
Write_code_for_8-9_hours();
Get_the_girls();
Cook_Eat_Supper();
Spend_time_with_girls();
Put_girls_to_bed();
Design_Code_5-6_hours();
Sleep()
Day();
}

I have worked at a start-up game company in Florida a few years ago. I invested some of my own money in the venture and needless to say, lost my a**
I''m not in the game business, I work as a Contractor for a company that is destined to write games.
To answer the original posters question concerning will 25 be over the hill?
I say No.
If you have the skills, and the desire, the next thing you need is to start dropping your line in the water



David "Dak Lozar" Loeser
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- I aren''t a game developer, and I don''t know any.
I do know that I pretty much only want to work regular business hours, no overtime, and no evenings, nights or weekends. From the postmortems in GDMag, that rules me out of just about any professional game dev employment. Not much use in earning money if you don''t have time to enjoy it, as someone said. -And buying a huge house hardly counts as enjoying money (in my book), when all you do at the house is come home from work, sleep, and then go back to work. I am curious as how to program, but it is hardly the only thing I am living for. I''d be much more interested in steadier employment, rather than the usual [that is, temporary] game company environment, as I have read it. - Lubb
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Lubbs got a point,
I would love to program computer games, as I''ve said I''m fed up with databases and accounts packages. But I couldn''t put my self in the situation where I put my Partner and our soon to arive child second to a job.
I want to make nice pretty things, and 9 to 5 I would bust-a-gut (tm) in a job, giving 100% for the entire day. And if it was a real emergency I''d stay maybe a couple of hours late. But I couldn''t kiss my friends and family away for two months!
So i''d like to shift the thread a bit.

Can you work in the computer game industry with out putting your family and friends second?

Just thought, I would work a few extra hours at home (4-5 hours a day, for 3-4 days of the week) but that would be pushing the limit!

to Dak Lozar
A recursive function like day() would surely start eating into your resources. Better to have

while (heart_ticking = .t.)
{
day()
}

Everyone is taking a nice bite out of furby100. Mainly cause we most fear becoming this sterotype friendless geek as portrayed on TV. I don''t think this person really exists, and I''m damb sure none of us would become him/it.
True spend you entire life in front of your PC isn''t going to be healthy (pyshically or socially) and (not in a nasty way)furby100 should get out.

unixGuy
at <15 I would hope you didn''t feel over the hill, you should feel like your''ve just left base camp. Hot coco still warm in your tummy wondering if they ever found the bodies of the last climbing party!

NeoReality Out.

Oh one quick thing,
NeoReality came from when I registered on freeserve. Trying to come up with Something interesting. I didn''t want yetanothermindlessuser1323245@anotherdulldomainname4647647.freeserve.co.uk

NeoTokyo was gone and so where some other obscure names (cabbage,table, etc) and then NeoReality popped into my head!

Its got nothing to do with the rather good film starting Pinokio Reeves, and thats why even though it would be easier to sign off as Neo I continue on for the full title.

Huff!

Just wanted people to know


Neo out!

What else do you need; besides a miricle.
Money. Lots of Money. or I''ll never do a sequel!
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