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q3 engine gpl'd by end of year

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Infinisearch    2967
came across this http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/32916 look at the last paragraph, its seems the Q3 engine might be gpl'd before the year is out... I didn't read through the slashdot thread that is mentioned, as i don't feel like it at the moment. Anyhow good news for us.

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Hybrid    138
It's not that good for us. Quake III is written in C, not C++, and id's Engines are known for being hacked and fairly unintelligible.

There's only a limited amount you can learn from going over someone else's engine and the best form of learning is practicing yourself.

Well... I'm sure there will be people who beg to differ. The HL2 source code was well structured and easy to understand. *cough cough*

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Infinisearch    2967
I guess this was the wrong forum for the 'good news' comment, i meant it more in regards to making games not hacking an engine. After all its an engine that is proven, has opengl implementations optimized and stable for it, has a multitude of content creation tools available for it, has alot of tutorials available from the mod community, and has the large mod community available for help.

Personally i don't mind it being written in C and as to the source being messy i wouldn't know personally but alot of engines have become availble based off the Q1/Q2 source they seemed to have got by.

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Pxtl    354
Hmmmph - I haven't seen a whole lot of good come of the opensourcing of the Q2 or Quake engines. There are many small projects, but none of them really snagged my interest like the Doom projects have.

Still, at least it'll make it easier to get md3 support into more games. Too many OS games still rely on those lousy md2s, when the Q2 model spec sucked compared to the Q3 spec (why no, I don't need my playermodel to move and shoot at the same time, why do you ask? Oh, one frame of airborne movement is fine for falling and swimming, why wouldn't it be?).

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Infinisearch    2967
Quote:
Original post by Pxtl
Hmmmph - I haven't seen a whole lot of good come of the opensourcing of the Q2 or Quake engines. There are many small projects, but none of them really snagged my interest like the Doom projects have.


The only one i remembered off the top of my head was Tenebrae however when i had come across them from another project based off the source, that had looked very promising. Tenebrae looked nice and sounded nice, per-pixel lighting and stencil shadows.

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Etnu    880
While it's quite true that id's code isn't the 'prettiest', it more than proves itself when it comes to performance and functionality. You're not going to learn anything new from most engines, but Q3 can probably teach even the most expeienced programmers a thing or two.

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Extrarius    1412
Quote:
Original post by silvermace
i agree with that, id are optimization titans
I'd change that to 'were'. Quake 3 is AWESOMELY optimized and will run fine on onboard chips with decent graphics quality and FPS, but doom 3 won't run on my radeon 8500 at playable speeds with EVERYTHING turned off/on lowest (yes the 8500 is old, but I can play UT2004 with it on decent settings and still get 60-100 FPS and doom3 on lowest settings looks worse than what I can play UT2004 at)

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Ademan555    361
eh? i have a radeon 9700 and i barely made 30 fps in the demo of ut2004... 800x600 most things turned down... though it wasnt bad except for the outdoor part i nthe assault level.. though i respect the fact that it probably wasnt completely finished code. and also, as to doom III, did you really expect your 8500 to be doing z-fail, bump mapping, specular mapping, and a whole slew of other effects ? theres a big difference between ut2004 and doom III graphics wise, doom III is much more shader dependant, i dont think the 8500 has much in the way of shader support does it?
(just defendin the faith here :-D)
-Dan

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Etnu    880
Quote:

Quake 3 is AWESOMELY optimized and will run fine on onboard chips with decent graphics quality and FPS, but doom 3 won't run on my radeon 8500...


Please tell me that you're joking. There isn't a single game that's going to be released this year that will run at playable rates on that card.

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Mezz    571
Yeah, Doom3 ought to run on the 8500 - it's a sound DirectX 8 card, Carmack talked about it in his .plans performing reasonably against similar nVidia hardware. Also, sites have said that Doom3 is playable on a GF4 MX, which is just a DX7 card really. There is something seriously up with your system configuration (CPU?) if Doom3 won't run playably on the 8500, even though it is a relatively old board. Update your drivers, etc.

-Mezz

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Promit    13246
D3 runs well on a GF4 MX 440 (according to JC, I haven't tried it myself) so it really ought to be fine on an 8500...

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Integra    256
The guys installed it on a 1.7Ghz, 512 ram, Radeon 8500 machine here at work yesterday.

The game runs perfectly fine with lower options enabled. The 8500 is an old card, I wouldn't expect it to run anything that comes out this year with "good" performance. Doom 3 actually gets really playable framerates though so far, as people play it on breaks, etc.. due to the fact that you can't install a game on your real workstation unless you want to be fired!

You updated your 8500 drivers right? Remember this is ATI we're talking about.

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Raloth    379
Quote:
Original post by Ademan555
eh? i have a radeon 9700 and i barely made 30 fps in the demo of ut2004... 800x600 most things turned down... though it wasnt bad except for the outdoor part i nthe assault level.. though i respect the fact that it probably wasnt completely finished code. and also, as to doom III, did you really expect your 8500 to be doing z-fail, bump mapping, specular mapping, and a whole slew of other effects ? theres a big difference between ut2004 and doom III graphics wise, doom III is much more shader dependant, i dont think the 8500 has much in the way of shader support does it?
(just defendin the faith here :-D)
-Dan
First, I'd check your drivers as others have suggested. I can run the demo at 1024x768 with 6x FSAA smoothly on my 9600 XT. Second, the 8500 supports VS/PS 1.4, the same as the GeForce 4 TI. I don't think it has as many maximum instructions, though.

Now, to veer this train back on track, I'm not sure how useful the Q3 engine source will be. I downloaded the Q2 source a while ago and couldn't make any sense of it, and saw more than enough "hack hack hack" in the comments to not even try.

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Scarfy    122
Quote:
Original post by Hybrid
It's not that good for us. Quake III is written in C, not C++, and id's Engines are known for being hacked and fairly unintelligible.


Ummm... we are talking about programmers like John Carmack here, probably the best in his field. If you're not able to understand the engine than this is probably your fault, not theirs.

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Etnu    880
Quote:
Original post by Scarfy
Quote:
Original post by Hybrid
It's not that good for us. Quake III is written in C, not C++, and id's Engines are known for being hacked and fairly unintelligible.


Ummm... we are talking about programmers like John Carmack here, probably the best in his field. If you're not able to understand the engine than this is probably your fault, not theirs.


Er, the code is pretty hacked and hard to read and fully understand, but that has nothing to do with what you can / can't learn from it. There are other factors at play here, though: They're called "deadlines" and "publishers".

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Ysaneya    1383
Quote:

Second, the 8500 supports VS/PS 1.4, the same as the GeForce 4 TI. I don't think it has as many maximum instructions, though.


The 8500 supports PS 1.4, but the GF4 only supports PS 1.3. Not only its instruction set is more powerful (it's actually closer to PS 2.0 than PS 1.0), but it also supports more instructions.

Y.

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Max_Payne    757
This is actually quite awesome... The Quake 3 engine is alot more modern than Quake 2... And Doom 3 was built using parts of the Doom 3 engine which were eventually replaced (don't contradict me on this, it came directly from John Carmack). With Quake 3 you get support for large 24 bit textures, better models, better maps... Enough to make a game that actually looks modern... With Quake 2, you actually need to implement support for better textures yourself.

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