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TheShadow

What do you think about MUDS

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do you guys think MUD or text games are dead? I mean they are the richest in graphical content you will ever find, WOuld a commercial MUD still be popular? Mecha Engineer (Making Real Humanoid Suits)

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Commercial MUDs will and are popular today. I was actually playing one while checking the recent threads . My favorite is Dragonrealms (www.dragonrealms.net). Check it out.

--Sometimes the hardest thing to do is nothing

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Guest Anonymous Poster
A lot of people have the same feelings about a graphical MMORPG. Frankly, I think anyone who pays a monthly fee for a game is an idiot and should have been cleansed from the gene pool quite a while ago.

Regardless, coding on a MUD is a great way to learn a lot about pointers, lists, sockets, and other basic programming concepts.

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MUDS are set for a long time to come. They can fit in more actual content than graphical games faster and with less bulk, even though the basic gameplay is limited by the interface and there isn''t so much room for action-oriented play.

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Hey Michalson! I''ve piddled away a good two months of my life making a mud and i resent your blatant generalization that muds are useless on the following grounds:

1) They provide an arena in which nerds can feel important (ie the wizards who run the mud)

3) ummmm, on second thought maybe i should re-evaluate my life-choices.

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But seriously folks,

At the very least, you can learn a lot about design making a mud. I know working on mine before i entered college has given me a significant edge over my classmates.

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I''m not a huge fan of MUDs, but I''ve found some fun in the past. I''ve also heard of numerous very innovative MUDs.

If nothing else, they provide an excellent means of testing incentivization to see what kind of behaviors it will produce among the players.

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I''m indifferent.

Actually, I have only one grievence with MUDs and MMORPGs, the lack of any significant goal. Kill monster, gain level, get item. Maybe if there was some kind of competition between players (that didn''t leave a big gapping hole for Grief Players to base their saturday afternoon on), then maybe you could get soemthing going.

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I second Inmate on that one.
I love the idea, and certainly have no problem with the text aspect (being a fan of Roguelike games), but I just wish their was more depth than Door/Monster/Treasure.
Then again, I am sure some MUDs are better than that, but I have kinda given up finding them a while ago (particularly since I cant use Telnet from my school )


Sancte Isidore ora pro nobis !

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Most MUDs are crap, but a few are truly ground-breaking in ways that graphical games will not be for quite some time. Such are the advantages of text...

[ MSVC Fixes | STL Docs | SDL | Game AI | Sockets | C++ Faq Lite | Boost
Asking Questions | Organising code files | My stuff | Tiny XML | STLPort]

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I think that the biggest problem in MUDs especially the text based ones is that everyone and there brother who has ever played one has tried to start one of their own. Normally this is a good thing but as mentioned before in another thread somewhere, MUD prgrammers tend to expect everything to be handed to them. I still enjoy playing them (for about 10 years now) but have long since given up any grandiose idea of creating the best and most innovative MUD around. I enjoy them not because there is a goal, but because of the sense of continuity. There has been a general trend of cry-baby MUDs to spring up which allow pk but encourage whiners who can''t accept the fact that they died and lost all their equipment by giving it all back to them or limiting how much the killer can take. I try to stay away from those as they become too laden with OOC politics. Text based MUDs will always have a place in my heart. If you want to be innovative with a text based MUD, work on the client side. Nobody who MUDs wants to pay for ZMUD and even wintin is just old and needs some help. Excuse my ramblings, I am trying to type and watch the NHL playoffs at the asme time.

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quote:
Original post by evillive2
There has been a general trend of cry-baby MUDs to spring up which allow pk but encourage whiners who can''t accept the fact that they died and lost all their equipment by giving it all back to them or limiting how much the killer can take.

One problem with these is that half the players see PK as being an added extra to their adventuring, and the other half of the players see PK as meaning "text-based Quake Arena". When these players mix, there''s always trouble. Personally, I''m not interested in the games where PK is done without any context or reason for it.

quote:
If you want to be innovative with a text based MUD, work on the client side. Nobody who MUDs wants to pay for ZMUD and even wintin is just old and needs some help. Excuse my ramblings, I am trying to type and watch the NHL playoffs at the asme time.

Writing a new client isn''t going to be innovative... writing NPCs that are more intelligent than any game on the market is, though. (For instance.)



