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samsmithnz

XCom clone.

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I''m really interested in creating an XCom/Jagged Alliance/Fallout tactical strategy (rpg?) game, particularly as another game in the series (kind of) is about to be released in September (UFO: Aftermath). I really love this type of game, and would love to work on a project that recreated this gem, but with a twist. I''ve been playing UFO: Enemy unknown and Jagged Alliance 2 for the past 2 weeks, and these two games I think use the Tactical strategy best. I''m sure that much of what has been created out here in the indie game development world can be reused, and I''d like create a game without recreating the wheel, (using an existing gaming engine and tools), and also hopefully get some people on board to help with graphics, coding and graphics (in that order). I am serious about this, and have many ideas. I''m not totally sure if I want (or need) to use DirectX yet (and if so which one), and I haven''t decided on a language yet either, but I''m thinking more towards C# or VB/VB.NET, as I don''t believe C++ is required (as it is in RTS and 1st person shooters!) I''ve had a look around in the last couple of weeks for similar projects on the web (like sourceforge, gamedev, and various gaming communities), but they all seem dead and buried long ago. And the final game doesn''t have to be Aliens Vs Humans, at the moment all my design documents just show a ''player'' vs a ''monster''. Using OO techniques I think we could create an underlying game, where the graphics can be easily changed/ modded, so that a UFO, WW2 or a post-apolylaptic (or a combination of all three) type game is possible.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Please, please, please, please, please go and complete this project. Now. Don''t just talk about it. I would die happy if I got to play a good JA2/XCOM game.

The entire XCOM series has been horribly treated by its owners, and I have few hopes that we''ll even see UFO:Aftermath, let alone that it won''t suck. From some of the articles I have seen on Aftermath, it sounds like they are starting to move away from turn-based play. Ah, just what we need, another shitty RTS pretending to be a squad-level strategy game.

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I''m playing X-COM 2 for the sixth or seventh time atm, it''s still one of the best game designs ever. If you want to work on something similar, check out Xenocide, they''re looking for more developers right now.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
Please, please, please, please, please go and complete this project. Now. Don''t just talk about it. I would die happy if I got to play a good JA2/XCOM game.

The entire XCOM series has been horribly treated by its owners, and I have few hopes that we''ll even see UFO:Aftermath, let alone that it won''t suck. From some of the articles I have seen on Aftermath, it sounds like they are starting to move away from turn-based play. Ah, just what we need, another shitty RTS pretending to be a squad-level strategy game.


Check out www.ufo-aftermath.com, they are actually using a turn-based method where both sides move at the same time (almost RTS, but not quite), I think its a good Idea, but this proposed game would be completely turn based.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Thanks for the link! I found their dev diary pretty interesting, as well as very disappointing.

The tactical combat is being simplified (read: dumbed down). For example, the combat does not allow crawling, going prone or crouching. Your soldier can run or walk, that''s it. Also, they have restricted firing to either an aimed shot or a burst. Aimed shots are always fired while crouching, bursts are always fired while standing. Despite the simultaneous resolution, soldiers cannot fire while moving; they move, stop, and fire.

The reasons are given <a href=" http://www.ufo-aftermath.com/pages/devdiary9.html">here</a>, but it can be summed up as a design decision to make the game "accessible to all kind of players, not only to hardcore veteran wargamers." Sigh. How many times have I heard that?

From reading the diary entries, and browsing the tactical forum (http://www.chatbear.com/cgi-bin/board.pl?action=boardlisting&boardid=2453&view=flatold),
this sounds like a game in trouble. It''s been redesigned and recoded several times, and the design continues to evolve away from the original XCOM games. The original publisher stopped sending milestone payments, I really hope I''m wrong, but I think the final result from Altar will be very disappointing.

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While Alter seem to have made several design ''simplifications'', I do like a lot of what they''ve done, (for example research). But I am not that impressed with the story line. The original Storyline for UFO -Enemy unknown is still the most believable and best so far. I''d like to see a remake of this game using updated directx technology, I guess thats what I''m aiming at creating...

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You should look at

http://www.lasersquadnemesis.com/

Its a play by email game by the makers of ufo etc.. uses the same 1/2 turn based 1/2 real time system its really quite good.

And I'm very interested in helping with this project,

I am a intermediate c++ and directx8.1 programmer with a little bit of opengl knowledge, I also have an early demo of my own turn based game engine.

email me at gick_thomson@yahoo.co.uk

or msn gick@postmaster.co.uk

if you're interested?



[edited by - gick on June 2, 2003 9:32:23 PM]

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I just thought I'd let some of you guys know that I've teamed up with Gick in England, and we've started work. You can follow our game progress at my website.




[edited by - samsmithnz on July 18, 2003 12:13:08 PM]

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quote:
Original post by downgraded
Why don''t you think C++ isn''t suited to this sort of game?


