Personally I think using stats is a cop-out for other means of representation. Number systems are inherently necessary to handle characteristics, but I believe it has become a reliancy (particularly because of RPGs); when it''s too simple to put "80% health" or "75/100 hp" onscreen instead of being more imaginitive by using color, animation, facial expression, charater comments, or what-have-you.
I don''t think using numerical representation is the problem, more like a by product of (or crutch for) lack of creativity.
matrix³
[ email | web | apple gl | linux gl | opengl | freeglut | glui | lua ]
A RPG without numbers?
The problem with non numerical system is how do you convey information to the player in a meaningful way. Since it costly in both time, money and resources to create highly detailed animation. as well as the fact that it can be difficult to diserne the meaning. After all does your character slouching mean he''s half dead, tired, winded, weakened, or slightly injuried. Then he gets hit again and is now grapping his bleeding arm. So the player has figure out what theat means.
The game needs to inform the player what is going on in some fashion. Detailed images arn''t the answer since the over head nessary to do this makes it unfeisable.
Also since most RPGs these days are nothing more then hacking and slahing games where the player spends 99% of the game killing monsters. Without detailed information it impossible to do this, the player would never be able to tell if there in over there head until it was to late. Like wise they would be unable to tell wether or not the equipment they have is any good. Players need numbers to make informed decisions. Should I buy "the golden toad smaker" or keep my "Balloon''s bane poking stick"? Thats then kind of deciesion they make over and over and over and over again.
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Writer, Programer, Cook, I''m a Jack of all Trades
Current Design project
Chaos Factor Design Document
The game needs to inform the player what is going on in some fashion. Detailed images arn''t the answer since the over head nessary to do this makes it unfeisable.
Also since most RPGs these days are nothing more then hacking and slahing games where the player spends 99% of the game killing monsters. Without detailed information it impossible to do this, the player would never be able to tell if there in over there head until it was to late. Like wise they would be unable to tell wether or not the equipment they have is any good. Players need numbers to make informed decisions. Should I buy "the golden toad smaker" or keep my "Balloon''s bane poking stick"? Thats then kind of deciesion they make over and over and over and over again.
-----------------------------------------------------
Writer, Programer, Cook, I''m a Jack of all Trades
Current Design project
Chaos Factor Design Document
I don''t think that incrementing the presence of an effect is a exact way of showing things. If you know when you are hurt because you bleed, and the more you bleed the more you are hurt, when you see the player bleeding a little, and just a little more, it''s hard to diferenciate.
But you could make special representations for things that are important, like it was sayd, but still the player would have a hard time at knowing exactly the currents stats between those special representations. I''m just about to die, but can I take one weak hit, or can''t I?
I think that a a way around this is making the posible HP values small. Like the player starts with 3 HP and the max it''s 20. That way it would be easier for the player, and it''s posible to make a different animation for each amount of health you have.
Asuming you have 20 HP:
1-5 HP, the character is bleeding in all the body
6-10, the character is bleeding slightly
11-15, the character has purple marks
16-19, the character has red marks
That divides them in 4 groups, and they all have 5 members except when you have max HP.
So to diferentiate those members:
5th member of the group, the sign of begin hurt is small
4th, the sign has a mobile animation and is small
3th, the sign is big
2th, the sign is big and mobile
1th(not present in the 16-19 group), the sign is big, mobile and brighter than the other four. The other four shouldn''t change colors.
So when you have 1 HP we are taking about the 1st member of the 1st group for example.
Of course that when max HP is equal to something different from 20 you should deal with this in another way. You would have to come up with some formula so you can determinate some signs of being hurt that would be left out. Of course this is just adds a new problem, but if you solve it you might have the damage representation you want.
But you could make special representations for things that are important, like it was sayd, but still the player would have a hard time at knowing exactly the currents stats between those special representations. I''m just about to die, but can I take one weak hit, or can''t I?
I think that a a way around this is making the posible HP values small. Like the player starts with 3 HP and the max it''s 20. That way it would be easier for the player, and it''s posible to make a different animation for each amount of health you have.
Asuming you have 20 HP:
1-5 HP, the character is bleeding in all the body
6-10, the character is bleeding slightly
11-15, the character has purple marks
16-19, the character has red marks
That divides them in 4 groups, and they all have 5 members except when you have max HP.
So to diferentiate those members:
5th member of the group, the sign of begin hurt is small
4th, the sign has a mobile animation and is small
3th, the sign is big
2th, the sign is big and mobile
1th(not present in the 16-19 group), the sign is big, mobile and brighter than the other four. The other four shouldn''t change colors.
So when you have 1 HP we are taking about the 1st member of the 1st group for example.
Of course that when max HP is equal to something different from 20 you should deal with this in another way. You would have to come up with some formula so you can determinate some signs of being hurt that would be left out. Of course this is just adds a new problem, but if you solve it you might have the damage representation you want.
Well, I''d hate to say this, but... as far as an RPG goes, the more numbers you take away from the player, the more numbers YOU have to take care of. I mean, come on-- you''re still testing for stuff like Glancing Blow, Escape Trap, Detect Incoming Projectile, and the like. You''re just not showing it to the player. If anything, I believe that the RPG group enjoys MORE character systems that they can tinker with. Look at the level of customization there is in AD&D. Even though there is a "level of involvement" as far as the players are concerned, are there really AD&D players who just hand off their character sheets to the DM and say, "I really don''t want to hear about the numbers. Just do all the math yourself and I''ll tell you what actions I want to take."? Isn''t that pretty much just like a text adventure? Or reading a book?
That right there you pretty much have a "Choose Your Own Adventure" book, or worse yet: an ACTION GAME.
But if you''re thinking in terms of probabilities and visual dice-rolling cluttering up your action, then you might want to consider looking at a game for PS2 called "The Getaway". The game is completely devoid of a HUD; rather, it shows your progress though visual and audio cues(like the "limping, bleeding body" you''re speaking of, and knowing when to turn by watching the turn signals on the car).
B. Bradley: The number 2 mind
www.numbermind.com(coming soon)
That right there you pretty much have a "Choose Your Own Adventure" book, or worse yet: an ACTION GAME.
But if you''re thinking in terms of probabilities and visual dice-rolling cluttering up your action, then you might want to consider looking at a game for PS2 called "The Getaway". The game is completely devoid of a HUD; rather, it shows your progress though visual and audio cues(like the "limping, bleeding body" you''re speaking of, and knowing when to turn by watching the turn signals on the car).
B. Bradley: The number 2 mind
www.numbermind.com(coming soon)
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