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Abominacion

Test my 3D Engine Demo

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Abominacion    207
Hi, I''d like you to test my demo, mainly to see if it actually works with the graphic cards it''s supossed to work. The demo requires a Pixel Shader 1.4 capable graphic card, so it should run on a Radeon 8500 or higher or a GeForce FX 5200 or higher. You can download the demo here. The downloadable file is a 3.68MB 7-zip self extracting exe. Here is an screenshot of the demo in action: Thanks for your time, please reply saying whether it works, and stating your graphic card. ------------------------------------------------------ Cuando miras al abismo el abismo te devuelve la mirada. F. Nietzsche

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sBibi    241
works fine on my comp (with FX 5900 U), but the text doesn''t display properly, only flat shaded quads, no font textures...

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Hola! Un engine realmente impresionante... Me funciona un poco a saltos, pero puede tener que ver con la capacidad del procesador más que con la de la tarjeta gráfica (Radeon 9000). Los pixel shaders están muy logrados, y con todos los efectos activados es alucinante. Mis felicitaciones!!
Un saludo,



"Senri no michi mo ippo kara (A journey of a thousand miles starts with a single step...)"

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Worked fine on my Radeon 9600, though the polygons rendered somewhat slow. But that is, I''m sure, just due to the texturing/shading you were using, plus the fact that there''s an enormous number of polygons. You need to work on LOD next, as I''m sure you''re aware It looks like you have global LOD but not CLOD.

~CGameProgrammer( );

-- Post screenshots of your projects. 100+ posts already in the archives.

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Abominacion    207
Nice to see it working with cards other than mine

sBibi: Weird, I have no idea what can be causing the alpha channel of the font texture not to show, because it works with the reference device. I'll have to look onto it, perhaps it's a driver bug.

JoriathLionfort: Me alegro de que te guste y te funcione.

CGameProgrammer: I didn't expect it to be slow on a Radeon 9600. What resolution were you running it at ? (The config dialog defaults to the highest res your monitor/graphic card combo supports), at 1024x768x32 on my Radeon 9100 I get 60 FPS (with Vsync on) nearly all the time.

My engine is using an hybrid continuous/discrete LOD working at shading level, not at geometry level. The chunks of terrain are rendered with two shaders (pvpl.ddl & pvlfade.dll in the shaders folder) the first one is used when the chunk is close, it computes both per-vertex and per-pixel diffuse lighting and interpolates between the two based on distance, the second shader is used when the chunk is far, it computes per-vertex lighting and fades the mesh based on distance. Since the demo is fillrate limited I don´t see the point in using LOD at geometry level (besides, i dislike the popping in the discrete approach, and the wobbliness in the continuous one). I think that the best optimization I could apply right now would be occlussion culling.

cyn: Nice, it seems to be behaving well on the Radeon cards.

------------------------------------------------------
Cuando miras al abismo el abismo te devuelve la mirada.
F. Nietzsche

[edited by - Abominacion on January 22, 2004 8:29:43 PM]

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I was in 1600x1200x32 fullscreen. With AA off and vsync off, I get 25-35 FPS. It''s much faster in 1024x768, since as you said it''s fillrate-limited.

Geometric LOD is good if you''d like to render landscapes farther away... the clipping distance (where the fog starts) is pretty nearby in the test landscape. There are other reasons to support it, but if you already require high-end cards anyway, then you can get away with not using it... but I really wouldn''t say we''re at the stage where maximum-detail landscapes can be used yet...

~CGameProgrammer( );

-- Post screenshots of your projects. 100+ posts already in the archives.

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Abominacion    207
CGameProgrammer:

quote:
the clipping distance (where the fog starts) is pretty nearby in the test landscape


That''s done on purpose, since the terrain is quite small (it''s a mesh created from a 513x513 heightmap) if I increased the viewing distance & the distance it starts fading away accordingly, you''d be able to see the whole landscape with no fading at all. Being fillrate limited, the demo can get away with pushing a lot more tris, given that those tris don''t mean painting lots of pixels, of course.

Anyway, you''ve got a point in using geometric LOD for far away meshes, since it''s an waste to put tris that are going to be rendered as just one pixel or even less.

quote:
From what I understand, Radeon 8500 == GeForce 3. Radeon 9000 == GeForce FX 5200


Nope, both the Radeon 8500 & 9000 support VS 1.1 & PS 1.4; the GeForce 3 supports VS 1.1 & PS 1.1; the GeForce FX 5200 supports VS 2.0 & PS 2.0.

I recommed you check this site whenever you need to know the caps of a graphic card.

Uhfgood: Oh, but you can, in the unbearably slow reference mode, of course .
Jokes aside, this demo could be done using PS 1.1, the only shader that really requires PS 1.4 is the clouds shader (in PS 1.1 it''d require two passes).




------------------------------------------------------
Cuando miras al abismo el abismo te devuelve la mirada.
F. Nietzsche

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Guest Anonymous Poster   
Guest Anonymous Poster
Hi
ASUS Cuv 4X 1Ghz
Ram : 1.3 Ghz
Ati 9600 Sapphyr XT 256 | Presets Fps
No Vsync 1024x768x85 | Anisotropic X16-Antialias X4 = 48/70
Fulscreen more | Anisotropic off-Antialias X4 = 140/190
Antialias On |
Triple Buffer on |

Very nice Job look like the S.T.A.L.K.E.R Ovilion (Alpha demo) engin(X Ray)
so smooth

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machiavelli    122
60-70 fps didnt blow anything up... nice job

asus a7v333-x shoulda got the nforce
xp 2600
512 p2700 ram
radeon 9000 pro (AKA piece of poo) 64mb
xp pro sp1


[edited by - machiavelli on February 18, 2004 10:41:55 PM]

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Hedos    674
1280*960*32-85
vsync off
anti-alias off
triple buffering on

85fps ( on an athlon3200 - 2x256mb 400mhz - radeon9800pro 128mb )

Nice job!
Btw, what does the ''m'' key do, the more I press it and the more everything become slow :/

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Rhis    122
Worked for me. Can''t give an fps since the text wasn''t showing up.

