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Jiia

Old-School RPG walls

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I'm still being indecisive here. I'm not sure if it's good enough to simply cut the walls out. All of the old-school games did have that ceiling top thingo all around the areas, but it was unrealistic in the fact that you couldn't walk down there and no objects could ever happen to rest there. I think it's fine to cut the wall out and model the inside from that perspective only, but does it look funny being able to see the roofing inside stuff, but not the floor or walls? Probably hard to grasp my question. Here's some more snaps:

Free Image Hosting at www.ImageShack.usFree Image Hosting at www.ImageShack.us

It's much more visible and open. I really like the change, but can you see what I mean about the ceiling peices and the walls and floor not having those? Should I add some to them, or remove the tops, or just leave it be?

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It still works well with WASD or arrow-key movement, but then you only have 2 fixed speeds (by holding shift to run).


WTF, why? why is haveing multple speeds important? You already said combat isn't real time...this isn't an action game...so why force players to both memorize and use an additional key to make their character run?...why not just find some set movement speed and stick with it?

Check out the old 2D PC RPG Septerra Core for how agrivateing such a run "feature" is...players quickly discover that running gets them there faster, so they fight with the interface makeing the characters run everywhere, which pretty much made the walking speed useless and seldom used...its one of the biggest gripes players have with this particular game.

Yeah its cool, "realistic", and all that makeing the character creep around then speeding them up to a full run and back again...it can add some depth to action games...but for an "old school" type RPG you are wasteing codeing and animation time on a feature that will likely be more agrivateing to players then its worth....and don't even buy into the cop-out that players could just use thier caps lock key to make the character run all the time...that forces players to bend to your UI, when your UI should bend to your players wishes...

Besides if simply walking or tip toeing the character around offers little to no gameplay value (and that means players must use such a feature about 30% of the time playing inorder to complete the game) then its a completely useless feature.

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Original post by MSW
WTF, why? why is haveing multple speeds important? You already said combat isn't real time...this isn't an action game...so why force players to both memorize and use an additional key to make their character run?...why not just find some set movement speed and stick with it?

It's not that important. It's just really cool. I didn't say it's not an action game. It's extremely action-oriented. Real-time combat. Running presents an entirely new arsenal of combat attacks and maneuvers. I have to ask what you mean about memorizing a shift key, though. I don't follow. You obviously have something against running :P

Quote:
Check out the old 2D PC RPG Septerra Core for how agrivateing such a run "feature" is...players quickly discover that running gets them there faster, so they fight with the interface makeing the characters run everywhere, which pretty much made the walking speed useless and seldom used...its one of the biggest gripes players have with this particular game.



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Yeah its cool, "realistic", and all that makeing the character creep around then speeding them up to a full run and back again...it can add some depth to action games...but for an "old school" type RPG you are wasteing codeing and animation time on a feature that will likely be more agrivateing to players then its worth....and don't even buy into the cop-out that players could just use thier caps lock key to make the character run all the time...that forces players to bend to your UI, when your UI should bend to your players wishes...

My in-door view is just similar to old-school RPGs. I didn't say I was making one. If you have this much rage to dish against keyboard running controls, go out and buy a cheap analog controller. It'll make your day.

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Besides if simply walking or tip toeing the character around offers little to no gameplay value (and that means players must use such a feature about 30% of the time playing inorder to complete the game) then its a completely useless feature.

They have many uses. Walking is important for staying inconspicuous. Sneaking is obviously useful. And running gets you there faster. It also uses up stamina while in battle.

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Hmmm. I have been having the exact same problem, although my game is barely in the conceptual stage. I was playing around with maya, and I did some toggling with the FOV. No screenies, since it's late and I'm lazy, but I found that working with a 30-40 degree field of view mimics the Diablo II style. I'm still trying to find a way to work this into an RPG in an effective manner, but I've realized that the control system will probably make more of a difference.

Have you tried a target-relative control system? E.g, the player targets a character, object, or point and the control system shifts to accomodate the target? Essentially, the W and S keys move the player closer and farther from the target, and the A and D keys strafe along a line or shallow curve perpendicular to the character's line of sight. If the player selects something behind them, or something that would cause the strafing and/or movement keys to be backwards, the camera can rotate to keep objects in a rational view. It must sound like gibberish here, but it's the best I can do until I put a bit more into my engine.

EDIT: Of course, this entire conundrum disappears when dealing with an controller based system instead of a keyboard based one.

EDIT2: I'm also thinking of a system where the mouse is used to direct movement and the keyboard keys can be used to alter said movement - Diablo II with strafing. Blurry explanation I know, but it might be worth a try, as far as mimicking old school RPG's is concerned.

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Original post by Jiia
I'm still being indecisive here. I'm not sure if it's good enough to simply cut the walls out. All of the old-school games did have that ceiling top thingo all around the areas, but it was unrealistic in the fact that you couldn't walk down there and no objects could ever happen to rest there. I think it's fine to cut the wall out and model the inside from that perspective only, but does it look funny being able to see the roofing inside stuff, but not the floor or walls? Probably hard to grasp my question. Here's some more snaps:

It's much more visible and open. I really like the change, but can you see what I mean about the ceiling peices and the walls and floor not having those? Should I add some to them, or remove the tops, or just leave it be?


I don't get your first question, but I like the new screenies better.

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I think this will explain it:



Here's a snap from Final Fantasy VI:



Here's a snap from one of my own games :)

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It doesn't look right to me, but I'm looking for suggestions on how to fix it. I don't know if I should ditch it all, add the floor and walls, or add them but make all of it really small?

I guess maybe my questions are becoming less related to this forum.

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Original post by Jiia
It doesn't look right to me, but I'm looking for suggestions on how to fix it. I don't know if I should ditch it all, add the floor and walls, or add them but make all of it really small?


You could use boxes for floor and walls. Leaving a bit of the wall isn't a bad idea either. I would experiment in a 3d modeller to see what looks right, if I was you.

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