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kingpinzs

need RTS tutorials

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Stan100    100
Always check the articles section of Gamedev, they have tutorials on everything. As for your question, I guess you meant just beginner tutorials.

The only tutorial I could think of would be maybe for the math. Or do you want one based on using directX? There are books like that. How much directX do you know?

Other than that it's just having/making an engine, and working the code. Math is the other half.

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kingpinzs    117
Well I have a tile engine some what using directdraw. I am just trying to figure out the struct of the whole game and how it would go together. I have the only 3 books that I could find on the subject. So tuts I need are for beginers and intermidet and need to be on more game structure then gfx or sound.

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Sneftel    1788
To be honest, if you're looking for a tutorial, you're probably not ready to make an RTS.

Tutorials are great for getting the hang of small pieces of functionality; learning to initialize an OpenGL window, for instance, or doing A* pathfinding. But at the level of complexity of an RTS (or any significantly complex application) there's really no way to encapsulate the entire set of steps into a tutorial that is still general enough to be helpful. The only possible tutorial would be "type all this code in and compile it and then you have Warcraft", which is of course not especially useful for making your OWN game. You need to learn how to come up with a program structure for any arbitrary development task, not for a specific one (which is what a tutorial will give you).

If you aren't yet familiar with object-oriented design (notice I didn't say object oriented programming), you should spend some time learning it. Also implement some smaller projects, without relying on tutorials.

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Drew_Benton    1861
Quote:
Original post by kingpinzs
I am just trying to figure out the struct of the whole game and how it would go together. I have the only 3 books that I could find on the subject.


That makes two of us [wink]. Strategy Game Programming with DX 9, Real Time Strategy Game Programming Using DX 6, and Isometric Game Programming with DX7 right? There really isn't any avaliable tutorials that I have been able to find on this subject. It's more of a topic that you just have to mess around with and find what suits your needs. You can though, take a look at an open source RTS, Machinations.

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kingpinzs    117
In the process of making a rts what types of small programs would you recommended? Something that I could use inside an rts. I just cant think of any smaller games that would work.

Thanks for the suggestions so far

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kingpinzs    117
Quote:
Original post by Drew_Benton
Quote:
Original post by kingpinzs
I am just trying to figure out the struct of the whole game and how it would go together. I have the only 3 books that I could find on the subject.


That makes two of us [wink]. Strategy Game Programming with DX 9, Real Time Strategy Game Programming Using DX 6, and Isometric Game Programming with DX7 right? There really isn't any avaliable tutorials that I have been able to find on this subject. Machinations.



exactley the 3 books I have on the subject. so how far are you on your project mabey you could lead me in the right direction. I have c some what down i know structs and stuff just dont know classes. I got directx more or less down to. just the structure is what I need to work on and my problem solving skills in programing also. because what seam logical is not always logical.


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Drew_Benton    1861
Quote:
Original post by Oberon_Command
If only Blizzard would release the source code to Warcraft, or better yet StarCraft. [sad]


Oh that would be icing on the cake [smile].

Quote:
Original post by kingpinzs
exactley the 3 books I have on the subject. so how far are you on your project mabey you could lead me in the right direction. I have c some what down i know structs and stuff just dont know classes. I got directx more or less down to. just the structure is what I need to work on and my problem solving skills in programing also. because what seam logical is not always logical.


Well I have not yet started my RTS project because I'm working on some base code first with SDL and OpenGL. The best thing that I can reccomend is to do as Oberon_Command has suggested and put all the pieces together.

I worked on some RTS stuff a while back, but kinda stopped because I didn't have enough resources to go on. Now though, after playing RTS for a while, I think I have some ideas of how to do things now.

There used to actually be one site that used to have RTS tutorials in DX, it's long since have been gone, but I know I have it archive somewhere. I'll be looking for them and will PM you if I can find them.

For starting though, I would try and just make various pieces seperately, then tie them in later. As to where to start, I say graphics. Go for the sprite system and maps/terrain. Just getting it to all display first is a good acomplishment. I actually used the stuff from StarCraft to do my stuff, and I will use it again for my test media. After you get the simple graphics down, try and hack together a way for interaction with the media.

For example, if the user clicks on a unit, then have the unit selection box show on the unit. Then you can make it so if they right click somewhere, you move the unit to that spot, as in you just have it now drawn there. You can add in the movement later, since getting this simple stuff done first is the best way to approach it. After that, you just start adding things in piece by piece, then end up with something rather hackish, but works! Then is when you gotta go back and tie everything in and make it so it's more game like design wise. It's not an easy task and takes lots of time, but it's definity do-able.