1ghz amd athlon
384mb ram
geforce fx 5200

What''s going on with the clouds.. almost looked like they were changing shape..?

Keep it up!

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Abominacion    207
Thanks for the input guys, it''s very much appreciated.

Scythe Wielder:
quote:

That''s a pretty promising terrain engine you''ve got there



The thing is that it''s not a terrain engine, the terrain mesh is loaded as a generic mesh.
Here''s a shot of my engine showing a cathedral modeled by Marko Dabrovic.



Hedos:
quote:

what does the ''m'' key do, the more I press it and the more everything become slow



Uses ATI''s truform tech to procedurally tesselate each triangle.
Push ''m'' while in wireframe mode to clearly appreciate its effect.

Rhis:
quote:

What''s going on with the clouds.. almost looked like they were changing shape..?



Yep, they are animated, they not only move but billow.


------------------------------------------------------
Cuando miras al abismo el abismo te devuelve la mirada.
F. Nietzsche

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Prozak    898
Well, i've got a top of the line gforce 2, but it doesnt run and crashes in a quite non elegant way.

Maybe you can implement mini-dumps or jump-out-of-fullscreen messageboxes?

Abominacion, where can i find that cathedral? I'm writing my own BSP compiler and would like to use something like that for testing

All in all, keep up the good work...

Edit: Found the Cathedral here, got any more big architectural files like this one?

Jester Says: Visit Positronic Dreams!
[Hugo Ferreira][Positronic Dreams][Colibri 3D Engine][Entropy HL2 MOD]
[Yann L.][Enginuity] [Penny Arcade] [MSDN][VS RoadMap][Humus][BSPs][UGP][NeHe]
"I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."


[edited by - pentium3id on February 19, 2004 4:53:01 PM]

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Abominacion    207
I had a bug in the PS version detection due to poor documentation on the DXSDK and lack of testing on my part. It should be fixed.

ZealousElixir:

I can''t for the life of me figure how it has run on a GeForce 3, but you haven''t been able to see all the shading effects. Could you post or send me a screenshot (F12 key), please?.

As for the techniques I use check the features section of the readme.

pentium3id: Well, sorry for the crash, but thanks to it I''ve found the abovementioned bug. The demo should now correctly forbid the use of hardware acceleration on PS 1.4 non-capable hardware.

High-Poly quality architectural meshes:

Sponza Atrium
Postsparkasse
Power Plant



------------------------------------------------------
Cuando miras al abismo el abismo te devuelve la mirada.
F. Nietzsche

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MichaelT    214
It runs quite ok on my Athlon-XP-Mobile 2800+, 512 mb DDR, ATI 9200 Mobile.

85 - 115 fps

BUT

it has some very jerky movement on occasion, I assume it is because you do occasional heavy calculations or similar?

Also running with 100k+ objects instead of 80k+ displayed no visible difference on the terrain as I could see. It also had almost 0 fps impact on the engine.

I am interested in how you did the sky though, maybe you could send me a source clip on that?

mobas@hotmail.com (compressed of course)

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Palidine    1315
doesn''t run at all. app opens and then immediately closes, no warning messages or anything:

dual P4 3Ghz
NVIDIA Quatro FX 1000
2GB RAM

-me

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Prozak    898
Not to get picky on your work, but why not run at all?
Why dont you make it verticly scaleable, so that older hardware can run it with certain options off?

Thats how im designing my engine... unless of course you are really pushing for PS/VShaders as tech demos and not "real-engines" per se...

Just a thought...

Thank you for the architectural links, quite useful

Jester Says: Visit Positronic Dreams!
[Hugo Ferreira][Positronic Dreams][Colibri 3D Engine][Entropy HL2 MOD]
[Yann L.][Enginuity] [Penny Arcade] [MSDN][VS RoadMap][Humus][BSPs][UGP][NeHe]
"I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It''s the only way to be sure."

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Abominacion    207
MichaelT:

The jerkyness you see it''s prolly because you are running it with vsync on, so when you get a camera view with high fillrate requirements the framerate drops from the full refresh rate to half of it.

The "primitives drawn" stat tells the number of tris that pass the frustum culling on the current view. The mesh itself is completely static.

Regarding the clouds, I''ve basically implemented what is told in the famous cloud thread, which in turn is based in what is told at this page. The sky color is just a gradient between two colors. I''m not planning on releasing the source at this point, but you can read the skyplane.vsh & skyplane.psh files in the "Shaders/" folder of the demo to get some ideas.

Palidine:
Didn''t expect the demo to be tested on a workstation class graphic card, a pity it doesn''t run. Do you get the config dialog?, if so, does the "app.log" file states wether the graphics were initialized succesfully?.

pentium3id:
Don''t mistake the engine with the demo, the demo needs PS 1.4 because it''s what I am interested in testing right now. The engine uses a pluggable renderpath system, so I don''t have any trouble developing fixed function renderpath plugins, for instance.

Glad to hear the meshes come you handy.



------------------------------------------------------
Cuando miras al abismo el abismo te devuelve la mirada.
F. Nietzsche

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