Free-form Magic System

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48 comments, last by robert4818 18 years, 10 months ago
The inverse idea is pretty cool, I hadn't thought of it that much, but it makes sense. But again that just gives wizards a reason to carry around some extra mana lanterns huh? On the whole the World MP is meant for an MMO setting where it will take a large amount of wizards in an area to have any true effect on the mana. Sort of like draining a pond with buckets....

Another thought for this system. This one will take some explaining.

First I'll introduce what I'll call manavision. Or astral sight whatever you want to call it. Players who are not magic users don't see anything when a wizard casts a spell until the end effect happens (i.e. the fireball flies across the screen) Magic users however see all of these neeto keen partical effects as a spell is being cast.

This brings us to....COUNTER SPELLS (useful for PVP or certain PVE encounters) This part of the game relies very heavily on PLAYER SKILL and not character skill. As players put together unique spells, they get a particle effect that starts swirling around them that a trained player should be able to look at and figure out what type of spell thier opponent is casting. The element will give the spell its color, the effect will give it a certain set of particles (skulls, XX's, Eyes, Chains, etc) and the pattern of movement will tell its target type. A skilled player can then Match those parameters, and cast off a quick spell to counter the one the opponent is casting before they are able to finish up the spell. (For mult-slot spells the effect in the first slot will be the one used for the counterspell) How the counterspell affects the opponent i'll leave up to individual developers, though it could range from merely stopping the opponents spell, causing a loss of mana, or having the spell affect them....

Next we'll use mana vision to disect the astral space around wizards.

Ley-lines A grid work of very heavy, concentrated mana. Spells cast while in a ley-line are vastly more powerful...though there could be some side effects...sort of like plugging your hair dryer into a 220v socket... These are visible to Wizareds as bright lines across the landscape some are so powerful they are visible to regular players as well.

Nexus Points If you though Ley-lines were mean...wait till you stand in a point where those things cross.....YOWSERS.

WEIRD MANA... Sometimes mana just isn't right...Casting in an area of WEIRD mana causes all sorts of oddities to happen. Wrong Elements come out of your spells, Weaker spells for more mana, stronger spells for less, Gain or lose a slot, Faster or slower casting times... Definately a way to keep players on thier toes.
Ideas presented here are free. They are presented for the community to use how they see fit. All I ask is just a thanks if they should be used.
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I like the idea of the mana particles. You can see them with time so CounterSpells can me thrownor you have advantages on casting a protection.

The LeyLines and Nexus makes me remind when I payes Rifts RPG. And that idea of the mana vision is great! Recalled The Force from starwars where 'invisible' energy flows between living beings.

I imagined an order of blind sorcerers. They may have no eyes, but that doesn't mean they are really blind. They still can see the energy flowing. Something like when Neo gets blind in Matrix Revolutions. And the higher your level the more detail you can see.

That would also explain Elven Nightvision. They not really see the colors in the night but they have a natural manavision so they can see the thins in the woods.

Of course that means that life is mana, so barren lands have low levels of mana (or one kind of mana is prevalent) and active strong live places are powerful mana sources.

Maybe you should find a new word for Mana/Chi/Force. ManaVision sounds like a bad TV commercial.

Also, maybe you like the posts abour learning skills I made on this thread.

http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=324090&whichpage=1�

Luck!
Guimo
To many long post to read... did anyone mention poison... are there are ways to make poison spells... or death type spells for like necros and what of life for clerics and druids or even monks if need be... (monks on some games are "wis" casters)
The idea here...is to create a system where there are enough variables, that you can work out strategies, without creating "must haves" though that is always easier said than done.
Ideas presented here are free. They are presented for the community to use how they see fit. All I ask is just a thanks if they should be used.
I like Kars' idea of spell failure. Maybe novice mages will only have a real chance of success if they only use one simple effect in one slot, so they can give all their attention to making sure it takes the form it should and hits the intended target. More advanced components and more factors would serve to make the spell harder and harder to maintain. The unpredictable consequences of failure are another great wrinkle.

