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Is this possible to implement a dynamic scene and dynamic lights in real time?

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Is this possible to implement a ray tracing that simulate a dynamic scene and dynamic lights in real time? I have read a report which say : it is possible to implement a ray tracing that simulate a static scene and dynamic light and view point by make the ray tracing to the stream process. But how about the scene is dynamic?

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Quote:
Original post by firefire99
Is this possible to implement a ray tracing that simulate a dynamic scene and dynamic lights in real time?
I have read a report which say : it is possible to implement a ray tracing that simulate a static scene and dynamic light and view point by make the ray tracing to the stream process.
But how about the scene is dynamic?


I'd be curious to see your source for a real-time raytracer that works for dynamic lights and static geometry. Last I was aware they'd got some reasonable hacks/approximations going, but no generic/complete solution as such.

I's suggest you look into this algorithm you mention, and see WHY it's using static scene geometry. My bet is that it does some sort of pre-processing to optimize the way it can ray-trace the geometry, such that it'd be prohibitive to try and re-calculate this information on every frame for fully dynamic environments.

hth
Jack

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Pre-Computed Radiance Transfer can be used to simulate ray traced images for static geomotry and dynamic lights, with exceptional results that benefit from soft shadows and diffuse inter-reflection between surfaces. I know that the ray-tracing is not performed at run-time but i think that it's as close as you can get at the moment.

Here is the original microsoft paper :

http://research.microsoft.com/~ppsloan/shillum_final23.pdf

And Sony have a pretty good background and summary :

http://www.research.scea.com/gdc2003/spherical-harmonic-lighting.pdf

Happy Reading!

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Possible, sure... but saying it is or is not possible is meaningless without some constraints.

Possible on todays processors? Not without some very hefty compromises in quality or dynamic freedom. Possible in a few years of Moore-esque hardware development? Most likely.

The best chance for full dynamic geometry and dynamic lighting remains dedicated raytracing hardware. There's some research going into producing such a beast, but so far no real indicator of a marketable product.

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Hey, real-time raytracing at high framerates is totally possible on todays machines, if you don't mind the 40x30 resolution that is ;)

On a more serious note. Modern processors are just not very well adapted to 3D. There is increasing evidence that it will be possible to perform real-time raytracing in hardware (because you can easily perform raytracing in parallel), however. In a few years we might be able to have raytracing videocards. The problem is that someone has to come up with a working version that can be marketed, and since all current games rely on rasterization, it would require serious changes to the graphics industry. We would need new, more adapted (more generalized) 3D APIs to really take advantage of this.

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Quote:
Original post by firefire99
http://graphics.stanford.edu/papers/tpurcell_thesis/

a paper research the way to make real time ray tracing in pc video card



Interesting theory, but still not practical in this generation of video card. Even last-generation CPUs can easily outperform the stats given in the paper, without heavily optimized raytracing code. It will take several generations of GPUs before there will truly be enough power available to do true RTRT on a GPU. Even still I don't think it would be nearly as effective as a good dedicated raytracing chip, because it's still fundamentally an ugly hack. As fun as it is to play with doing RT on a GPU, they simply aren't designed for it, and I don't think that any such solution will be a big player in the industry's direction over the next few years.

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Quote:
Original post by ApochPiQ
... There's some research going into producing such a beast, but so far no real indicator of a marketable product.

im not sure what you mean by this... isnt this what you yourself are working on? 'so far' is kinda vague, thatdoesnt give any predictions about the future really.

ntoe that my knowledge of hardware is quite humble, but i just cant believe hardware raytracing isnt possible. if i look at the best raytracing demos, which are quite stunning and realtime on todays pc's, im not that hard pressed to imagine a deddicated unit with mutiple pipelines, a memory architexture optimized for raytracing, to work at 40 fps, without the hacks and a good resolution. a rasterizer sure is orders of magnitude faster than its software couterpart, and i see even more reason for this in a raytracer.

anyway, i suppose the catch is with the whole marketable part... sigh.

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