[ MSVC Fixes | STL Docs | SDL | Game AI | Sockets | C++ Faq Lite | Boost
Asking Questions | Organising code files | My stuff | Tiny XML | STLPort]

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Guest Anonymous Poster
I''ve played various MUDs from time to time.

Basically, there is no inherent advantage to a MUD. There is nothing you can do with a MUD that you can''t do with a graphical game, and the graphical game will be a whole lot more fun to play.

However, MUDs are a good thing because they are so easy to develop, comparativly speaking. In the good ones, the gameplay is the best, bar none, because every minute of development time is directly spent enhancing gameplay. A group of a 3-4 nerds putting in only a couple hours a day can create a game with gameplay many times better than the best commercial games that cost millions to produce.

Also, if one of the said nerds gets a really good gameplay idea, they don''t need to find a sponsor willing to invest millions in it to see it realized.

The upshot of this is that MUDs are a lot of fun for people who just like to play and don''t care about the interface. The more you value gameplay over interface, the more you''ll like MUDs. I love gameplay, and I play MUDs. But I also like a game that is easy to play, and having beautiful artwork/graphics is also a plus. Often I find myself playing a mud, and loving it, but frustrated because of the lousy interface. I can''t stop playing, though, because the gameplay is so fun.

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quote:
Original post by Michalson
Peh, MUDs are useless, especially the text (telnet) ones. I can''t understand how some people could waste 12 hours a day in one of those stupid things.


How ignorant can you be? Good MUDs are roleplay-designed. You know, somewhat for the D&D freaks who can''t get a game in their towns and such. And grief players aren''t bad on my favorite mud, Lensmoor (telnet://lensmoor.org:3500) due to great wizards.

Oh, and the one I personally work on is SuikodenMUD (telnet://temporal.genesismuds.com:2344). Come on by, I''m a wiz there. Look for Anselm.

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quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
Basically, there is no inherent advantage to a MUD. There is nothing you can do with a MUD that you can''t do with a graphical game, and the graphical game will be a whole lot more fun to play.


Show me a MMORPG with real roleplay. You won''t find one that''s at all popular. RP MUDs, on the other hand, are.

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quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
There is nothing you can do with a MUD that you can''t do with a graphical game

Of course not... but practically? Muds are a whole lot easier for a lot of things. eg.
- Procedural generation of infinite items
- Natural language interfaces
- Arbitrarily detailed environments
- Adding new data or content to the game

quote:
and the graphical game will be a whole lot more fun to play.

That''s pretty one-sided; a lot of people would prefer a well-polished text game, just as many people prefer a good book to an average movie.

[ MSVC Fixes | STL Docs | SDL | Game AI | Sockets | C++ Faq Lite | Boost
Asking Questions | Organising code files | My stuff | Tiny XML | STLPort]

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This is my ideas why MUDS are much better at RP player base. With muds you get older people playing the games, and older people want to RP. This is true with graphical games also, most kids that play dont RP they dont understand what the word means. There for makes a bad experience for other people.

Muds arnt advertised on the stores so a lot of people dont get to see the these games, and so only people into muds really play these games.

I played a text based mud before and found it very boring, I am more of a visual person. But you will find in some games they will have a server just for RP. Then you got your other servers.

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quote:
Original post by Michalson
It seems like only a few people will have understood my post.

I found it somewhat funny, as I say the same thing about Everquest players. It''s also somewhat funny because my parents say the same thing about me, regarding any games.

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What about all the people you have to pay every month with that?

Lets do some math.

200k people paying basically 10 dollars a month. easy math shows us that is 2 million dollars. w/ 12 months we get 24 million.

Now I don''t know how big a staff is for keeping an MMORPG up and running but lets say 20 people. And those 20 people make 50k a year. That''s 1 million in expenses for staff.

The company is left with 23 million.

Now we gotta pay off all the money it costed us for servers. Lets take a quick trip to Dell.com

Each of those 20 people need computers, and of course we need about 15 servers (13,333 people per server).

Dell PowerEdge 8450 - $22,759 (x15) $341,385
Dell Dimension XPS - $ 2,497 (x20) $ 49,949

Total Computer Cost: $391,325

Then there is software cost: 20 people about 2,000 each (I''m too lazy now) = 40,000

Computer and Software costs: $431,325

Then you have Rent and Furniture which...
...etc...blah...blah...

Point is it looks like a lot but after all your expenses...Wait it is a lot . After all the expenses you''ll most likely end up with a 10 mil profit at least. There''s my crap post for today!

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