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Aurvandil

RPG Stats Concept Game Design

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I am currently working on a battle/stats/item/weapon/etc system for a possible CRPG. I am looking at doing a paper & pen RPG type system (see Knights of the Old Republic). I got to thinking and every Final Fantasy game (to my knowledge) has a unique stats, level, skills system. I was curious as to any ideas new and old that y'all may have. At the moment I was going to use a variation on the popular d20 system...

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IMO the d20 system is the most over-used and horribly designed rule system there is. If I were you I would design a unique system that steers clear of the problems of d20.

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I think its not a bad place to start out... it is fairly simplistic, but i do agree with DrEvil in that I do think you should consider expanding on it and creating a system that is your own.

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DrEvil, why do you think D20 is horribly designed? I'm not being a smart ass here I am actually curious. I've only been playing DnD for the past few months and haven’t run into anything particularly bad about the system. Aurvandil is looking for ideas after all.

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I'd be really interested in an RPG that doesn't use stats/skills/etc for a change.

Can you be truly different?

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I just personally hate how pretty much the entire system works, but on the other hand I'm not a big fan of level/class based systems in general. They haven't got a single ounce of realism or believability involved in their design. I suppose in a fantasy world it may be acceptable for some, but I hate the fact that a level 9 whatever can stand there and do nothing and a "newbie" character can swing at them all day long and never have any effect. Many systems are like this. I prefer the idea that the character will always be in danger. You may have the skills to easily take Orc X now, but should you encounter them in packs there should still be great risk, not like in D&D and Everquest where you can stand in a newbie zone all day with 20-30 creatures on you and never get a scratch. The rule system we're using for our RPG is skill based, with no classes or "experience" involved. It's just a matter of getting good at the skills you use. It's much more realistic and flexible. I do understand however that realism is not fun in many cases, so there are certain deviations from realism that can safely be made in the spirit of fun gameplay, like the "hitpoint" system, cuz nobody wants to die with 1 sword swipe, but I think the whole idea that some magical level number somehow makes you untouchable by lower level creatures. We have computers now that can do die rolling for us, so we need to take advantage of this and go beyond what D20 and similar systems offer us and attempt to add some extra levels into the simulations that one could expect to see in any believable world. Just my opinions, if D20 meets your needs by all means use it.

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Alright, before you start designing an rpg stat system, you have to ask "what do I need?" Start making a list of all of the things that will happen in your RPG and ask which ones must there be a chance at the player failing at? Next, ask whats the simplest way to do this? For example, just checking the player's level and not letting them to climb this rock wall if it's below 7 would be the easiest idea. Finally, you ask if the same type of events ever happen twice or more and thats when you finally may need a Skill and Stat associated.

If you never have a need for a associated non-combat skill, you don't need to develop an d20 like RPG stat system.

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Quote:
Original post by catch
I'd be really interested in an RPG that doesn't use stats/skills/etc for a change.

Can you be truly different?


Curious, IMO the definition of an rpg is a game in which you can further an alternate self in some way. I dont see how you could do that without stats of some kind.

Good call Inmate, I think I would have thought of that eventually :/ but thats why I made this forum :)

Edit:
If you are reading this for info, there is another thread geared towards MMORPG's in this forum called "The WuXia Project - A Theoretical MMORPG Design Discussion" just FYI

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well, for my opinion on the d20:

the class/level system is outdated, at least as far as computers go. The computer can take all kinds of wierd calculations. Go ahead and make skills advance through use. That introduces a whole host of problems, but I find the advantages outweigh the disadvantages.

Stat-wise, there will always be a need for attributes (at least as far as I see) without them, it's impossible to show character growth. Without them, it remains the skill of the guy behind the keyboard--which is really important, but an RPG is not a FPS. To have character advancement story-wise, you have to advance statistically.

The basic list that D&D uses is an excellent place to start.
Strength
Dexterity (also known as Agility--a better name IMO)
Constitution
Intelligence
Wisdom
Charisma
Tweak that to fit your game, but 5-7 stats is probably the best range--any more and it hurts the players' heads, any less, and you'll be hard put to apply any shadings.

Combat-wise, D&D gets the basic concepts, but not the numbers. Again, computers can do it, make the thing reflect the characters better. A random range of 20 is pitiful if we're talking a computer. Especially for an MMO.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with D&D, but it's not universal. Take it and run with it.

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Quote:

Curious, IMO the definition of an rpg is a game in which you can further an alternate self in some way. I dont see how you could do that without stats of some kind.


So typical. What does role playing have to do with dexterity or strength?

It iffs me how people think "ROLE PLAYING" means levels, attributes, and skills. If that's the case, then diablo 2 is a role playing game! HAH.

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