The set items arn''t really comparable to other items, since the set items are relics and relics are the only "real" items in the game the rest of the items are what I call "virtual" items they are created and the items stats depend on the type of item, the materials that went into its consturuction, the quality of those materials, and the quality of the manufacturing.
The set items themselves all have very useful properties and that makes them extremely tempting to use, two examples are the pilgram statue, which is carved from a metorite, that material is stronger and lighter then any normal metal and can be used to make some powerful equipment. An other example is the lazurus stone which can restore its bearer to full health at the moment of their death, it is also the only way to restore a dead character to life.
While completing a set for example the pilgram set, consisting of a book, a bell and the pilgram statue. Open the secert entrance to the hidden valley, an other wise inaccesable area, which contains among other things a martial arts school that can teach you a martial arts style that is one of the four most powerful in the game.
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"Fate and Destiny only give you the opportunity the rest you have to do on your own."
Current Design project: Ambitions Slave
Collect the set or use the pieces?
Definitely give hints towards the prize. There's nothing worse then going through the trouble to collect a bunch of stuff to find the prize is useless.
I'm going to use The Legend of Zelda: The Ocarina of Time as an example here. Not saying that this is a bad game: actually it's quite the opposite. This is one of the best games ever made. But, the side quest of collecting the gold skultulla pieces was dissapointing. there are so many to collect, and the prize is simply all the ruppees you can carry. By the time you actually get all the gold skultullas, you would have finished (or be ready to finish) the game, and ruppees are absolutely useless to you at that point.
What I'm trying to say here is that, the prize you offer for a "collect the items" quest may seem good when designing the game, but I definitely vote for dropping hints about what the prize is, because you don't want to let the player down with a prize they feel is inedquate for the work done to get it.
I'm going to use The Legend of Zelda: The Ocarina of Time as an example here. Not saying that this is a bad game: actually it's quite the opposite. This is one of the best games ever made. But, the side quest of collecting the gold skultulla pieces was dissapointing. there are so many to collect, and the prize is simply all the ruppees you can carry. By the time you actually get all the gold skultullas, you would have finished (or be ready to finish) the game, and ruppees are absolutely useless to you at that point.
What I'm trying to say here is that, the prize you offer for a "collect the items" quest may seem good when designing the game, but I definitely vote for dropping hints about what the prize is, because you don't want to let the player down with a prize they feel is inedquate for the work done to get it.
I think it would be neat if you can use the items in a specific scenario, and not using them is a sacrifice.
For instance, to go back to the Zodiac Stones example, you could have a critical plot point where one of the main characters dies, and you can either use the stone to resurrect them or bury them and keep the stone. If you keep the stone, you have a chance at the set, but you basically bought that chance at the expense of your friend's life. At the end of the game, depending on how many and which stones you conserved, you'd be able to do awesome things. If you have all twelve, maybe your hero experiences an apotheosis, and becomes immortal or something. If you've got six, then maybe you're able to reseal the evil overlord in the dimension of doom. If you used them all, then you have all the advantages that those uses offered, and so you have a larger party, better gear, and are able to destroy the boss once and for all.
Let's see, twelve stones, possibility of keeping between zero and twelve of them, some kind of factorial or something is called for to determine the number of scenarios, but I bet it's in the thousands. This could correlate to endings, easter eggs, or other secrets, and could wildly vary the play experience from game to game. I'm in favor.
It's mostly a writing problem, because all the pitfalls for inadequate rewards that have been observed apply. If you do it carefully and well, I think you'll be okay. Don't worry about not letting players do everything the first time through. Those guys use strategy guides anyway, so they know what all the rewards are. Make the game for straight players, and you'll be okay.
P.S. - Whoa, weird login error. I'm Iron Chef Carnage, and I approve this message.
For instance, to go back to the Zodiac Stones example, you could have a critical plot point where one of the main characters dies, and you can either use the stone to resurrect them or bury them and keep the stone. If you keep the stone, you have a chance at the set, but you basically bought that chance at the expense of your friend's life. At the end of the game, depending on how many and which stones you conserved, you'd be able to do awesome things. If you have all twelve, maybe your hero experiences an apotheosis, and becomes immortal or something. If you've got six, then maybe you're able to reseal the evil overlord in the dimension of doom. If you used them all, then you have all the advantages that those uses offered, and so you have a larger party, better gear, and are able to destroy the boss once and for all.
Let's see, twelve stones, possibility of keeping between zero and twelve of them, some kind of factorial or something is called for to determine the number of scenarios, but I bet it's in the thousands. This could correlate to endings, easter eggs, or other secrets, and could wildly vary the play experience from game to game. I'm in favor.
It's mostly a writing problem, because all the pitfalls for inadequate rewards that have been observed apply. If you do it carefully and well, I think you'll be okay. Don't worry about not letting players do everything the first time through. Those guys use strategy guides anyway, so they know what all the rewards are. Make the game for straight players, and you'll be okay.
P.S. - Whoa, weird login error. I'm Iron Chef Carnage, and I approve this message.
I like the idea of having things work as a set, but I'm not real fond of using things as a one-shot deal.
If an item is unique and is destroyed after one use I'd be tempted to stash it away and never use it until I figured out exactly what it did and then I'd probably opt for the biggest effect.
If an item is unique and is destroyed after one use I'd be tempted to stash it away and never use it until I figured out exactly what it did and then I'd probably opt for the biggest effect.
This reminds me a lot of Diablo 2, where you had items sets. The way it worked was if you happend to get all the items in a certain set (like an axe and certain armour) it would all kinda lock together and give you an extra bonus. It was a great gimmick, one that had me romping through deserts for weeks trying to find a stupid fucking sword that I dont think even existed.
The only person I ever met that actually got an entire set summed it up with 'Wait? This is it? THIS IS IT?!?! WTF!!!?? By the time I found the damn set I already went up enough levels to make it obsolete!!!'.
So yeh, the concept works well and is addictive, but as mentioned if you draw it out to long the player is going to snap when all that happens is the words 'WOW! You found all the blocks! Yay for you...yay' flash up on the screen.
....mmmm....maybe that sword was in that area behind that archway...*sneaks off to track down Diablo2*
The only person I ever met that actually got an entire set summed it up with 'Wait? This is it? THIS IS IT?!?! WTF!!!?? By the time I found the damn set I already went up enough levels to make it obsolete!!!'.
So yeh, the concept works well and is addictive, but as mentioned if you draw it out to long the player is going to snap when all that happens is the words 'WOW! You found all the blocks! Yay for you...yay' flash up on the screen.
....mmmm....maybe that sword was in that area behind that archway...*sneaks off to track down Diablo2*
As posted above, I think possibilites between "all" and "none" would definitely help, i.e. a partial stone combination would still offer some benefit. It would be incredibly frustrating to a player (or to me, anyway) to have used a stone early in the game, and then end up collecting all the rest, to absolutely no benefit whatsoever.
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