Can plot hurt a game?
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Is it at all possible for plot to hurt a game?
Imagine a game like Contra but with a deep, involved story. Would cinematics between levels in Contra hurt the game at all? What about tense dialogue during the mission (like Metal Gear)? Does everyone just 'accept' that it doesn't have a story or do they actually not want a story?
It usually depends on whether or not the *plot* matches with the gameplay (or the overall atmosphere of the game) and whether or not it can be considered a good plot. This isn't so much a problem with stand-alone games, since at that point its simply a matter of design.
But when you start dealing with Sequels and established Storylines, Plots for those sequels can dramatically effect a games success, since players will be looking for continuity and twists that are consistent with the existing storyline.
[Edited by - Gyrthok on December 1, 2004 11:42:10 PM]
But when you start dealing with Sequels and established Storylines, Plots for those sequels can dramatically effect a games success, since players will be looking for continuity and twists that are consistent with the existing storyline.
[Edited by - Gyrthok on December 1, 2004 11:42:10 PM]
I'd say that simpler games benefit from not having a plot. Since these games focus on the gameplay (because they're simple), players don't play them to see a story unfold. If you want to sit down for a while and enjoy a good puzzle/platforming/shmup/etc game, you don't want plot points intruding every so often. Now, many games do have plots that don't intrude on the gameplay. Hell, most games from the NES era had plots only in the game manuals. This is fine. If there's a backstory to the game that can't be smoothly inserted into the game itself, then leave it where curious people can find it.
Basically, I'm saying that plot shouldn't interfere with enjoyment of the game. Some games are all about story; in those cases, plot is useful. Some games don't focus on story, but need to provide some motivation to the player; again, plot's not a bad idea. Some games, though, don't really need plots, and when plots are tacked on, the games become wearisome. I think perhaps the best example of this is Super Monkey Ball 2, if you've played it. It's a roll-a-ball-through-an-obstacle-course game which for some ungodly reason has a Story mode. In contrast, the first game of the series just had a game mode where you went through the levels in sequence. That's what Story mode is, but they threw in dialogue between sections of the game. Really bad dialogue, but even if it had been deep and moving it would have interfered with the gameplay.
Basically, I'm saying that plot shouldn't interfere with enjoyment of the game. Some games are all about story; in those cases, plot is useful. Some games don't focus on story, but need to provide some motivation to the player; again, plot's not a bad idea. Some games, though, don't really need plots, and when plots are tacked on, the games become wearisome. I think perhaps the best example of this is Super Monkey Ball 2, if you've played it. It's a roll-a-ball-through-an-obstacle-course game which for some ungodly reason has a Story mode. In contrast, the first game of the series just had a game mode where you went through the levels in sequence. That's what Story mode is, but they threw in dialogue between sections of the game. Really bad dialogue, but even if it had been deep and moving it would have interfered with the gameplay.
Plots kind of inherently make a game less replayable, because a story is a lot easier to get bored of than gameplay. On the other hand, a good plot and only a good plot can make a game meaningful.
I would say that ANY game element poorly implemented, plain boring and\or out of the game's context WILL hurt the game experience.
If the plot, in relationship with the game, is poorly implemented, boring or out of the context then it would hurt the game.
If the plot, in relationship with the game, is poorly implemented, boring or out of the context then it would hurt the game.
Personally I do not even want a fixed, pre-written story. If I had to choose between a phenomenally good game with a fixed story and a mediocre game without a fixed story, but with good replayability value, I'd choose the mediocre game.
Of course, this is not to say that the game world and the situation from which the game begins couldn't have a background story. Similarily, I do want a story in the sense that my actions in the game have consequences later on instead of just having separate situations without any clear connections between them. In a sense, the story is written as the player progresses in the game (BTW, it could be neat if the game actually generated a story into a text file as you played).
As for cinematics, they are certainly not necessary even when you want to have a plot. All the time I have to watch cinematics, I'm not playing. And I'm not having fun. If I wanted to go through something completely non-interactive, I would read a book or watch a movie. Cinematics suck big time. Of course, this is just my opinion. The dialogues should also be in-game, not some sort of "epic" cinematical completely separate point of view.
So to summarize: in my opinion, the story should not cause breaks in the gameplay (as in changing to an "epic" point of just for the sake of the story), also it should be used only to suggest, not to dictate.
Gyrthok mentioned the effect a story can have in sequels of games. I would also like to note here that a lousy story can even make the original game feel somehow ruined, so it works both ways, unfortunately.
