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Yamian

MMORPG Ideas

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I'm making an MOMRPG and want to get some feed back on game design. Well first off, it has an above view kind of like a Pokemon thing only without squares. When you run into something hostile, it goes into a battle sequence like in any turn based RPG. The big thing about it though is it's all case scenario game. The worlds are huge so you can, get this, own your own land. Obviously you can equip different items and weapons, but how do new items come to be? Inventers! You can become an inventer. I'll be the one to actually make the items, but an inventer has to be the initial maker of it. You can also have a contract like if you get hired to kill things for someone, they automatically pay you, so you could actually have workers. Only one person can do a quest, and new quests will constantly be created. You can becoem a king or a ruler of some kind and even goto war. You can build too. With the whole contract thing, you can even get a job and goto war for someone. I had movement, text, and fighting already down, but ity was really glitch and started all over. Can I get some feed back on these ideas. I also can't think of a good way of dieing(if that's how you spell it). I'm currently using VB.net and am look for help(I have a thread in Help Wanted) [Edited by - Run_The_Shadows on July 7, 2004 11:35:47 PM]

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Here we go again.

Quote:
The Game Design Forum FAQ says:
I've got a great original idea for MMORPG/MMORTS/MMO*. Most of these posts are made by beginners who have very little understanding of the complexity involved in designing and developing a massively multiplayer game, and therefore these sorts of post don't tend to be taken very seriously. If you are interested in discussing the design of Massively Multiplayer games, please take care to make it clear exactly what you want to discuss, and bear in mind that whenever people see the "MMO" prefix they tend to think "clueless newbie". Misspelled, poorly focused threads on these subjects usually go down in flames very quickly.


Maybe I need to add a bit about "huge MMO's in which you can do almost everything" as well.

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Concering the automatic pay of workers:

Suppose I don't have enough money to pay you, and promise you a billion to get me something? How will I be able to pay?

Of course, you could make it so you need to have enough money to pay the person at the time I pass the contract. But then, what if I make a contract and then spend all my money, so I can't pay the guy anymore?

You could then freeze the money so it stays there for the payment. But what would happen if the person who got the contract didn't realize the contract at all.

(If you can get negative cash, what would prevent someone from paying a billion to another of his accounts, ending with the first account in debt, forgetting about it, and playing with the billion-cash one).

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I'm only a noob to this site, but have been programming for some time now(3 or 4 years) and I had an engine down, it was glitchy though. Don't just jump ahead and say I'm a noob. Raduprv thought they were realistic and he made a full length MOMRPG.

The contract thing, if someone doesn;t have enough money to pay the person, the person doesn't get the money, but the payer will have to give all his money that he makes to that person. You can have negative money, but only symbolically.

Forget about the whole noob thing and tell me if it sounds good so far.

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I appreciate that not everyone who wants to create a MMORPG on these forums is a complete newbie. However, we have had quite a lot of newbies propose all kinds of ridiculously overambitious MMORPG ideas. As a result, it's a little bit harder to take people seriously when they propose these games.

I think your original post suffers from being rather poorly focused. You've given a very brief synopsis of a few randomly chosen features, but you've given relatively little to provide feedback on. Features like user creatable items could be great - but they could also be game-destroying - it all depends on how you're intending to implement them.

It's generally better to pick a single topic at a time and devote a single thread to it, and go into a reasonable amount of detail on that topic. See Wavinator's posts in this forum for an example - he chooses a specific element of his game design he wants to discuss and get feedback on, and posts about it in detail.

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I'm terribly sorry for not focusing on a topic, so let's make this more concintrated. Ummm... I seriously don't have any specific topics to talk about, so should we just stop this thread?

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Original post by Yamian
I'm terribly sorry for not focusing on a topic, so let's make this more concintrated. Ummm... I seriously don't have any specific topics to talk about, so should we just stop this thread?


Well, you could go into a bit more detail about the game mechanics of the various elements you've proposed. If you don't yet have any idea about how those mechanics are going to work - it's time to get thinking!

You may find it helpful to do a search to see if it's been discussed before, which should at least give you a few ideas on how you might start going about it. Failing that, feel free to launch a brainstorming thread about it.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Quote:
Original post by Yamian
I'm terribly sorry for not focusing on a topic, so let's make this more concintrated. Ummm... I seriously don't have any specific topics to talk about, so should we just stop this thread?


You see, that’s why they named you noob. Not because you have lack of programming skill nor low in IQ but game programming & design specific. If you are not and you had thought through each features, you wouldn’t have flash the features out like a “wish list”. Now, we know this because we’d been there! So don’t be so defensive. Game programming is a whole beast man. Text, movement and fighting are the easiest part. ‘easy’ as in the problem had been beaten to death already unless you are doing something very unusual. Especially in rpg where the network sync is less complicated.

Here are some of the stuffs that I think once you analyze them closely, you will see the scope of the problem. (Note that most of the problem it is not because it has not solution but that the solution is not good enough. So people keep on seeking on a better one or just compromise.)

Any player vs. player interaction rule in which the result benefits to one party and the exchange is not instant will always fail (exploited). Analyze it and you will see. So the ‘contract’ thing will require quiet an effort to prevent players collaborating to beat your system.

