Hmm.. that does leave the door open to making Deckers fairly common if the money is available. The 3rd Edition Rules on their site seems to hint at there being new Active and Knowledge skills involved in Decking, though it doesn't elaborate much. The Matrix itself seems like an independant world where a characters other skills and abilities are useless, relying solely on the players rig and skills. Its not so much a Class at that point, as a world players can access if they choose. With the optional implants and upgrades for those who want to become more active and integrated with the Matrix world as opposed to the physical one.

Having virtual levels does seem like more of a thing for looks than practicality, but the player wouldn't need to have it displayed to him as it's primary function would be to determine the cost in Karma for respawning. Thats of course if karma is even used in respawning at all, if not than levels themselves become redundant.

**EDIT** Levels being used to gauge encounters not withstanding.

[Edited by - Gyrthok on January 8, 2005 3:32:02 AM]

The levels are pretty much useless...they are there for a couple of reasons...one for developers to take a look and say..."how should we gear this encounter..." Also as a quick reference for players to mark themselves..."lvl 3 decker" even though the level is pointless it does give a sense of how far along the character is in advancement...

Hmm... i've been trying to think this out about the balance between specific classes, and i guess to get a proper handle on how they interact one would have to understand the basic political structures of the Shadowrun Universe.

Everything in Shadowrun seems breaks down into 3 Forces:

1. The Aetherial World
This is the world where spirits and other entities exist, weapons, Decking and technology are completely useless here, and only Magic can be used.
The primary resource of such magical energies is Karma, which can't be bought but can be earned through experience. Anyone can enter the spiritual plane provided they have the proper training.

2. The Matrix

The matrix is the technological dimension that lives and breaths throughout the physical world, and were all money and transactions take place. AI's and other entities are the denizens of this realm, as Spirits are to the Aetherial Plane. Nuyen is the primary resource for this realm, using technology and skills to travel through it. Money cannot be bought, it must be earned through jobs, or stolen. Anyone can enter the matrix and become skilled in its use with nothing but a datajack and a Cyberdeck.

3. The Physical World

Its here that both Magic and the Matrix collide and to battle, with each side using the others weapons against them. Here machines, weapons and magic are used to great effect, the manipulation of the matrix and the Aetherial plane having real consequences in the Physical Plane.


Now, from a meta-physical point of view, The Matrix and the Aetherial Plane are both two sides of the same aspect, that of thought as two opposing spiritual views. They both use two different monetary systems, Nuyen for the Matrix, and Karma for the Aetherial Plane, players recieve both doing Shadowrun's, so naturally they can invest in both regions equally. This leads up to Uber Decker/Mages being masters of both the Aetherial Plane and The Matrix, boiling the game down to Samurais/Riggers (fighters) Vrs Decker/Mages (Casters).

With this in mind, balancing the two seems non-essential, but if a person did want to thin out the overabundance of Deckers overall or create a balance between good(Aetherial) and evil (Matrix), then a greater reliance on the use of Karma for computer skills would be needed (such as using Karma to create a program, as Magic users use it to learn spells), or for a wider variety of computer skills. Another method might be to put a greater reliance on Body Implants for faster and more efficient rigs rather than them being purely optional.

The biggest key though is that all of the classes should work together to be a very good team. The problem is that unlike other MMO's this team has vastly different roles than the "classic" ones in most RPGs.

Street Sam- works like your classic meat tank.
Mage/Shaman- Works like a nuker, but with astral projection is also a scout
Rigger - Overhead surveillance, transportation, unique fighting
Decker - almost a new type of scout, Gathers Info, lowers security etc.
Other - This is for those roles that go somewhere else...each can have thier niche in some way shape or form
-Sniper
-Smooth Talker
-Skill Monkey
-Spy
etc.

The problem only comes about with the loss of perma death in the game. Over a large period of time, characters will be too powerful if we stick with a perfect translation of the original game's D6 system. Though if we changed that system to one of say D100 then perhaps the original's way of doing things may work out fine.

The original system is well balanced, it just needs to be tweaked.

Deckers need to have more than just a .5 karma data jack and lots of $$ to be a good decker. otherwise they'll be a good decker/something. The problem with the balance isn't in the beginning, its in the end game...and thats the problem.

How do we keep someone from becoming a very powerful person at the end game...Basically what happens is that people max out thier base idea, then become deckers...since once your loaded for bear on cyberwear, there's not much more you can do with your money. What do you do...get a G-wiz deck.

