Sign in to follow this  
baraka

Win32 worthwhile?

Recommended Posts

I think no. Once you start Java programming (or even C# as posted?), you'll never want to go back to doing GUIs with win32 api.

edit: yeah, if you want to do dx or ogl in c++ at the lowest (practical) level in c++, then you have to know a little bit of win32, but that's just creating a window and a message handler.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You CAN use DX and OpenGL with win32. The Win32 APIs are actually currently essential in order to do pretty much anything on Windows.

That is, unless you use some wrapper library which hides them all from you, which is generally an extremely good idea.

Something like SDL, we know really has win32, DirectX and OpenGL underneath, but we just use it and ignore all that.

For example, NeHe's tutorials all contain a large amount of win32 code - it isn't really necessary, it's just boiler-plate in order to get the programs to work - the real work is done in OpenGL.

I can't see MS taking away win32 any time soon (despite with other posters suggest)

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree with you I don't think win32 is going anywhere soon. Microsoft would have to completely restructure directx and that would not be simple. Simple is to leave it the way it is. So thats what they'll do.
Yours Truely,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
By worthwhile do you mean "professional" or for "personal" use. In the former I would imagine knowing Win32 would be almost vital to getting a non-game programming job. Something like 90% of people use Windows and I don't see this changing anytime soon. Even with Longhorn coming out, many people won't upgrade. At least not right away.

If you meant the latter then it's really all based on personal preference. There are alternatives to Win32 such as Qt and GTK+ which are not only easier to use, but cross-platform.

Personally, I think everyone should at least know how to do the basics, which are explained very well in The Forger's tutorial. Using the win api is not hard and, IMHO, is well worth it. And this is coming from someone who doesn't even use windows ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Win32 libraries are going to be obsolete with the new Windows Operating systems because, to put it simply, Microsoft programmers are sick of having to make everything backwards compatible, which also includes all the problems of the previous code. A good majority of the viruses lately have preyed on code that hasn't been changed since 9x and NT 4 days.

So, instead of giving Win32 programmers an easy ride, they rewriting the libraries from scratch.

Atleast, that is my understanding. Feel free to correct me if anyone spots and mistake.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Does the language or platform really matter that much?
Just because microsoft releases another OS does this mean we should all start learning c#.

I have hard core game programming friends (with games on the market) that never left Basic from back in the day and now use extremely powerful versions of it.

Things are probably heading Virtual Machine. Were an app browser understands multiple languages an libraries


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote:
Original post by ontheheap
By worthwhile do you mean "professional" or for "personal" use. In the former I would imagine knowing Win32 would be almost vital to getting a non-game programming job.


Actually when talking about professional programming you will rarely ever need much Win32 unless you are a GUI developer.. and even then most companies are using RAD tools for that anyways. Obviously in most professional game programming jobs as well you are never going to see a level as low as Win32 unless you are a core engine developer, the lowest you will likely see is the engine.


Quote:

Something like 90% of people use Windows and I don't see this changing anytime soon. Even with Longhorn coming out, many people won't upgrade. At least not right away.


Actually the upgrade should be quick and painless. Why? Microsoft realized that not everyone is going to purchase Longhorn right away and many people will stay with XP for awhile. So they are going to be offering core enhancements such as Avalon as a Windows XP update.. this ensures that Avalon applications will now run on XP.. allowing programmers to basically drop Win32/MFC programming.

Quote:

Personally, I think everyone should at least know how to do the basics


I agree, it is always good to know what is going on and how to use the system. As you said learning an API is not difficult.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I wouldn't really worry about longhorn just yet - firstly because its not due out till 2006/7 (which will probably be pushed back anyway), and 2ndly because it'll take at least another 5 years after that befor a decent section of the pc market has it. Loads of people still use Win98 which is now 6 years old. I think the uptake of longhorn will be even slower than XP and 2k because of the system requirements - have you seen the specs needed just to run the OS? Anyone wanting to upgrade will need to buy a whole new PC as well as the new OS and I can't see many people doing that right away (or at all).

Learning to program well is far more important than learning a specific API anyway - if your a solid coder then picking up a new API shouldn't be a problem, so not matter what you choose I'd worry far more about writing solid, resuable code rather than the exact API its useing. And if you write solid well designed code you should be able to switch API's without too much hassle anyway :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks a lot for answering my questions guys. But I didn't see anyone talk about the XBox. I mean, do they make use of Win32 or DirectX for the specific platform's games?

Quote:

Wont it HAVE to change to something like "win64" when longhorn arrives?


I've heard that we'll have Win64 later on. But doesn't that mean that we'll still be using Win32 basics?

Quote:

By worthwhile do you mean "professional" or for "personal" use


Well, both. In fact, it's more professional than personal. Because, i really wanna know about the trends out there. I know that each game developing studio has it's own technique, but I wanna have a wider view concerning the available APIs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this