About owning land, well, you know that it requires storage for ownership. So if you analyze it closely, you will see that it actually takes quiet an effort to make sure that your database storage remains within $$$. So the “get this, own your own land” says it all about your knowledge on mmo. Also land ownership implies dynamic items on land which implies dynamic content and that, there is a whole issue involved that you need to solve unless your database storage and cpu resource is somehow free of $. Remember that you need to backup the whole system so it does become expensive.

This is why you need to think through about your features and ask each one at the time for ideas and suggestions as Sandman noted.

Good luck man.

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Quote:
Original post by Yamian
I'm making an MOMRPG and want to get some feed back on game design.


Okay, I'll bite. Why not? I won't call you a noob, or flame you. But I'm going to be honest.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
Well first off, it has an above view kind of like a Pokemon thing only without squares.


Groovy. But have you considered the ramifications of this decision? Is it a technical consideration (i.e. that's what you know how to program?) or is it a design consideration? If it's a design decision, what are you going to do to counter the "disconnection" factor that occurs when playing a game in this view?

Overhead (top-down) perspective is used signficantly in RTS style games precisely because it gives a clear macroscopic view of the gameplay. Most current RPGs favor a tight 3rd Person or 1st Person perspective because it's easier for players to feel "attached" to the avatar they are controlling.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
When you run into something hostile, it goes into a battle sequence like in any turn based RPG.


Well, this is a little vague. I understand fully what you mean by this. I see the setup just fine. However -- And this is a big However -- What do you actually DO in these turn-based battle sequences? What is the gameplay?

I like to think about gameplay as:
Choices and Consequences performed in a Ruleset. Detail the choices, the consequences, and the rules. Also, pay particular attention to the group dynamics. If you're going to make a MMORPG (as opposed to a solo-focused RPG) you need to spend a significant amount of design time on group dynamics.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
The big thing about it though is it's all case scenario game.

I don't understand what "case scenario game" means.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
The worlds are huge so you can, get this, own your own land.

Um... My own country? My own town? My own farm? My own house? What specifically are you talking about? Also, are all the plots of land instanced? If not, is the terrain procedurally genererated? If not, we're talking about so much art that the thought of it actually makes me cry a little on the inside.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
Obviously you can equip different items and weapons, but how do new items come to be? Inventers! You can become an inventer.

Now, there's some actual meat. I, personally, think that's a pretty clever idea.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
I'll be the one to actually make the items, but an inventer has to be the initial maker of it.

I'm not sure I get what you're saying here. Do you mean that "You" will make the items in game? Or do you mean that "You" as designer will design them? If its the latter, then I think you're shooting yourself in the foot. There's some awfully creative people out there who could "invent" a weapon you've never thought of.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
You can also have a contract like if you get hired to kill things for someone, they automatically pay you, so you could actually have workers.

If you get hired by whom? NPC's or other players? I don't see the correlation between GETTING contracts and HAVING workers. Are the Workers NPCs? Details, Details, Details.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
Only one person can do a quest, and new quests will constantly be created.

I have to be honest here. This is simply ludicrious. Let's say you have 10 players. Let's say they play 10 hours a week. Let's say it takes 2 hours to complete a quest. 10 * (10/2) = 50. So, given the numbers above, you would need to generate 50 unique quests a week. I'm a pretty prolific writer myself, but thinking I had to write up 50 short-story quests each week... well again... I'm crying a little.

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
You can becoem a king or a ruler of some kind and even goto war.

King or ruler of who? NPC's? Other Players?

Quote:
Original post by Yamian
You can build too.

For the love of all that is sweet and pure... Once again, I point you details. This statement does not tell me anything about:
What I can build.
Where I can build.
Why I should build

As you work on your game designs, you need to remember that you know your game better than anyone else (after all you thought it up) but that means you need to be very deliberate in your communication. Details... Details... Details.

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First off, the above view will allow you to see a wide range of things. But it won't have squares. this way it will be easier to get in and out of people's ways. This also gets rid of the clicking issue. Like in EQ, you'll more than half the time click on something you did not want to. There will be levels of height too.

In the battle sequence you can attack, defend, heal, run, just think about 2D FF with DnDish attacks.

I was just making a statement about later topics things with the all case scenario.

As for owning your own land, you can start out with a little and buy more land, conquor mor land, just make it bigger or smaller. You can have anywhere from a log cabin to an entire kingdom. I could make a random terrain generator so don't feel so bad about the painful design. pretty much all the lan dis already owned by me at first and I'll slowly sell it. There will be tiny squares of land, and there will be a land management tool that you can only access at a location you set on your land.

As for inventing, an inventer will submit ideas and the higher their inventing level, the greater I'll concider it, I make it(not as a character) or have trusted people make it, and then make it seem like they made it by apperaing at their work bench. The higer your inventer level, the more I'll like you and let you make bigger better things, and the lower level ones will have to settele for weak things for me to concider them.

With contracts, you can make a contract with another person. This will be a complicated system I'll make later. Ever used a campaign editor for a tactical game like the one in StarCraft? People just get a lot of options for the trigger and for the effect of the trigger.

Being ruler, you need a lot of land. It's not like you're a registered ruler, but people look to you that way. People who live on you're land need to pay a tax or a rent. You could have a house and someone pays you to live in the barn. You could own a continent and get taxes from it. It goes.

Building? Basically you have lego pieces you need to make and snap them together to make a house, cottage, or a castle.

Small quests can be done multiple times. But a big quest like defeat the dragon on the top of the mountain, 1 timer.

As for death, I need some ideas.



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