I never said I din''t think it was suited, but that I didn''t think it was required. Lets face it, its a 2d turn based isometric game, Its hardly half-life.

As if turns out we will develop the tactical game in C++

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"I never said I din''t think it was suited, but that I didn''t think it was required. Lets face it, its a 2d turn based isometric game, Its hardly half-life."

Of course it is required and it has nothing to do with the complexity of a game. .... hmmm ......

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quote:
Original post by Taharez
I'm playing X-COM 2 for the sixth or seventh time atm, it's still one of the best game designs ever. If you want to work on something similar, check out Xenocide, they're looking for more developers right now.

Very cool. I like your geoscape. The X-Com universe is pretty generic, so you could just change a few names and ideas and have basically the same setup and no troubles from any legal departments. Have you started on the tactical engine yet? That's the real meat of the development. Also will the tactical portion be 2D or 3D?

One of the great things about X-Com was how dynamic the levels are. You may want to read the Game Programming Gems 3 Gem on using Cellular Automata for environment modeling. Apparently X-Com used something along those lines.

Btw, the issue with using C# or VB.NET is you need to have users download the .NET framework, which is pretty large. If you don't want to use C++ I would suggest using VB or Python. Unless you don't care about installed base, or you think most of the people that download or buy your game will already have it installed or won't mind downloading and installing it.

[edited by - impossible on June 19, 2003 6:44:26 PM]

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quote:
Original post by samsmithnz
quote:
Original post by Nypyren
Just make sure you have good grenades. Grenades will make or break a game

What do you mean?

good grenades always influnce stradegy. I remember having a tight formation in X-com, and then having the aliens murder me with one, just one!

I also remember this one game, where a soldier was out of time, all alone, and she was covering the main squad, looking in dark corners, looking in allys, looking in places I didn''t think anything was, etc. She turned the corder, and a monsterous alien was there! =-O! I turned on my grenade and let him kill her. She saved the squad with her life.

I can also tell you about a lot of Half-Life players that also keep a grenade ready at all times, and drop them whenever they die.

The grenade is a very brute force tool, but its very very useful in battle. Have a good grenade physics/AI can make or break a good squad-level game.

---
"I made it into someone elses sig!" -capn_midnight
A Link for programming drunks

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Guest Anonymous Poster
I loved all x-com.. well.. maybe except the interceptor
but i think it would be cool to play the missions in first person view.
I did like the real time way. Sometimes a mission would take an hour to complete when one last pesky alien was well hidden somewhere :D
good luck with your project

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I will start and finish an xcom2 clone, using 2d iso engine. I was working on a SDL animaton loader and got very stuck but I am so very close to finishing that up. After I can get that done then I will be able to continue on with my 2d iso learning. Then work on the xcom game. I would like to start a project, but seems that we dont have the same specs that will be used for the game like language etc. So I will go off and do it myself.

This is what I will be using. C/C++ mix and SDL with my own network lib, yes I will add network support.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Wow, X-Com, that takes me back. Started great but then went downhill with subsequent sequels. I remember X-Com as being the first "shit - where did the day go ?" game. When I got the game I started playing around 4pm and when I next looked up (after I got my arse kicked) it was dark and about 11pm. Quite literally ! Also realised I was very hungry (a slimming aid ?). Have always preferred turn-based games myself, a sign of the more intellectual or just because I don''t like getting my arse kicked at FPS by 10-year olds ? Who can say.

On a similar subject, did anyone use to play the Battle Isle games ? Is anyone writing a clone/tribute ? I am and I would be interested in sharing notes.

Thorax.

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I'm waiting eagerly for U:A. I don't think no-prone is "dumbed down". I don't call X-Com 1 dubmed down because there's only stand/crouch and no run/walk difference... Actually I'm playing the windows version of X-Com 1 perfectly right now and I don't get uptight because I can't go prone.

(It works on XP on my Athlon 2600+ without having to use like 5 slow-down programs or VMWare or DosBox or something weak and STILL not end up working)

[edited by - Nypyren on June 27, 2003 5:49:29 AM]

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Hehe, yeah I also found the WinXP working version of Xcom, I love that game, but it''s damn hard! I''ve played many similar games, but X-com is amazing, it was way ahead of it''s time in many aspects if you ask me.

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quote:
Original post by Bad Maniac
Hehe, yeah I also found the WinXP working version of Xcom, I love that game, but it''s damn hard! I''ve played many similar games, but X-com is amazing, it was way ahead of it''s time in many aspects if you ask me.


where did you get that version? i´d love to play ufo again but can´t get it to work on my winxp.

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I can't remember where I got it, basically you'd need a full version of UFO first of all, and I'm told it's now regarded abandonware.
I can't seem to find it on google, but it's basically a new .exe file that acts as a wrapper between the game and directX I think.
I could possibly upload the .exe alone somewhere, but I need to figure out if it's legal first =D

[edited by - Bad Maniac on June 27, 2003 8:31:59 AM]

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