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TechnoGoth

Aww, look my 30 foot tall robot is setting houses on fire. Isn't it a Good boy.

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TechnoGoth    2937
You've built your first robot its 30 feet tall has heat beam eyes and can tranform into space shuttle. But at present it doesn't know anything its time to train the little guy. What type of approach would want to take training? Would you want some sort of postive and negative reinforcement system? If so should your treatment of the robot affect its behaviour? Would you prefer a monkey see do monkey do approach where you show it how to do something and it replicates that approach? Would you like a learning environment in which it learns how to solve the problems itself even if it doesn't do it the way you want. If so what level of control would you want in regards to response to the solutions it arrives at. For instance the robot sees a house for the first time and it just so happens this house is on fire. The robot then decides that buring it the proper state for all houses, as such it sets about setting all the houses it encounters on fire. No matter which aproach was taken the robot would be able to use past knowledge to solve new problems. In terms training I was thinking that of giving the player virtual sandbox to put their robot in. Allowing you to create enviorments and problems for the robot to solve. For instance you could build a city by placing buildings and cars and then see how your robot handles a battle with a giant fire breathing lizard. Or place a rubber ball, and iron ball in front of it so it can learn what the diffrence between them. Lastly though, does traini even appeal to people or would you an entirly diffrent approach? Maybe a system where your presented with icons representing actions the robot can perform and conneting them to properties/object icons. So there might be fire heat beams icon and by connecting it to the non burning houses icon the robot will know to fire its heat beams at all non burning houses. This idea however concerns me because its only likely to appeal to a few hardcore gamers.

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Boku San    428
Quote:
Original post by TechnoGoth
Maybe a system where your presented with icons representing actions the robot can perform and conneting them to properties/object icons. So there might be fire heat beams icon and by connecting it to the non burning houses icon the robot will know to fire its heat beams at all non burning houses.

Bingo. Sandboxes are fun...you know, for a minute. Then you get bored. This idea is functional, and will implement the idea nearly as well, but exponentially faster than a behavior simulation.

I'd imagine that this idea suggests a more "conditioned" behavior versus a more "learned" behavior. Players in games, as people do in real life, enjoy a little bit of predictability. Along with predictability, control is enjoyed (otherwise we wouldn't be playing video games). I like this example:
Quote:
Would you like a learning environment in which it learns how to solve problems itself, even if it doesn't do it the way you want? ... For instance, the robot sees a house for the first time, and it just so happens this house is on fire; the robot then decides that burning is the proper state for all houses and, as such, it goes about setting all the houses it encounters on fire.


This may be a bad example, but if I ask my neighbor to go and grab a shovel, I expect him to disappear for a few minutes and return with a shovel. I don't really care how he goes about getting the tool, only that he returns with one A.) In usable condition and B.) In a few minutes. Otherwise, I couldn't care less -- if the shovel is broken and he shows up happy as a clam or doesn't return until the job is already complete, there's going to be some 'splaining to do.

Same thing. Except, you know, he's not a 30 foot tall robot.

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Wysardry    244
Quote:
Original post by HappyHitman
can anyone say "Black and White"?

This 30 foot robot could not unless you taught it first. [grin]

Anyway, back to the original question. I would prefer a teaching system similar to that in "Creatures", where you use some sort of aid to teach it language first (it was a computer in the first game), and then use commands and a hand-shaped pointer to teach it about the world.

The words "yes" and "no" could be used as positive or negative reinforcement, or you could use a more "hands on" approach by tickling or slapping your pupil.

New creatures could learn language and behaviour from older/smarter ones, but if you didn't keep an eye on them the latter would also become more like the former, and revert to their own language/behaviour.

They also had a nasty habit of dying if you left the computer unattended overnight.

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