Perhaps besides just money, you link the more expensive decks to a specific skill rating required to operate it. The same with programs. Also instead of making Headware a "Necessity" to be a decker, we make them "Essential" to being a GOOD decker. I.E. Allow for headware memory to be used as ram allowing for extra programs to be loaded...increasing the ability of the decker by alot. This would make them eat up more of thier essence, making a something/decker one who can run the matrix, but not be a king at it...just like any mage can fire a gun, but not nearly as well as a street sam can.

Also one thing we might look into is an optional rule that was provided in the game supplements. Since Mages are Karma Hogs, and Sams are Money hogs, we can put in a Karma Buy Option. Karma is very expensive, and translates into alot of money, but characters are only allowed to do it once a day and there is a cap of about 2-3 points (perhaps more depending on the system we go to) per week.

Quote:Perhaps besides just money, you link the more expensive decks to a specific skill rating required to operate it. The same with programs. Also instead of making Headware a "Necessity" to be a decker, we make them "Essential" to being a GOOD decker. I.E. Allow for headware memory to be used as ram allowing for extra programs to be loaded...increasing the ability of the decker by alot. This would make them eat up more of thier essence, making a something/decker one who can run the matrix, but not be a king at it...just like any mage can fire a gun, but not nearly as well as a street sam can.

Hehe, thats a much better way of explaining it than the way i said it. XD
But that is an excelent way of balancing out Deckers in porportion to other classes. Requiring a specific skill level to use programs and to build/use higher-end rigs/implants, as well as the neccessity of Physical Implants to increase the players ability to use more/larger complex programs in the matrix, which eats up more Karma/Essence in the process.

Being able to buy/sell karma would be an interesting way to go, one of the stranger questions would be where to go to cash in/buy Karma? Unless you could Buy/Sell Karma from other players at a Current Exchange Rate?

Riggers we don't need to worry about too much, thier most cheapes VCR requires a healty 1 essence...this is enough to keep anyone from dabbling in it unless they want to be serious.

Mages and adpets are locked in by thier Magic rating, which is of course tied to thier essence.

Deckers, when we look at thier "Essentials" get bogged down by essence
Samurais, same boat
Riggers, same area, plus they spend lots of money on neat drones and cars

Skill monkeys, depending on how they go about this can be very powerful. If they go with Lots of Cyberwear, (head wear memory, Chip Jack, Skill Soft systems) then they can eat up most of their essence so that they can just buy whatever skill they need and then just load it up. Or they may go the slow and karma heavy route. One way they end up with alot of karma, another they end up with alot of money....interesting choices here.

Hmm.. With an over abundance of either Karma or Nuyen, i guess it raises the question of what do to with it once you have a bunch of it? Other than converting it into Karma/Nuyen for different classes. Though depending on the players route it may not really matter..

Shadowrun has a few good area's we could make into money sinks.

Doc Wagon. Higher Protection Costs More...so the more money you have, the less penalty you have for "dying"

Life styles. Lifestyles range from on the streets to mansions. Each one gives you various bonuses and negatives...Obviously the more expensive, the better result.

SoTA. new stuff keeps coming out, and you have to upgrade just to keep up with the game. Its like the red queen says, we have to run as fast as we can just to stay where we are.

Contacts. These are the people who get you what you need to do your job...and of course they need to be greased up from time to time to keep thier interest.

The harder problem is of course, Karma Sinks. Unless we introduce the idea of "Bad Karma" then Im not sure what we can do about this...besides death penalty.

Yeah, Nuyen usually has more than a few uses within the Shadowrun Universe, but karma is somewhat limited. Bad Karma may not be that bad of a system to implement, as it could decrease greifing or senseless rampages across the city. Maybe Karma could be 'spent' with magic users/NPC's/spirits to do specific things? Or for 'Favors'? Something like getting a spirits blessing or temporary buff? There's also that idea of investing Karma for respawning, for as useful/less as that may be, but it could be used to augment the poor or Nuyen strapped Shadowrunner. Or perhalps even a Hybrid Coverage, with Doc Wagon protecting against loss of Physical Stats, and Karma Protecting against Skill/Ability loss.

I forgot about free spirits. They tend to do favors and such for people, but since they can't earn Karma for themsleves, it must be provided to them willingly by someone....namely a shadowrunner.

Though what role spirits might play in Shadowrun the MMO is beyond me.



On to the next major character in Shadowrun....SEATTLE! IMO Shadowrun should take place entirely in the city area of seattle. If you think about the size of the seatle mega plex then you'll realize exactly how huge the map of the game can be. All the "neighborhoods" of the seattle megaplex are current Cities in real live. From Pyuallup to Redmond and beyond. I would personally like to see the megaplex ran in a full 3D world, just to be able to SEE shadowrun. Though an Isometric UO type world wouldn't be so bad...