Out of curiosity, will these spells be composed and stored for quick use, or will they be formed on-the-fly? In the latter case, maybe some kind of timing mini-game could contribute to a spell's success or failure. For pre-made spells, a simpler challenge could have a lesser effect. You might not want that kind of twitch aspect, though.
I actually thought of making something like this... One way to balance it is that "spellcrafting" is only avalible to the highest level mages, thus enabling there to be strategy required in the lower levels and spellcrafting as a sort-of reward. Also, you could make it so some options are incompatible or restricted, like stun is only avalible to lightning and earth elements, or you can't put silence on AOE spells, limiting it and making it easier to balance. Actually, if you have disadvantages as well as advantages to making it have a better effect that would add a whole new layer of strategy to a game ("is it worth it?") Now in my game, im having something simmilar to this but different, unfortunately I can't tell you because i'm too paranoid about stolen ideas :-( . Sorry!
And don't get too terribly worried about balancing. If someone finds the uber-spell you didn't think of, you can always nerf it into uselessness with a patch.
I am really liking the thought of a free flowing system such as this, and have some ideas of my own to contribute. The idea of counter-spells and protective spells is a fantastic idea, and would add an extremely high level of diversity to playing a casting class (this can be modified slightly to include ALL casters). First off you could make 'manavision' a "skill" or "talent" that requires players to increase in level to make it more useful. Originally it could start out only showing which element is being used, and even then it may only show x seconds before the spell is finished, not allowing much time for a counter spell. As the skill gets better you learn to detect magic earlier, and get more detailed info such as target type and effects, so that more precise counters/protection can be cast. Only spells cast at you/your party would be shown to save on graphics cost.

Now as for protective spells, picture it like this. I see a mage start casting a fire spell, that is the only info I have, so I quickly press the keys to cast an Ice Shield over my entire group. If completed in time this saves x% of damage from all of us. Or I might just cast an Ice Shield on myself and it saves x+5% for me if the spell is in fact aimed only at me. As the caster gets higher in skill, more advanced spells will be available for protection as well as offense, and thirdly for counter attacks (though to a lesser degree).

With countering, it would make sense that you would have to cast almost the exact same spell, at the same time, to make it work. So my opponent casts a Single Target, plain fire ball at me. I cast a single target fire ball back at him and it hits the opponent for the original damage + x%. I could also have cast a single target ice ball (the direct opposite element) and if successful done (original damage + (x * 2)% damage.

If there was a space for players to setup hotkeys for spells, protections and counter spells, the caster's playability would become immensely more challenging (and if done correctly, fun) than is done in any current RPG's.

Also going to add some comments for other classes in that thread now. :)
Quote:Original post by JWindebank
Now as for protective spells, picture it like this. I see a mage start casting a fire spell, that is the only info I have, so I quickly press the keys to cast an Ice Shield over my entire group.


But if you require some time to detect type of spell (because of casting time), also a counter spell need longer casting time. This means when spell reach your party you'll not finish casting a protective spell, and thereafter you get damage.



ok taking the idea from each area having a mana resource (and so more magical areas have more mana - like the enchanted forest > the bazaar - so you couldn't summon thor the thunder God in a bazaar), there is a smaller bar for mages that fills up rather fast. This is how fast the mage can absorb mana from the environment, which the environment tops up even slower.

Also the spells are defined algorithmically, like in a BASIC/assembly kind of magic. Executing each 'line' of the code takes away some mp from your refilling bar. Different instructions take away different amounts, and maybe with more usage of an instruction the amount it takes away is lessened, or maybe its proportional to your level or something.
Anyway you start off with the basic instructions like jmp and test, but you have to learn things like CastFireBall.
Also if you made a coding error for instance and kept trying to cast the spell when you had no mp left, the mage would keep 'casting' until you told him to stop.
FireBallFireBallFireBallFireBallFireBallFireBall

and I only had enough mp for 2 spells and it takes 2 secs to charge my bar up, then this would happen prehaps
cast!cast!no mp, but attempt made.no mp, but attempt made -         increase is decreased.no mp, but attempt made -         increase is decreased.no mp, but attempt made -         increase is decreased.no mp, but attempt made -         increase is decreased.

or another way could be
cast!cast!no mp, but attempt made.no mp, but attempt made.cast!cast!no mp, but attempt made.no mp, but attempt made.

depending on whether you want the mp to decrease when trying to attempt a spell cast.

Personally I want to code something like all thats been suggested. Would anyone be interested in going onto IM/irc to discuss implementing any of these ideas?

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