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nes8bit

Cool Stuff in a 3D shooter?

25 posts in this topic

Come on people, give me all the juicy details of what makes a good 3d shooter? I''d really like to hear from landfish ------------------------ Captured Reality
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Originality. You just can''t beat it. God knows how many 3D shooters on the market now, and still very little originality. Anyone who has a truely good and original concept can probably see through to a very good and original product.

Well, that''s my allegedly *divine* opinion. Sigh....
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Huh-huh. Cool stuff rocks.

Yeah cool stuff kicks ass! heh-heh hmm.

Uhhhh. If I made a game. It would have, like, tons of cool stuff in it. Uhhh huh-huh.

Someone should make a 3D version of Beavis and Butthead. Sort of like EverQuest, but B&B instead. Yeah yeah, cool!
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I was recently reading around the message boards and came across on a post where someone said to stop making RPG''s. People then responded by giving the reasons why they most like RPG''s, the storyline. Now if we could get a 3D shooter with a deep and involved story that would be cool. I might actually play one. Personally i can''t stand Quake, it''s the same thing over and over. If someone could make a 3D shooter with a good deep story that would be cool. Cheers!
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Oh, jeezus. DID YOU PEOPLE READ THE POST?

That''s exactly the freaking point I was making in the No more Rpgs post. You can blur the lines a lot and still make great games that everyone loves, without being slave to the goddamn 3 letter acronym!

Please understand, this is pissing me off. I''m just sick of these developers who say, "I wanna make an RPG!" and then set about completely cloning the last FREAKING RPG they PLAYED! THAT IS ALL I WAS SAYING!

Wow. I need to chill out.
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Yeah, LF, you need to go have some beer or something to chill out.

Although...
Being pissed off is better than being pissed on.

How's that for a little Zen?

Edited by - Nazrix on June 21, 2000 6:35:13 PM
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Now, see, that I understand, Matrix...
I wish all those other Zen stories were so simple.
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Being able to blow up _everything_, that''s always cool. It''s a let down when you try to shoot that big flying thing outside the window, and then your rocket just disappears...

And how about some original weapons that are USEFULL. It''s great when you can get 300 different weapons, but it sucks because you only use 1 the whole time.
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A realisitc inventory system might be nice too, but you would need to create a bunch of other gameplay features to make it work. Y''know, only being able to carry what you could realisitcally fit on your person?
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Deformable terrain!
Destroyable...um...everything!
Area-specific damage!
Prox mines! (I am having fun in Deus ex demo...)
Easter eggs!
Stealth stuff! (like Thief)
Chipmunks!
Cool multiplayer modes!
Smoke bombs!
Dark areas!
Sniper scopes!
Cool stuff!

(I don''t honestly expect all this; but its all cool. Concentrate on that last one.)

-M

Saráth evenü, cán el-sayü liné!
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good lord...landfish, could you start your own version of this thread? I''m getting some weird answers except for a few...

------------------------
Captured Reality
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quote:
Original post by nes8bit

good lord...landfish, could you start your own version of this thread? I''m getting some weird answers except for a few...



That''s pretty funny nes8bit . Perhaps he should do the same with my "Design Methodologies" thread . But seriously, I''ve just about given up on this forum. Frankly I''m getting very little out of it and learning practically nothing about game design. I see tired argument after tired argument. Nature versus environment over and over again.
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Don´t be so gloomy Cassandra!

And please stop this landfish worship.


About the topic: Story, interaction, violence.

Half Life wasn´t that bad, cause you got two out of three. The only thing that i really missed was the interaction, non-linear plots and such. And more realism.

The only thing that´s missing nowadays is dialogue options. Kind of merging 3d shooter, adventure and rpg. I guess it isn´t going to take long (System Shock 2 wasn´t all bad in those respects).
I´d say it´s a great shooter when you don´t have to shoot anymore. Makes the whole thing more special...

But i don´t know if that´s where you want to be going.


If it´s just shooter you want be sure to put in:

5000 different weapons
1 large can of gore (maybe 300 if handy)
smart enemies (it really helps to hear them talk)
and lots of fire and destruction(meaningless if at all possible, players like to shoot everything)
CoolStuff (Tanks, Helicopters, deathscenes, sex, crime, cows, a private investigator ... whatever you like)

BTW: Check out Duke Nukem 3d for the gags, some of them were quite nice


That´s about it. But a story can´t hurt.
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quote:
Original post by nes8bit
"a good 3d shooter?"



Contradiction in terms!

Eh eh .

1. Good multiplayer opponents.
2. High "F**K! He killed me with that stupid handgun" factor. ( i.e., weapons have their own strengths/weaknesses and are highly unlike those in DIEkatana ).
3. Not even a semblance of seriousness. ( Anyone remember the dog-turds in a certain Duke3d extension? "Awww shitttttt!" )
4. Ability to gloat over your kills for about 3 seconds before the other guy shoots you in the back ''cause you weren''t paying attention.
5. John Carmack
6. Anti-John Romero ( but long hair is allowed, and perhaps a John Romero Borg model as an enemy ).
7. I''m talking out of my ass.