Of course, this is not to say that the game world and the situation from which the game begins couldn't have a background story. Similarily, I do want a story in the sense that my actions in the game have consequences later on instead of just having separate situations without any clear connections between them. In a sense, the story is written as the player progresses in the game (BTW, it could be neat if the game actually generated a story into a text file as you played).
As for cinematics, they are certainly not necessary even when you want to have a plot. All the time I have to watch cinematics, I'm not playing. And I'm not having fun. If I wanted to go through something completely non-interactive, I would read a book or watch a movie. Cinematics suck big time. Of course, this is just my opinion. The dialogues should also be in-game, not some sort of "epic" cinematical completely separate point of view.
So to summarize: in my opinion, the story should not cause breaks in the gameplay (as in changing to an "epic" point of just for the sake of the story), also it should be used only to suggest, not to dictate.
Gyrthok mentioned the effect a story can have in sequels of games. I would also like to note here that a lousy story can even make the original game feel somehow ruined, so it works both ways, unfortunately.
a very good plot is the first step to a very good game.
look the market, Final Fantsy saga is nt a saga, every single episode has nothing to do, in terms of plot, with others, but all of them has a straight, unbreakeble plot, they gives emotion to players, and are more like a very good high interactive movie. Morrowind, otherwise, has a poor plot, but a very hight liberty of movements, in Morrowind tou can do anithing you want,take the time you need, forget the story and live as relic hunter, you'll never end the game, but you CAN do it. Final Fntasy 7 and Morrowind are two titles with different ideas of "plot", but both very good rpg games.
If you want to tell a story in your game, it will work if you do it well, if you want that the player decide his own story, it will work, if you do it well.
"The Sims" don't has a story, has the good premised for a great full spectrum game, but is a very boring in long term, and don't do his job (maybe because I prefer to live a REAL life, than a fake one, but this is another story)
look the market, Final Fantsy saga is nt a saga, every single episode has nothing to do, in terms of plot, with others, but all of them has a straight, unbreakeble plot, they gives emotion to players, and are more like a very good high interactive movie. Morrowind, otherwise, has a poor plot, but a very hight liberty of movements, in Morrowind tou can do anithing you want,take the time you need, forget the story and live as relic hunter, you'll never end the game, but you CAN do it. Final Fntasy 7 and Morrowind are two titles with different ideas of "plot", but both very good rpg games.
If you want to tell a story in your game, it will work if you do it well, if you want that the player decide his own story, it will work, if you do it well.
"The Sims" don't has a story, has the good premised for a great full spectrum game, but is a very boring in long term, and don't do his job (maybe because I prefer to live a REAL life, than a fake one, but this is another story)
I'd say the primary job of the story is to provide a context for the action in order to give the game some kind of direction.
Ideally, it will also be sufficiently engaging to keep the player interested and encourage him to play the game to the end.
Finally, the difference between a good game story and a *great* game story is that the great one keeps you on your toes and makes you think a bit. Maybe it even has some kind of profound message within it.
A classic mistake in my opinion is to get these priorities in the wrong order. You end up with a story that gets in the way of the game, rather than working through the game, or you get an 'interactive' story that would have been better off just being made into a novel rather than a game.
Ideally, it will also be sufficiently engaging to keep the player interested and encourage him to play the game to the end.
Finally, the difference between a good game story and a *great* game story is that the great one keeps you on your toes and makes you think a bit. Maybe it even has some kind of profound message within it.
A classic mistake in my opinion is to get these priorities in the wrong order. You end up with a story that gets in the way of the game, rather than working through the game, or you get an 'interactive' story that would have been better off just being made into a novel rather than a game.
Quote:Original post by Grim
As for cinematics, they are certainly not necessary even when you want to have a plot. All the time I have to watch cinematics, I'm not playing. And I'm not having fun...Cinematics suck big time.
I concur. Cinematics do suck. When plot gets in the way of playing, then there's a problem. One thing I love about Halo and Halo 2, every movie can be skipped. And that's great because Halo is based on constant, well-implemented action. The story is decent, but truthfully I could care less about why the covanent are attacking, I just wanna kill them.
In direct contrast are games like rpgs, where plot is pretty much necessary, in some form. I didn't mind the movies in FF7, because its a slow-paced game and the plot was one of its most important parts. So plot depends on the type of game your making, especially its pace. If it doesn't need a huge, engrossing, stop-playing-and-watch-this! plot, don't make one.
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