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kingpinzs    117
Quote:
Original post by Oberon_Command


BTW Maybe you could try looking up pieces of the puzzle, like pathfinding and stuff and then put it all together.



well I would but I cant find the ones I need. I made a desighn doc for my whole project and decided to break it up into units and just work on the units by them selfs and then put together in the end and make a game. Like I did the mp3 playing section thr avi playing section the menus and splash screens. then I did the isometric engine ( almost done) right now I am trying to figure out the unit system but that is were I am stuck and cant find tuts that expalin anything of this nature


looks like Drew_Benton was thinking the same thing.

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Drew_Benton    1861
Quote:
Original post by kingpinzs
right now I am trying to figure out the unit system but that is were I am stuck and cant find tuts that expalin anything of this nature


Unit systems are fairly complicated, but Sneftel is really right with the OOP talk, that's the main driving force I'd say behind a unit system, lots of OOP. For an idea though, think about this:

You have some base class that is the CUnitBase. It contains abstract functions to Draw, Render, Create, and Destroy. Now all of your units are derived from there. The key thing is that I'm sure you can figure out what to do for that, simply overload the members for each class and have that all done, but the problem comes with the overal messaging system.

That is something seperate in itself that you will have to design and implement. Basically you need a way to be able to communicate with your objects as well as allow your units to communicate with each other. So when you click on a unit, then tell it to 'move', a message is sent to that unit. When another unit attacks that unit, the unit being attacked must be able to receive the message that it's being damaned, then it should update itself according to its new heath and so on. Not an easy task at all, that will take some time to develop and is pretty much the whole bulk of an RTS game really - everything else is just using that messaging system to do what your game needs it to do. I'd focus on figuring out a good way to do all that right now. See what you can come up with [wink]

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jbadams    25713
Quote:
Original post by Drew_Benton
There used to actually be one site that used to have RTS tutorials in DX, it's long since have been gone, but I know I have it archive somewhere. I'll be looking for them and will PM you if I can find them.


I used to have an archived copy of (presumably) the same site, it walked through creating a few different units, having them walk around, selecting them, etc. It walked you through creating a very basic RTS, but the information in it was quite useful. I havn't been able to find my copy either, I believe it's on one of my older computers, but I'm not actually sure which.

If you don't mind, drop me a line as well if you manage to locate a copy.

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Calin    419
Hi!

First of all I want to say that I am a beginner too. Three months ago I wanted to do the same thing: make my own RTS. Because I new almoust nothing about programming I started with some NeHe lessons. I used different lessons for different parts of my RTS.
I still have a long way to go but I think I have overcome the most difficult part: understanding how a RTS works.
My oppinion is that you should go through this steps:
1. Make a moving camera in your world. (look for tutorials on this site).

2. Draw some objects in your world. You will need to have two types of objects. One type of objects will make your land and the other your units. In my case I use some squares to make the land. (Later you will be able to arrange your terrain squares to make a 3D landscape).

3. Find a way to select with your mouse all the objects you have made (terrain objects included). My game uses OpenGL so I carry out this task with OpenGL picking system.

4. Make a class for terrain objects and a class for unit objects.

5. Make your obects react when you select them (e.g.: they change their color , move foward three inches ,etc.). At the beginning you will want to include a "react" property only for your unit objects.

6. Make your units move towards a land square when that land square is selected. (Remember you should be able to select your land squares too.)
You can do this by designating left mouse button for unit selection and right mouse button for land square selection.

After that you may think of including a collision detection system, 3D terrain and other things ( This is the stage where I am right now).

[Edited by - Calin on June 29, 2005 3:34:46 PM]

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ostamo1    128

Quote:
Original post by Drew_Benton
There used to actually be one site that used to have RTS tutorials in DX, it's long since have been gone, but I know I have it archive somewhere. I'll be looking for them and will PM you if I can find them.


what was the name of that site??? and if you could send them to me also
i would really appresiate that




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jbadams    25713
For anyone still following this thread, you may want to check out this, it looks like it has some potentially suitable book recommendations if you're willing to shell out some cash.

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Drew_Benton    1861
Quote:
Original post by Kazgoroth
For anyone still following this thread, you may want to check out this, it looks like it has some potentially suitable book recommendations if you're willing to shell out some cash.


Gah! Most of the good stuff are in those GPG books that I *don't* have [lol]. Oh well, thanks for sharing Jason. I need to get that series of AI programming wisdom, I have GPG 1,3, and 5 right now.

Quote:
Original post by ostamo1

Quote:
Original post by Drew_Benton
There used to actually be one site that used to have RTS tutorials in DX, it's long since have been gone, but I know I have it archive somewhere. I'll be looking for them and will PM you if I can find them.


what was the name of that site??? and if you could send them to me also
i would really appresiate that


I can't even remember the name of the site, otherwise I'd check wayback machine [wink]. I will start looking soon for them and tell you guys on this thread if I do find them, they are really awesome. It's just I have like over 200 backup cds and going though them takes some time [wink].

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