Umm, those are my highly not so useful suggestions.




Give me one more medicated peaceful moment..
~ (V)^|) |<é!t|-| ~
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1)Funny weapons.
Not all weapons shotting style. A bobby trap (for example duke3d) is very appointed.
A Chainsaw (old doom)
2)Better voice. Not the tipical "uch!". Is better "aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhh"
3)Better players (ie. Lara C.). <- why not!
4)Better interact with scenenary (destroy a building)
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Okay - hollywood may think it can improve the entire gaming industry - but it can''t, but there are a few things to do with movies in general that make for extra kudos when designbing an FPS
a) John Woo influences -> lotsa guns, -> lotsa blood -> lotsa bodies -> lotsa bodies falling through pieces of destructable terrain -> much action!
b) Action, suspense - those two don''t mix together so don''t try to do both. Choose one or the other, I dunno what half life was trying to do, maybe suspense, but it kinda worked.
c) Cool macho lines from decent voice actors and proper script writers. If I hear one more Bruce Campbell movie line I will screem like a sissy gal.
d) Inventive ways of killing people - don''t go for the normal "shoot and look we have a dead body" approach. (proxy mines, traps, pointy objects that enemies can fall on are all extra cool)
e) A DAMN sinister bad guy. Don''t have some "nameless faceless aliens attack the earth" syndrome, get some excessively evil bad guy and have him antagonise the player throughout the game put him in the players FACE and annoy the player to the point that he expierences intense pleasure (heh) when he finally kills the guy! No sissies allowed!

That''s my contribution.
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"How about" instead of having tonnes of original weapons having tonnes of original enemies. Like predators that scale walls, those cunning roof suckers from half-life, enemies that operate in teams etc. Now this is the go!

I was actually playing Perfect Dark this weekend both co-op and Deathmatch and WOW! I mean WOW! They did some really creative stuff with that game. Weapons have "modes". Burst mode, seek mode, unload magazine mode and more. There''s also proxy mines. In deathmatch you can choose to have up to 4 computer enemies called simulants. Each simulant can be given their own hardness level. You can tag them into their separate teams. You can even choose what weapons will be available in DMatch mode.All of this majorly rekindled my interest in FPS''s. If you want idea''s try it out!

There also a FPS game coming out for the PS2 which will have a map editor!



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Actually - I was just thinking about why Soldier of Fortune was made the way it was? Is gore and bloodthirsty gameplaying what makes a 3D shooter really good?

Oh and the main point of this message should also be that Landfish needs some kind of prescribed sedatives Get him to stop getting so worked up about things. Maybe a trip to the bahamas or something.

And I agreee that learning is obviously not the key focus of message boards. You'd think that with hundereds of people collaborating ideas that we'd get somewhere, but most of the time we just argue

*sigh*

What a crazy 'net we live in. (Well, I speak for myself when I say "live in")

Edited by - Maitrek on June 24, 2000 12:18:19 AM
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Big world. I love exploring and finding all the little nooks and cranies of a place.

Also, when I unload 50 missiles onto a place of glass, I expect it to break. If you don''t want me going out the window, either don''t put anything interesting out there, or put bars outside of it. But MAN! How much firepower does it take to brake a piece of glass? Even plexiglass breaks after enough amo hits it.

E:cb woof!
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I want gameplay that goes beyond Deathmatch. I want teamplay that requires teamwork. Tribes has the right idea, but it needs to be expanded. Force players to assume specialized roles. Make it impossible to be the gung ho, solo does it all commando. Every good team needs to cover the following roles...

recon - quick on the move, good at remaining out of sight. Good at locating mission objectives and conveying intel to the rest of the team.

fast assault - Not as quick as recon, but plenty of standard issue firepower. No explosives, or weak explosives. Access to hand held projectile weapons and good ammo storage abilities.

Heavy assault - Slow but tough. Good heavy firepower that could be beneficial or detrimental. Lack of control over weaponry makes it risky to use, but a tremendous benefit when used right. Long range attacks capable with spotters (another potential job for recon, but could be done by fast assault with less accuracy and more risk to the spotter)

Med support - What world has health boxes laying around for instant pain relief?

Supply depots - Again, what world has weapons and ammo just laying around waiting to be picked up and used?

Basically, I''m look for a bit more realism in my FPS without necessarily losing the intensity and fast paced nature of the currently available examples.
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Well Now,

For me personally the Half-Life series had a fairly
good story and background. Besides just being
a dammned good game of course.

STVOY

Mega Moh Mine!!
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