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antareus

On D, Linux, and .NET...

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This may seem a little pretentious at first, but sometimes you have a hunch that you have to talk about. I think that in 3-5 years time, C# will overtake C/C++ on Windows. Rightfully so, I might add, and this is nothing new. Longhorn''s adoption will definitely increase the acceptance rate. I do feel that this poses a big threat to Linux application development. C# is more elegant and thought-out than C++ hopes to be, and it seems like the Linux community doesn''t have a language that match up quite as well. I think that maybe D will be that language. Once D support is in gcc then people may start becoming interested in it. D is pretty similar to C# (from a cursory glance) but runs on Linux. I think what Linux needs is something similar to the .NET class libraries. Ready-made components that are well-designed and completely free. Qt seems to be the best that Linux has to offer, and it is C++-based. I can''t help but feel that Qt''s need to support ancient compilers held them back (think of the MOC implementation of signals and slots when Boost does it fine with native C++). This is one reason I think it is better just to go on with D instead of continuing to bolt solutions onto a crusty language. I will continue to research and talk to people about this, but I wanted to get some commentary from people here as well.

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I am a happy user of C# - on Linux.

The Mono project (www.go-mono.com), a .NET implementation effort for Linux and other OS-es, is already far on its way to became mature. I have to say, since version .24 I never had any serious problem with it.

GTK# is a very very nice toolkit for making graphical user interfaces for both Windows and Linux, and it adapts to the visual style of the os (that is, GTK on Linux and native Windows on Windows).

For 2D game programming, SDL.NET is quite good already. I have commited some patches to make it binary compatible on both Windows and Linux, so one can ship the original DLL for both OS-es.

Thw only thing I am currently worried about is OpenGL. I really would like to see some simple OpenGL wrapper for .NET, that works without a native dll/so's (except for OpenGL itself ofcourse) on Windows and Linux.

Oh, 1 thing. My simple 2D demo (www.wpws.nl/~sijmen/sneeuw-0.2.zip) written in C# works both on Windows and Linux with exactly the same files and without recompilation. Also, on Linux it runs (on my pc) 1.5/2x as fast as on Windows!

-
CL Game Studios. Probably.

[edited by - Sijmen on November 28, 2003 3:01:24 PM]

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Linux C# support is almost as good as proprietary Microsoft support... so I wouldn''t count on this "D" language going anywhere =]

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I didn''t know Mono support was that strong...I had never tried it before. Everyone I talk to becomes offended that the beautiful Linux platform would be polluted by anything Microsoft.

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quote:
Original post by Imperil
Linux C# support is almost as good as proprietary Microsoft support... so I wouldn''t count on this "D" language going anywhere =]


yes, D will not go anywhere. it has no reason to leave, as it is yet here and gets more and more strong:D

no, really. D is great, and i''m happy it exists. it provides an alternative, and nobody want a monopole anywhere..

it could get a .NET compiler frontend, now that would be cool:D




If that''s not the help you''re after then you''re going to have to explain the problem better than what you have. - joanusdmentia

davepermen.net

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C# is faster than Java, I believe. Java is ran through a virtual machine, which has one more step in running an application than Microsofts JIT compiler.

Being backed by Microsoft and using the .NET framework replace Win32 as native API isnt hurting, either.

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quote:

I don''t see any practic advance C# should have over Java. And Java did not take over C/C++. So why should C# do?


Because it was made by M$, and because when the longhorn sdk gets here native win32 code will acually run slower than .NET code.

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quote:
Original post by brassfish89
Because it was made by M$, and because when the longhorn sdk gets here native win32 code will acually run slower than .NET code.

Because its made by microsoft is not an argument... and if i think C#-written .NET applications might be... 30% faster than conventional win32 ones, the conventional application still is faster because the time that is spent to "comunicate" with the .NET-framework isn''t compareable to the remaining time a larger program spends on doing other things - which have nothing to do with .NET ...

quote:
Original post by The Orange Peanut
C# is faster than Java, I believe. Java is ran through a virtual machine, which has one more step in running an application than Microsofts JIT compiler.



gcj ( the java compiler of the gcc-suite ) converts java code to machine code, which then is faster than that one generated by C# compilers...

maybe i''m wrong with that, but i think a compiled C# program runs only on a single architecture/operating system...
so i may compare c# performance with gcj''s java performance...

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