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khosh

isometric land & 3d engines

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should we only in 2d view make isometric games???? or we can make it in a 3d engine and determine camera position in way that give a isometric scene?

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Either one is perfectly alright to use.

It just depends on the way you want to have your game displayed. Either way you will have to make the models for the various objects. Using a 3D engine would probably be better if you plan to have your camera rotate at any point as it is much easier to orient the objects. Seeing as it will be isometric, rotation may not even be necessary.

In the end, it all depends on which you are most familiar and comfortable with.

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tanks for your help

i think 2d have many difficulty.
in 3d number of object is too much. isn't it increase problems?

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3D accelerators have much of power in these days, so rendering bunch of objects is fast as hell. If you look at my web page, there are several old screenshoot. Engine is rendering combined 2D/3D scene. Map is 40x26 tile visible, each tile is made of 50 triangles, on each tile there are objects, trees, enemies, players, effects, shadows etc... and every object is made of at least two triangle. So I have LOT of things drawn and still have around 100FPS on my friend machine (XP1700+, ATI 7500 which is not beast of PC [smile]) and on mine it runs around 200-250FPS.

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I talked to a guy who helped make dark or blitzbasic (i forgot) and hes working on his own lil thing that will easily let you make games and normal programs in a unique way. He didnt give me many details, just said he would release it on his site when its almost done. So im lookin forward to that, it looks promising.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Streamer, what happened to your game? Seemed like it would be a good one :)

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The whole project still lives [smile]
I was just too lazy to update web-page.
I got some minor problems with TCP/IP, alpha is 90% done.
When game get to some stable version, I'll put it on a download page.
Until then be patient.[smile]

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Just compiled version [smile] and no this is not sacred [smile] but I'm deffinitly influented by that game. I like clear and happy graphic.

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Quote:
Original post by streamer
Map is 40x26 tile visible, each tile is made of 50 triangles,


Question, why are your tiles made of 50!! triangles!? I looked at your screenshot you posted, and the tiles look fairly flat, so,... couldn't you do it with just 2?

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Quote:
Original post by Talroth
Quote:
Original post by streamer
Map is 40x26 tile visible, each tile is made of 50 triangles,


Question, why are your tiles made of 50!! triangles!? I looked at your screenshot you posted, and the tiles look fairly flat, so,... couldn't you do it with just 2?


Because on map there are height maps is, and hills with 2 triangles are really ugly (screenshot is without height map). Also light map is much more precisse with more vertices.
Anyway if I used 2 or 50 triangles, I had a same speed.

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Except, that it will take longer to load 50 tris per tiles and take more memory. Just because you can away with it doesn't mean it is a good idea. Especially, just for slightly better lighting.

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Quote:
Original post by Stru
Except, that it will take longer to load 50 tris per tiles and take more memory. Just because you can away with it doesn't mean it is a good idea. Especially, just for slightly better lighting.


I'm not loading tris, I'm creating them in real-time. By the way, I have an old PC: Pentium II with 192 MB memory and integrated Intel graphic card (8MB). Game runs on 30 fps, the minimum I needed. And 2 or 50 triangles, it is not big deal. I have same speed . but imagine hills with 2 triangles. It is not hill, it is pyramid. With 50 triangles I have nice slopes, hills, and much more things that can be done with free imagination.

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And by the way VertexNormal gived me a hint to use more triangles ;). My original engine used two triangle per tile.
And he was right, it is not big deal, modern cards are beasts that do millions of triangles per sec.

Thanx again VertexNormal!

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Quote:
Original post by Stru
Except, that it will take longer to load 50 tris per tiles and take more memory. Just because you can away with it doesn't mean it is a good idea. Especially, just for slightly better lighting.


Meh. 'Slightly better' isn't really descriptive of the difference a higher-resolution mesh gives over 2 tris per tile. The difference can be quite profound. The increase in load times is negligible, the increase in memory usage is easily manageable and not a factor at all if you are developing on the PC platform or modern consoles. Seriously, I don't mean to extoll the virtues of flagrant wasting of memory and resources, but modern PCs are seriously high-powered machines in some respects, and it is your responsibility to use those resources to provide the best gaming experience you possibly can. If that means increasing memory usage slightly (and still well within the capabilities of the machine) in order to increase the quality and smoothness of the lighting, then refusing to do so out of some probably misguided attempt at 'memory optimization' or some equally contrived excuse is only going to result in yet another game where somebody says 'Eh, it's okay. The lighting and graphics are kinda crude, though."

Of course, tile sizes are relative, and you should choose the mesh resolution of your tiles accordingly, so it is really incorrect to say that a tile should be only 2 tris, or a tile should be 50 tris. In reality, a tile should be as many tris as you require to achieve the best effect you possibly can. If tiles are tiny, and many of them are displayed onscreen at once, 50 tris may be overkill. If they are very large, and only a handful are ever displayed at once, then 2 tris is most definitely not sufficient.

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You make some good points... and I didn't mean to make any broad generalizations like always use 2 tris per tile. I just think the screenshot he posted certainly doesn't need 50 tris per tile, and the performance certainly seems to be taking a hit. It certainly isn't showing any visual benefits of hills/lighting effects.

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