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kiehl

what do u think about my engine idea?

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a few weeks ago i started working on my game engine, I know that a game engine is something HARD to do, especially for a beginner like me, and that there is a STRONG possibility that i might fail so to avoid failure i started searching on the net all the info there is about game engines , and started working on the design of my engine, at start my idea was to make a complete new engine, with its own file types and editors, but after reading all the info there is about the quake 3 engine and the file formats it uses (bsp, md3, md4, the vm for the scripts,pk3) i thought that maybe it will be easier to make a engine that uses the quake 3 file formats ( and maybe doom3 md5), since they are very well documented and there lots of tools (maya and 3ds plugins, qradient,etc) to work with then. does id cares that i use their file types??? what do u think about this??? [edited by - kiehl on May 4, 2003 7:04:45 PM]

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quote:
Original post by kiehl
does id cares that i use their file types???
what do u think about this???

Nah... everyone uses md*. Besides, file formats are non-copyrightable.

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Questions to ask yourself:
1) How much experience do I have?
2) Is that enough experience to start something at a professional level?

Therefore, here is my advise:
Start low and make a text adventure engine .



- Rob Loach
Current Project: Go Through Object-Oriented Programming in C++ by Robert Lafore

"Do or do not. There is no try."
- Yoda

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I am doing the same as well, except my engine already supports MD2 and BSP (somewhat). Now just getting the two to work together is a chore...

Good luck on your engine but remember: MULTIPLE INHERITANCE IS YOUR FRIEND; use it well.

In terms of using someone elses file formats, its the best way to do it. Quite possibly the only better way to do it is use your own but write a converter that converts other formats into yours.

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I believe if you look into it ID doesn''t mind at all if someone uses their file formats, but will not allow others to use their tools in a distributed program. So try to find some tools that were made by outside individuals that use the ID formats.

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If I recall correctly:


  • You can''t use file formats from Doom 3, because that would mean you''d need models and stuff from the Doom 3 alpha, which AFAIK it is still illegal to have.

  • The advantage of using the quake formats is that there is indeed lots of info out there. If memory serves, GameTutorials has a good series on BSP files.

  • They don''t want you using their tools for a commercial project. However, the source code for the Q3 tools is available, so you can use that to find out how the tools work and their write your own.

  • Nobody is going to care if you''re using their stuff in a non-commercial, non-release project. If this is purely for educational purposes (and seeing as you''re a beginner, it probably is) then go ahead.



Superpig
- saving pigs from untimely fates, and when he''s not doing that, runs The Binary Refinery.

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quote:
Therefore, here is my advise:
Start low and make a text adventure engine .



i know that this is probably a project that requires more experience than the one i have at this moment, but this is the kind of project that really motives me, and that will certainly make me learn a LOT (even if i fail)

about the doom3 md5, i think i will add support to it when doom3 comes (officially) out

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quote:
Original post by jjthebear
Good luck on your engine but remember: MULTIPLE INHERITANCE IS YOUR FRIEND; use it well.



What does multiple inheritance have to do with anything? And in a newbie''s hands it is unnecessary evil.

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quote:
Original post by kiehl
i know that this is probably a project that requires more experience than the one i have at this moment, but this is the kind of project that really motives me, and that will certainly make me learn a LOT (even if i fail)



If you don't think you can do a text adventure, then how do you expect to do a 3D game engine?

I hate to burst your idea bubble though, nd I'm sure your motivation and ideas are going through the roof (which is a good thing), but please slow down or you'll hurt yourself (or something).

I remember when I started. I wanted to jump into it, just like you. I tried and tried (for about 7 months), but acomplished nothing. I looked at tutorials, websites, DX documentation, EVERYTHING. Didn't get anywhere.

I then took a course, bought some books, and finally learned the basics. I then started and finished my first text adventure in about one evening. I then moved onto the second one (RPG this time) which encorporated the use of an engine, finished it in a week. My third text game was an multiplayer (non-online) action arena type game. Trust me on this: Once you learn the basics, and start a project, it'll motivate you no matter what it is.

[EDIT] Quotes screwed up.
Try doing your idea in the text console. That will lessen things for you.


- Rob Loach
Current Project: Go Through Object-Oriented Programming in C++ by Robert Lafore

"Do or do not. There is no try."
- Yoda



[edited by - Rob Loach on May 5, 2003 2:20:23 PM]

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Original post by Sneftel

Besides, file formats are non-copyrightable.[i]

Some of them use patented technologies and come with licensing fees, though.


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Rob Loach:

i see what u mean, but after reading a lot of stories of how beginners always fail their 1st big project, i can see that failure is caused mainly from the lack of a solid global design and planning than from the lack of programing skills, and thats my main objective for now, a solid global design

and this is not my first 3d project, i have already made a md3 loader and a very basic bsp loader (based on some tutorials but written from scratch by me)

and dont forget that i have almost the entire summer for this

[edited by - kiehl on May 5, 2003 3:30:11 PM]

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quote:
Original post by kiehl
Rob Loach:

i see what u mean, but after reading a lot of stories of how beginners always fail their 1st big project, i can see that failure is caused mainly from the lack of a solid global design and planning than from the lack of programing skills, and thats my main objective for now, a solid global design

and this is not my first 3d project, i have already made a md3 loader and a very basic bsp loader (based on some tutorials but written from scratch by me)

and dont forget that i have almost the entire summer for this

[edited by - kiehl on May 5, 2003 3:30:11 PM]


I think you could do it, but not in one summer.

-~-The Cow of Darkness-~-

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quote:
Original post by Sneftel
Besides, file formats are non-copyrightable.
File formats may be patented (in few cases, few indeed) while implementations are copyrighted.

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quote:
Original post by kiehl
Rob Loach:

i see what u mean, but after reading a lot of stories of how beginners always fail their 1st big project, i can see that failure is caused mainly from the lack of a solid global design and planning than from the lack of programing skills, and thats my main objective for now, a solid global design



Um, how can you plan for something you have next to no experience in...?

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quote:
Um, how can you plan for something you have next to no experience in...?


thats why im spending so much time reading info around the net, analyzing quake 2/3 source code, posting here on gamedev, googling, googling and googling

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quote:
Original post by deadalive
"file formats are non-copyrightable"
Awesome. That was something I was worried about for awhile.. Thanks!


Yes...the gif format has been brought up, but it is the compression algorithm, not the file format.

Brian J

[edited by - bjmumblingmiles on May 5, 2003 11:11:58 PM]

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Just from my limited expierience with DirectDraw engines, OpenGL engines and a basic Direct3D recently...

You are not ready, You will find the design flaws (the nonobvious ones) only when you really beging coding. The best thing you can do is start actaully coding, even its only prototyping. Lay out every class and function. figure out what everything needs access to at a basic level. That is the first step. Of course you''ll need a rather complete understanding of 3D engines in general first, but I trust your deep research in to the quake2 source has helped you there.

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quote:
Original post by MOVSW
quote:
Original post by Sneftel
... file formats are non-copyrightable.
Tell that to GIF people.
And they'd tell you that the GIF file format is not copyrighted . However, the LZW compression algorithm (really cool, btw) is patented . Any one is 100% free to use the GIF file format as long as they don't use LZW to compress image data (which is possible).

[edited by - CWizard on May 6, 2003 5:34:40 AM]

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