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jordi_0071

C++ too difficult

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True. Performance is a non-issue at this stage. I shouldn't have mentioned it.
Therefore Python is a good choice.

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Quote:
Original post by Marmin
Quote:
Original post by SpoonbenderThe question wasn't "Which language should I spend the rest of my life using?", so talking about performance is completely irrelevant.
The OP wants to create games; the question of performance is indeed relevant.


If he's coding Doom 4 it's important. If it's Tic-Tac-Toe, Pong or a simple Terrain Renderer it isn't. You must be good at C++ to gain any performance. If you don't know the language very well you're probably going to write slow code compared to what you could have done in C# with the same skill.

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my thoughts are that learning C or C++ as a first language is really hard core and rough..... just to be clear, C++ is my prefeered choice, but to first learn programming it is NOT the way to go. Python (from what I have heard/seen) is a good place to start and so is Pascal (Pascal was originally supposed to be a languge to learn how to program) avoid Fortran77 like the plague.... if you start your programming there your destily will forever be dominated by the dark side of the force. My basic thought would be: Python or some vaiant of basic, then maybe Pascal, then C and C++.... and if you are serious about making games, take a gander at assembly (lots of the fancy CPU features like MMX, SSE, SSE2, 3DNow! can only be used when you write in assumbly yourself) jsut whatver you do, don't even look at Frotran77.... how I've hated looking at other people Fortran code....

Best Regards

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To the OP, don't listen to these guys. They are all wrong. Use C++. Just Kidding though. The best choice is to see what you like, especially starting out. Try out one, if you don't like it, try another. At this point it doesn't matter which. I DO use C++, but I don't see what is wrong using any of the above suggestions. I first used QBasic, then visual basic, then C++, so I can't vouc for any of the above languages. But either way, go with what feels right to you and who cares about the rest, at least for now.

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Quote:
Original post by Prototype
True. Performance is a non-issue at this stage. I shouldn't have mentioned it.
Therefore Python is a good choice.


It really depends on the amount of performance required. Python is not only simple (comparitive to other programming languages), but with the use of PyGame you can make some pretty impressive 2d games. It may not cut it when it comes to 3d, but by the time a beginner wants to try that they'll have probably learned enough from Python to be able to tackle a more capable language.

Wow... I sound like a Python zealot. [lol] Quite interesting considering I havn't used it very much myself (made pong just to try it out once) and did all my learning with other languages.

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Python and Pascal are very good choices. Pascal is well-structured and easy to learn. Python is intuitive and very natural to use. Python is probably the best choice to start out with, as you can get tangible results more quickly, which helps fuel one's interest in learning more.

C++ isn't really hard, and would be a fair enough language to start out with, but the real problem with learning C++ is that before you know it you don't know what's important. I see too many people struggling to memorise all these advanced aspects of C++ that they really don't need. All you really need to learn at the end of the day is to be able to create functions, call functions, define local variables, know some basic operators (+, -, *, =, ==, <, >), understand how to use 'while' and 'if', and have a simple drawing API on-hand, and you'd be ready to start making games. But this applies to most languages.

All in all, your choice of Python is a good one. But please don't learn BASIC until after learning to program - we don't want you picking up bad habbits ;)

"It is practically impossible to teach good programming to students that have had a prior exposure to BASIC; as potential programmers they are mentally mutilated beyond hope of regeneration." -Edsgar W. Dijkstra

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You should try starting out with plain C. Its
pretty simple and straightforward (but you might have some trouble with
pointers). Most likely it will teach you some bad programming habbits,
like

//doing this
int score;

//instead of
class player
{
int score;
};



, these habbits can be easily gotten rid of once you move to C++, C#, Java
or whatever. So I would say you should start off with C.

P.S. www.cplusplus.com has some nice tutorials

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Quote:
Original post by AcePilot
but you might have some trouble with pointers


And unfortunately, there isn't much you can do without pointers. Not even manipulate text. Which is why he should stay well clear of C, particularly considering that he's already found C++ to difficult.

C++ may be a more complex language than C, but accomplishing even simple tasks are actually more complex in C than in C++, as you have to take care by yourself of things that either the language or the standard library would have taken care of for you.

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I'm semi new myself...
I been learning c++ from the start.
It's hard but I'm doing it
Everything comercial is done in c++ for the most part
and everyone says when u learn c++ you can learn anything
just seems smart to learn it first
might be slow but you just need to stick with it =/

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Quote:

It's hard but I'm doing it
...
just seems smart to learn it first


I strongly disagree. There is a clear difference between learning a programming language and learning how to program. With C++, you have to focus so much on learning the language that it hinders your learning of how to program: instead of learning to solve practical problems, you waste ages wondering whether X should be public or private, what would be the "best" way to arrange your class infrastructure, whether X or Y is "more optimal", what's the difference between a pointer and a reference, why do you get linker error XYZ ...

That's not helpful.

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